Your marital issues weren't the problem. Her poor boundaries were the problem. Believe me, soul, I've been buzzed up on alcohol more times than I need to mention. But I NEVER decided to have an A when I was drunk. It would never have occurred to me to be unfaithful, and I have been in a position to have that happen. It's about the boundaries.

Unfortunately, it's difficult to work on healthy boundaries with something like alcoholism (am I the only one who stumbles over typing that? ) clouding the process. That needs to be addressed. She needs to stop drinking. Then you can work on healing your M.

In the meantime, read the articles on this site. They will give you a world of knowledge.

I agree alcoholism is a disease and she is well aware of if as of dealing with it with her mother so she understands how severe it is

She has not for a second refused treatment and on her own has been searching and scheduling appointments with counselors this week as well as reading books. She has seen what it can do and is not using it as an excuse.

She is using it more as a admittance to her problems, its making her see that she thought she was in control all the time but she really wasn't.

We both know that even though she doesnt always resort to drinking its the issues she has when she drinks that is making her an alcoholic , we dont understand alcoholism fully but we know enough to realize she has a problem with it in whatever capacity


I just feel like the person I knew for the past 4+ years is not the person who made this bad mistake that one night when her judgment is impaired so liek I said I dont feel I am being naive more understanding of reality and her problem

It wasn't one bad mistake one night when she was impaired. It was several things she might not even view as mistakes like going out and drinking without you, talking/flirting with other guys, etc. This was NOT a one night stand. She saw a guy she was attracted to, started talking/flirting with him, overconsumed, went back to the bar and got drunk in the presence of the OM she knew she was attracted to, and then followed through on her desires. She just felt guilty about it the next day.

In my opinion, the alcoholism and the infidelity are TWO SEPARATE ISSUES. Take away the alcohol, and you still have your WW meeting up an OM several times through mutual friends, knowing she's attracted to him, deciding to talk/flirt with him, etc. Take away the alcohol, and although she might not have slept with him the second night, after many different times of hanging out with him through mutual acquaintances, you probably would have had the same result, only worse, she'd probably be in love with him instead of you. Your WW's problem in addition to alcohol, is her lack of marital boundaries. She needs to understand that alcohol was not the ONLY reason she cheated, and that you need to develop new boundaries to safeguard your marriage from infidelity in the future. We all don't think it will happen to us, it was just the alcohol, etc. However, if you don't want this to happen in the future, your WW needs to agree to some more stringent rules and boundaries, so there is ZERO chance of this happening again. She needs to work with you on the MB program and agree and abide by those boundaries, otherwise, kick her to the curb.

I would say then the boundaries are probably somewhat my fault, our marriage I thought always worked since I liked me alone time and so did she. She would let me go do things all the time since I have allot of hobbies with my friends and even be around women without even thinking since she trusted me and I trusted her.

She likes to go out sometimes and I am not big on it so I would let her go out with her friends (she didn't do it often) since I trusted her. I was friends with girls and she had some guy friends since we both trusted each other it was not an issue

I know it will be a long road and there will have to be stringent rules to help us succeed. So maybe part of our success also is setting bigger boundaries on each other to help gain trust

When I find myself thinking something like that, I recognize that something is wrong.

I don't size up people I'm not married to for sexual desirability. Nor do I go on dates with them, or flirt with them, or allow them to meet my intimate emotional needs. Nor do I meet theirs.

Well not everyone is the same...some people are more sexual then others and I do not feel lookign at another person and being physically attracted to them is that bad and if you maintain your boundaries you wont cheat

I really would find it hard to beleive that there is no one out there who looks at another person and say they are not attracted to anyone else physically since I love my wife or husband

We are all wired to cheat. It all depends on how strong our marriage is. I recognize that the girl behind the juice bar at the gym is cute, but I do not flirt, ask for numbers, or do anything that may harm my marriage. These are boundaries that I set for myself. It would be nice if my spouse had those same boundaries and they were as strong as mine. Due to our weak marriage, and her weak boundaries I am here now.

It looks like you have a weak marriage, like mine, and your spouse has no boundaries, like mine. Magnify that with alcohol and here we are!

Markos has trained himself not to dwell on things that might draw him to having an affair, and that is a very strong boundary. I don't flirt or take numbers, I do the double take though. Anything beyond that to me leads to cheating. Your wife committed adultery, there is no excuse, and no turning back. She had her 1st(?) taste, and it is likely that she will do it again. Be careful trying to make excuses for her, you will be kicking yourself later.

I know it comes down to boundaries, I myself have created them and have stuck to them. I know working on our marriage making it stronger may help these boundaries, I really honestly do not feel like this is normal for her.

We do spend allot of time together and are very open, she doesn't flirt and we have not had any other issues in the past 4 years. I feel if we strengthen our marriage and the alcohol stops we can have a great marriage.

I am even considering renewing our vows to try and restart things

Soulcrushed, I may be one of the voices here that has a slightly different perspective on alcoholism and alcoholics.

For one, I am a recovered alcoholic, with nearly 19 years of sobriety. I value my sobriety above everything else -- including my marriage.

Ah yes, my marriage.

I married a woman who I met in the rooms of A.A. I first spoke with her on her first sober anniversary. We were married a few months after her third sober anniversary.

She committed adultery and left the marriage in October of last year, after nearly nine years of not drinking.

In an effort to understand events better (I'm being as brief as possible; you can read my story here if you want more), I learned that alcoholism is not the cause of everyone's problems, but is most often the result of them. In my wife's case, substance abuse, irresponsible behavior, lack of boundaries, sexual infidelity and more are caused by her having a personality defect, known by psychiatrists as Borderline Personality Disorder (there is talk of modifying this nomenclature in the upcoming DSM-V to "Emotional Regulation Disorder"). It is a "learned" condition, as opposed to one with a biological/physiological cause. Most (about 75%) BPDs are women who grew up in unstable families where there was no father figure, or a lack of supportive parenting existed. Frequently there is evidence of sexual abuse.

The treatment of BPD is extremely difficult. Many professional therapists avoid doing so, as the toll it takes is enormous -- and that's coming from the professional community. Think of what it does to us who aren't even aware such conditions exist?

That said, I am not diagnosing your wife. I am not qualified to do so, and said diagnosis is nearly as difficult as the treatment. What I am suggesting is that you take a long, hard look at your wife, her past and upbringing, and put everything into perspective. It might help you to read about Cluster B personality disorders to get more info.

There is much to be concerned about, and you should have full knowledge of the situation you have been handed.

Good luck, and God bless.

I am very sexual. I did not say I was never attracted to anyone. I just know that thoughts like "Oooh, it'd be fun to sleep with her" are absolutely unacceptable and not the way to live my life. I don't understand why everyone doesn't know this, to be honest.


Cool, how are your opinions working for you?

Do you recognize any distinction between feeling a moment of attraction to someone ... and permitting yourself to continue to experience and dwell on and enjoy the attraction? Or does the fact that I don't permit myself to enjoy attraction to people I am not married to mean, in your mind, that I must be "less sexual"?

You are fooling yourself.
Markos is very, very sexual. Trust me, I know. Yet he has trained himself to never dwell on thinking about how great it would be to have sex with another woman.

Me, on the other hand, I'm not as sexual. I can take it or leave it. But, when things got tough in our marriage, I allowed my eyes to wander and thought about other men. I am the one who has been severely tempted to cheat, and it has nothing to do with how strong my sex drive is.

When you allow yourself the luxury of "just looking," you open the door for infidelity.

I recommend you make this one of those "stringent rules."

I am in no way condoning its right to act on it, of course that is the difference of being faithful and not

just staing everyone thinks these thoughts so to get mad at someone for being physically attracted to someone is not right

I ask again, do you recognize any distinction between feeling a moment of attraction to someone, and allowing yourself to continue to experience that attraction?

SC,

Keeping it simple is best!

Either she agrees to go to AA and get/stay sober, or end the marriage.

There is no in between!!!!!

Read what Dr. Harley has to say in this link.

Continue to the next few letters after that.

LINK

There is nothing to save.

WW is young and will most likely be a drunk for the next twentys years, having many OM, maybe getting knocked up by some of them.

Sometime in her 40's or 50's WW may, as in maybe, not will wake up join AA and stay sober.

You will have gained heart ache, possible STD's, and get to raise and spend your money on the OM's off spring.

Hi soulcrushed...


Name is Tom, and I am new here also...won't give you my history now, but I do come on here ocasionally and read some stories just because it gives me some help and has helped me start to get to Recovery with my wife. I read your situation I guess because you are in first year of marrriage. My marriagae is quite abit longer.

That being said, like Fred I am a recovering alcoholic. 18 years sobriety until recently, and now back in recovery again.

I have to agree strongly with Fred, tst, and a few others. Your major concern right now is that your wife is, in all probability, an alcoholic, or at least in the early stages. Your debate about "ocasional physical attraction" should be the Least of your concerns. If she is driving home that drunk, and you are allowing it, that is a concern of mine now from standpoint that I did that. Chances are there are more than just a couple of times that she has done that, and chances are that her car wreck was also alcohol-related.

Part of the reason she is acting like she is is that alcohol use impairs normal judgement. Period!

Instead of finding out some morning that she has slept with another guy, are you going to wait until the police have to inform you some late night that she was involved in another accident on her way home, and that she or someone else was seriously injured or even killed??

Some here may disagree with me, but before you do anything else you need to get family members to sit with you while you confront her about her drinking ASAP. That is called intervention. If you need advice and help, contact your local chapter of Alanon. I am sure there is one in your area. Even attend an AA meeting yourself and consult with an older AA member there to get some suggestions. She needs help with this like NOW, and if you do not take action NOW you will be enabling not only any affair, but also the progression of her disease, and maybe some more serious consequences. Her response to your intervention will serve as a guide for you on what to do about your marriage, more than her response to you about any affair.

Good luck, and Peace,

Tom

First, go back and read how many of your posts make excuses for her behavior.

All of them.

All of them!!!

This is a gauge for how much you will tolerate and how long you will tolerate her drinking and her cheating.

You have a high tolerance for ENABLING!

This line from one of your posts jumped out at me:

She has no business trying to fix the marriage right now. It is she who is broken.

And it is YOU who are broken too. Because you show a willingness to excuse and tolerate it. She married the perfect enabler for her to become a full fledged alcoholic.

See - non-qualified spouses for alcoholics have a very low tolerance of that elephant pooping in the living room. They take one look at someone who is willing to drink and drive, putting themselves and others at risk as well as property.

You tolerated it. You enabled it. Now you're looking at broken marriage vows too because you tolerated it.

STOP EXCUSING IT!

Stop making excuses for her drinking.

Fix that part of you that turns a blind eye to inexcusable behavior.

Get to an Al Anon program right now because until you admit that you are powerless over alcoholics and your life has become unmanageable you will continue to hurt.

And then you'll bring children into the mix.

Don't get me started on the HELL life can be with an alcoholic parent and an enabling parent!!!!

Been there - years of therapy to recover any sense of self.

Please don't inflict that on a child!

And don't let me read ONE MORE EXCUSE out of you!

It's not acceptable.

The sooner you figure that out, the more likely she is to stop drinking - if she wants to remain in a relationship with you. Which also means no more alcohol for you either! EVER!

It's a lifestyle change that is the only way to not just save your marriage but provide the only way for the two of you to have a happy and fulfilling marriage.

soulcrushed,

You have just received the best advice that you possibly could from KaylaAndy!

Forget for the moment about focusing on the affair part of this - focus your immediate attention on helping your wife begin to deal with her alcohol problem. You need to educate yourself quickley on alcholism. Best done thru AlAnon..

Just another thought. A number of active alcoholics today try to confine their drinking at home or where it is safe to due to the tougher consequences of DUI. However, you need to be aware of this. In addition to the moral and marital responsilibity to help your wife, there are also legal and financial consequences now. If a spouse or a family member knowingly and willingly allows someone to drive drunk or preseent the risk of driving drunk without taking precautions (especially in your case after knowing she has done this several times now), that person can be held legally and financially responsible in the event of a tragedy. Look up the case of the NY state woman who drove the wrong way on a freeway and killed herself and several people a year or so ago. That case was well-covered by the media. The authorities investigated the husband to determine if he had prior knowledge and allowed his wife drive. I have seen similar situations in my local news. Point being, you need to protect yourself, as well as your wife and others.

Tom

Alcoholism is not an excuse for infidelity. Refusing to get treatment for alcoholism is her main problem. It must be treated.

If she will not get treatment at least get some for yourself. Alanon is a great help for the family of alcoholics.