I have a tendency to do that until I get it figured out, then my mission becomes making it simple.

I am still waiting to see if some guys will address this issue.

See, men and women are not wired the same. Men try to figure out their girlfriends and wives logically, kinda like how a car works. Women talk to their cars. Men do too, but not in the same way.

Historical honesty is way easy for women to understand. Not so with men. It is the way we are wired. I dunno know how most men think, but I do know how some think. From hashing out this issue in the past with guys, most have allowed as how all they wanted to know was if she was a "good" woman or liked to pull a train with the football team. A few guys had other ideas that were mostly kinky.

Larry

Historical honesty is way easy for women to understand. Not so with men. It is the way we are wired.

what else is there to talk about in order to get to know each other?

Of course we dated for 5 years prior to getting married, so that was a long time to be able to tell all I guess - but I can't imagine deciding to marry someone any other way???

Whoa. It isn't that important, is it? It can wait until he has time. I would be interested in what MrW thinks AND what he has heard from other guys.

Larry

Why is it hard for men to understand? Are they "wired" to be dishonest?........

Of course not. They also don't talk to cars and copy machines.

This makes NO SENSE to me...... But then again, I am woman ( now hear me roar!!!!!...... )

But seriously, your argument for men being "wired" different when it comes to RH seem a bit feeble........ You're gonna have to do better than this......

Does that make better sense?

What I do find interesting though, is that you keep arguing about men and women being wired differently and that is why you fail to understand the concept, yet the whole concept of RH was thought of by a MAN, Dr. H........

Well, that's fine. You can decide that a man who asks these questions on a first date is not someone you wish to see again. However, if he indicates, by asking, that he wants to know whether you have ever been sexual abused before he dates YOU a second time, then you must either tell him or not date him a second time.

What you must not do is plead the fifth and date him to the point where he feels serious about you, and THEN tell him. You should not attempt to decide for him what is important for him to know about someone he dates.

Oh, and a good one just cropped up already. We have a thread here where a wayward husband is throwing up his wife's past as justification for his adultery. Not in those terms. Instead, he says if he had known about xyz before he got married, he wouldn't have married her.

But wait a minute, there is more here than meets the eye. MALES are culturally directed to cat around. But they want a mate who hasn't had all that much experience. FEMALES in many cultural settings are taught to HIDE their experiences or gloss over them.

How do you handle those basic instincts? Think a bit before you answer.

Larry

Mel, you mentioned a security clearance in the other thread from which this one leaped. I thought about that this morning. I had one of those. The FBI went all the way back to Grade School and past that to every place I had ever lived and interviewed neighbors. That was when I was 18 years old. They still allowed six months for the clearance because even in those days, people moved around a lot.

I am addressing this to everyone, not just to Mel."

Before I ran my mouth in that other thread, I had read, carefully, again, Dr. Harley's concepts on the subject and I had browsed through the questionnaire. In other words, I processed it through the [u]mental filter of "What ifs." If I were involved in a coaching series with Dr. Harley, I would have the ability to ask for clarification. And I am sure he would give it. But he doesn't do coaching anymore, to the best of my knowledge and I am not a client if he were still in practice, so I am clueless how to deal with the "What ifs" in this radical departure from standard technique. And I have no fear of "Radical" departure since that is what he does.

Now I believe I understand MB basic concepts and even more, have done research to validate some of them to provide better understanding. For example, I have delved into the science behind infatuation and the science behind other types of affection. I have also discussed some of Dr. Harley's methodology as it relates to textbook psychology. I have 36 college hours of psych including graduate courses and a close friend who has his Masters, with whom I discuss various of MB concepts. So I can handle it when the discussion gets technical.

The study of human nature has been one of my fascinations all of my life. And as some of you know, that is a long life indeed. I study, think and explore constantly for my own knowledge. And as a preventative against some of aging's more unpleasant mental disorders.

I have discovered some stuff along the way. For example, Dr. Harley formulated his basic concepts before much was known about the chemical basis for infatuation. Yet the structure of HNHN and the methodology behind his recommended practice mimics very closely those things that people do naturally, guided by instinct, when they're infatuated. Without any scientific study on the subject, I concluded as a hypothesis that MB concepts helped keep a sustainability level of PEA active.

With my very own eyes, I have seen folks blow past one or more MB concepts because they either didn't understand it, it was too complex, or it wasn't complex enough. And that was the sincere ones. Others blew past something because it made the uncomfortable. I have also seen people challenged when they blow past one of the basics. Heck, I do it.

With that as a background just to let you know I wasn't being flippant with my comment or questions, here it is:

In the interest of understanding as much as I was capable, I looked at historical honesty and came up with a dozen or more questions that I have not been able to resolve. I will share some of them with all of you for the purpose of getting your opinions and clarification.

1. How much of any single event do you detail? I was in the military for three years and single. I was also at the beginning of the "Sexual revolution." Depending on age, some men and women have a lot to remember. I can see that.

2. What if you can't remember? Males are afflicted with poorer memory in this area than are women. How accountable should someone be for their memories? For example, I had forgotten that "Adventure" I detailed in the other thread and most of the details until I was thinking on the subject of historical honesty last night and that on popped out.

3. If there is something you did that was embarrassing, should you not also go into detail of why you think it was the wrong thing to do and what you have done to process the guilt? Dr. Harley delves into this, but not in detail.

4. How do you deal with a potential partner's filters in a premarital setting, or how do you deal with those filters in a marital setting post fact of marriage? For example, I have often told the story of a couple sitting on a beach taking in some son and watching people. A vibrant and very good looking teenage female bounces by. Wife says with a sigh and a body that has earned the ravages of childbirth, "I will never look that good again." Husband says, "Neither will she."

I know some women who would belt husband and storm off. I know others who would mentally promise him a serious reward later on in the privacy of their home. I already know the answer to this one, but I want to see what other people think.

5. Males have poor memories. Taking a hypothetical example of a couple who was fortunate enough to adopt MB concepts as their marriage mantra from the beginning, how do you deal with some never revealed detail that crops up with a friend of husband or wife mentions it as a war story? I forgot about that???

I have some other "What ifs" that can be drug out into the light of day if needed. Maybe some folks here have some that I didn't think of.

As a process of Surviving an Affair, you must fill out questionnaires. And one of those is your personal history. So this is a subject that needs discussing here on SAA, in my opinion. I will now shut up and wait for comments.

Larry

First of all, one doesn't have to "plead the fifth" to avoid a discussion one doesn't want to engage in. You can simply state that you find this topic too personal for a first date. There are many things that are not anyone else's business and it can even be considered rude to ask. A first date is often little more than a stranger. Some people may feel comfortable telling every detail of their lives to a near-stranger. Others (myself included) are not and keep very personal things to myself until I've developed some trust with the person. This difference alone could very well be the deciding factor as to the prospects of a second date.

This is a whole lot different than your spouse, or a person you are in a serious relationship with and considering marriage. At this point, if the topic hasn't come up you better bring it up.

What is MOST important is that you don't lie - to your spouse, a first date, to this board, to your hairdresser or your tax collection agency or anybody. Lying is what gets you into trouble.

Larry, if I didn't know any better, I would say a very foggy person wrote this post.

Historical Honesty

Reveal information about your personal
history, particularly events that
demonstrate personal weakness or failure.