AntiChick. You've had better success than I have. But I think you outlined your boundaries more clearly and stuck to them better than I did.

I have to disagree with this:

There are a whole lot more reasons:

5. He no longer finds his wife attractive

6. He finds himself unattractive. His self-confidence and self-esteem are so low, he cannot put doubts out of his mind and just enjoy the moment. He may believe he doesn't deserve to be loved.

7. His wife acts disinterested in SF, and and there is no fulfillment with an wife who is not in enthusiastic agreement.

8. His wife acts so disinterested in SF with him, that he suspects she is having an affair with someone else.

9. He is having an affair with someone else.

10. he has been turned down so many times, why bother to initiate anything romantic? This is an emotional shutdown.

11. he has made the conscious decision that, if his wife wants total control of sexual relations, she can take over 100% of initiation, too. At this point, he probably has set a deadline for her to get off the dime.

12. Obesity lowers sex drive.

13. Diabetes reduces sex drive (see #12)

14. Alzheimer's, MS, and other neuron disorders reduce sex drive.

15. Antidepressant drugs reduce sex drive.

16. Age reduces sex drive... in some men, it disappears almost completely after age 60.

17. Excessive masturbation, with or without pornography, reduces sex drive.

18. Work-related stress reduces sex drive.

19. Lack of sleep reduces sex drive.

I can testify to the effect of #18 and #19 lately. I have a healthy, normal sex drive in the morning, and if our schedules were synced we'd be all over it like white on rice, but at 9PM when she typically is ready for me to initiate, I'm so tired I'm ready to fall asleep and have little interest.

Get more than 8 hours of sleep a night, folks!

That's the truth about not getting enough sleep. If you fall into the bed every night and doze right off, you just missed a big number of opportunities to connect with your spouse, not just sexually, but in other intimacy, conversation, relaxation, etc.

Lack of sleep lowers sex drive in women too. Ask my husband how many times I've said, "Im too tired . . . . "



I'm more of a morning person myself when it comes to SF. Unfortunately, with kids who get up earlier than us, intimate time in the morning never happens anymore.

Lack of sleep lowers drive for sure but isn't insurmountable. If I'm feeling sleepy at bedtime and I think dh is up for it I make sure to initiate before getting into bed, before I'm getting to the point of falling asleep so that by the time I hit the pillow we're pretty much right in the middle and I don't want to stop.

I have a 2 year old who wakes a lot in the night and a 5 year old who gets up at 7am every morning. The other night my 2 year old was awake from midnight (just as dh arrived home from work) until 4am, and then we had to all get up at 7am because we had plans. I was the one up with the 2 year old, as always because dh had been working so I was shattered. I still stayed up the following night until midnight when he got home and was waiting in my new nightie to welcome him. Where there's a will theres a way despite obstacles.

RC,

My hat is off to you. My W wouldn't even consider that when our kids were that age. I'm not sure she would consider it now!

My mom always said, we do what is important to us. I have to think "ouch" when I remember that sometimes.

Very true. SF is not a very high priority for me now. However, I am also making conscious choices about it now, which is an improvement. Cause if I waited for my "feelings" to kick in we'd all be waiting a long time

Making a conscious choice means - even if SF isn't "important" to you, your H is, and THAT is a good and loving thing.:)

SF is important to you because it's important to your H.

THIS... perhaps more than ANYTHING is the BASIS of men's fantasies. We want what is important to US to be important to YOU!

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.I might have had the fantasy that my wife would show up at my work wearing a long coat, garter belt, and nothing else. But the FANTASY wouldn't have been about 'sex' in my office... it would have been that WOW!!! My wife REALLY CARES about me to do this WONDERFUL and DARING thing.

Yeah, progress, not perfection.

SF is not a priority NOW, but I WANT it to be. That means that certain things that are in the "top priority" slots will need to be sacrificed.

I can say all day until I'm blue in the face that SF is a priority. Better still . . .



My HUSBAND can say all day until he's blue in the face that SF is a priority TO HIM. And I will not believe it. Because his choices do not reflect that. If SF were a priority to him, he would do the things he KNOWS would actually RESULT in more SF.

For example. Shaving. He knows that this results in more SF. Both from experience and from the fact that I have as much TOLD him this. In fact, last night's rendevouz was in part because he had shaved in the morning and looked REALLY good to me last night, after we spend the whole evening watching a movie together on the couch instead of doing separate things in the same room. Last night was my PERFECT picture of married life. Kids in bed, spouses hanging out TOGETHER for a few hours, then SF. In fact, it was really late, and I was tired. 11 pm after being up since 5 am with no breaks or naps. And I INITIATED!!!!

He kows what he has to do for me to WANT him. He obviously doesn't really want SF that much because he RARELY does the things which he knows reult in ME wanting SF.

I suspect that right now, SF is a higher priority for ME than it is for HIM. In fact, I think in a world where I am the best version of myself, I am probably the higher-drive spouse.

Here you go the T -

One of the things a girlfriend in college would do was to sit me down on a chair. She would then take a bowl of hot water and a towel, get the towel wet and drape it over my face... all with 'sexy' music going in the background. I couldn't see her, but she would make little 'sounds' that she was enjoying my 'blindness'... kiss my cheek as she walked by, rub her breast against my shoulder as she reached unnecessarily across me for something, etc. She would then take my shaving cream (at that time I used the foam in a can) and sit on my lap, facing me. After lathering my face, she would take my razor and slowly and carefully shave me. It was some of the most intense and erotic sensations I ever had. She wouldn't let me touch her... she would just gently push my hands back down to the chair. But she was TOTALLY into it. She was kind, gentle, loving, and intense. When she was done, she would kiss me... and THAT was the signal that I could then touch and..........

If you want to make an impression on him AND help him to understand that shaving is important to you... I can guarantee that this will put things in his mind.

I used to NOT shave on Saturdays... HOPING that she would later that night. I was rewarded quite often.

I don't know where a 20 year old girl learned how to 'care' for a man like that, but she did and she did it well.

I just can't see myself doing that right now

What about it makes you uncomfortable?

cantfigureitout - I could handle shaving my H, but brushing his teeth for him is going a bit far.

Seriously, I wish someone would explain to me why some men refuse to do the simple things that have been outlined to them as things that will net them more SF.

Mine are pretty simple: shower, brush teeth, and wear a little of a particular cologne (I'm incredibly sensitive to smell)

My sister (who's more like a mom to me) when she was giving me "the talk" told me that men will do pretty much anything you tell them in order to get more SF, but you have to TELL THEM STRAIGHT OUT because they don't "get" hints. So I've told my H. He does it ok a time or two, and then nothing. :: headdesk ::

It would feel like roleplaying or acting. It would not come naturally. That's my first reaction.

Right on top of that, my second reaction is one of distaste at doing something that I really want him to do for himself. When I pick out his clothes I feel like his mother. But he knows what I like to see him wearing. So when he chooses to wear a button down shirt, kakhis, belt, dark socks and loafers, as opposed to death metal tshirt, baggy jeans, white socks and sneakers, well, that makes HUGE deposits in my love bank. Not just WHAT he's wearing, but that he dressed that way himself without me having to ask for it or suggest it. Because it shows he has pride in his appearance, and THAT is incredibly attractive to me.

Now, if the shaving thing were a game between the two of us, I can see where it would be incredibly fun and sensual for both of us. But I'm not in the state of intimacy yet. I'm not in love with him. I'm sure that when I AM in love with him, the shaving game will not make my stomach turn so much.

But if I can't do it with enthusiasm now, I won't. There are other things I can do with enthusiasm. Like compliment him on how much I like how short he's trimmed his gotee (and I'm not sure how to trim a gotee anyway). And give him lots of physical affection when he shaves the back of his hairline. He has HIG need for affection and admiration, so personally I think hitting those things actually does a lot for him too. Maybe not as much as a sensual shave did for you though. That was a steamy memory to share

Yeah, why is that? Because I *think* I have been pretty straightforward. Yes, I do sometimes beat around the bush., But he knows what I like.

I think the biggest turn-on for me is that someone takes pride in their own appearance. Not just because I have a high EN for "attractive spouse" I mean, I do appreciate when my spouse "dresses up" and keeps his hair trimmed specifically FOR ME (and most of the time, he makes it a pint to say that he is doing it for me, not for him, which is actually a bit of a LB). What I want is a husband who naturally takes care of themselves regardless of whether I request it, because it's the self-respect that is attractive to me. My husband is a bit overweight, and yes, I'd love if he would lose a bit of weight. But I don't think the eweight makes him unattractive. What makes him unattractive is his beating himself up about how fat he is (which he's NOT!). What makes him unattractive is the fact that he says in his "down" voice that he knows how dumpy he looks in the jeans and t shirts. Even in the jeans in tshirts, if it's tucked in and he has a smile on his face and his shoulders back, he is pretty atttractive to me. But slumped shoulders, huge turnoff.

If you learn anything about men, learn this! Tell us what you want!