My H is a Workaholic, but not a house "putzer". Garden hose- all over the drive- all summer. Tools everywhere, rusted.

NOTHING "dude stuff" is ever picked up - or put away.. I think this would drive most men crazy - not my H.

Until he wants something.

He "loaned" the wood tools to his nephew years ago. I always wishing that I had the miter saw or electic saw. I finally broke down and bought a RYOBI set- and now the batteries/pieces -- who knows??

Drives.me.nuts-- GIVE ME a good old "house putzer" any day of the year! You ladies with house putzing spouses quit !!! I mean it.

I mean it! I am a woman on the edge! If i could find my pruninig shears - lookout!

OH THANK GOD I am not the only one with one of these! Our neighbors on each side of us have the most well organized garages, with all of their tools in place and order. When they use them, imagine this - they put them back! WHOA! What a concept! LOL I do not think my H has ever coiled back up the hose before! I did it last weekend, and then he drug it back out 1 minute later to wash something off at the end of the driveway (so the whole length of the hose) and then just left it here. I said "I JUST rolled that up and it was quite the effort, so could you please put it back how you found it". It annoyed him, but he did it. I mean, sheesh! Our garbage/yard debri/recycle containers are always in the driveway, even though our CC&Rs say you have to put them away. I will put them away in the garage, then if I ask him to take the trash out and he goes to the front of the house and the can is not out, he gets upset that I put it away.

Sometimes men, it is nice to have a MAN around the house!

Oh, and Barbie - your shears are lost, mine are broken. He used them for something they were not intended for, broke them, then left them laying on the garage floor.

I have a putterer, but he leaves the tools all over the place... and NOT even at his last putter site!! I used to be amused that my Dad would get aggravated at my Mom's following him around while he worked on projects, cleaning up behind him and putting all his tools and sundries back in order where they belonged. I NOW UNDERSTAND MY MOTHER. (At least on this issue.)

I CANNOT FIND ANY OF MY TOOLS WHEN I NEED THEM!!! I spent more time last night trying to find a stud finder, a level, and the screwdriver set than I actually spent hanging my new lamp. One of them was actually where my H is hanging shelves (his latest project)... the other two were in odd places around the house, none were where they were supposed to be OR where he was working on anything with them.

It's getting so bad I'm threatening to buy my own tools, and my own toolbox, and LOCK THE SUCKER.

May I join the club ladies! My H is exactly like this....he leaves everything all over the place and gets so mad and accuses me of tossing the tool out in the garbage becacuse he can't find it!

I was mowing the lawn (at other old house) and nearly ran over a nails and large hammer in the high grass next to the fence...he was out there nailing the wooden piece down and just left the tools right there! He was done with the job so WHY would you leave these things in the grass??

Our garage is a pig sty and you can almost never locate what you need....I have a tiny tool box with some tools in it...it is hidden....H will ask me for my tool box in the past and I told him NO....cause you won't give me back my tools!

I think this must be put on my list of annoying habits.

LOL! I feel so much better! I HAD my own toolbox when we married that I had exactly what I needed for when I lived on my own. I have no idea where a single thing from that toolbox has disappeared to.

When I need help around the house, say because he has invited people over, he will head straight to the garage and "clean it", when he knows damn well that does nothing to help me IN the house. He will tell me he is helping, and pardon the DJ here, but he is full of it and I know he goes out there to avoid helping with chores that actually NEED to get done. LOL

lol ..... I thought my H only did this.

This is not good started laughing brought back memories. More djing in my head. Gotta get off of here for awhile.

Oh, on a more personal note, I was wondering if I could get some feedback before my appt this afternoon(in 3 hours or so).

This rollercoaster we have been on the past 2 years has left a sour taste in my best friend's mouth. She actually called him up one time and told him to be a better husband. Luckily, my husband agreed with her and was not upset, but I was a bit taken aback. The day before our wedding was only the 2nd time she had ever met him because at the time, she lived in another state. She took me aside, within ear shot of my H and got very stern with me and said "who are you and what have you done with my friend"? She thought I was acting weird and too "conforming". He ended saying something to me, as well, saying he thought I was acting immature and like a ditz around her. I was pretty torn. I felt like I was being me on both counts. I had not seen my best friend in over 6 months and I was giddy with excitement that she was here for the wedding and I felt I was just being a giddy girl, happy to be getting married. I did not feel I was conforming him, I was just... happy.

Anyway, she is worried about me and was the one that encouraged me to see a counselor. She told me she does not recognize me anymore. That my H has basically ruined me (because of the EA). I have lost who I am. Sometimes I agree. Then my other best friend tells me she thinks my other friend is nuts and that she sees me just being married, being in a partnership and working my butt off to make it work. That she thinks I am still "me", just busier.

So this is where I need help. In my mind when I think of what I will bring up in counseling today, this is one of them. That my best friend does not even recognize me anymore and that I try too hard to make my H happy and I do not get enough reciprocation.


Example: since I have met my H I have changed the way I dress to the way he likes, my hair, the amount of make up I wear, who I spend time with socially, where I go socially - um, basically I have given up any social life whatsoever. He used to put me down about how it is in my nature to be the center of attention and that I needed that social outlet to feel like a whole person (we own the Birthday Book and it gives each day of the year a personality description for the people born on those days). That I was too dependent upon a social life in order to feel ok. He actually put me down a LOT when we were dating, but that is a whole different post. It got to the point where sometimes I felt he put me in this little box, fitting perfectly to the way he wanted me to be so he would see me as good enough for him. He knows I have always felt this way. He is not like that near as much as he used to be, now that his insecurities have faded over the years (which interestingly enough, I gained insecurities I never knew I could even have over the years).

So again, I have changed my appearance, my friends, my social life, etc... all because it makes him happy.

When I ask him what he has changed to make me happy, he says that I knew who he was when we got married and that he should not have to change (again, this is from an old conversation, he might not even feel that way anymore, I really do not know).

So I feel I have done a lot of things to please him, because I want him to be happy. Then the EA and breaking my heart into a million pieces. I made all of these changes to please him and it still was not good enough. I met all of his needs and I think along the way I lost who I was because I was trying so hard to be what he wanted me to be.

I think I need to address this in counseling, but I do not even know how to bring it up or where to start. Or if it is all a crock? Gah! I am so nervous.

Hour and a half to go...

I'll give a little shot at this, Gdar, ignore me if I'm way off.

Your friend is not acting like a friend of your marriage, so in MB culture, she needs to go away. What you need are friends who will smack you in the forehead when you're being dumb, all while still supporting you in the direction you wish to go. Which is married, right? Not married at all cost, of course, but married with the customary surcharges.

I think it's your social nature to conform...socialites often do...so for you to have made adjustments to your self to please your social companion (H) is perfectly understandable. I think your friend perhaps believes in a less-conforming way of being, which is fine for her, not fine when she attempts to conform you to her thought process.

I also think that perhaps you have swung too far in your conforming to what you believe he wants to where even he may have trouble recognizing the girl he fell in love with. If I were you, I would seriously reconsider any changes you've made that don't feel authentic to you. Just because you're different than you were doesn't mean you're less 'you', if the changes are a result of maturing and growing. Lord knows I'm pretty different from how I was four children ago...it doesn't mean I'm a different person, though. I'm still me, with less daring. lol.

Is this with an IC, or SH?

With an IC, I would open the topic by stating that you've heard comments from old friends that you're not yourself anymore, and talk about your changes, and mention those you feel are authentically YOU and those that you hold resentment over, and try to work out a plan for deciding what to do about accepting the real you stuff while adjusting the others to remove the resentment...in a way that fits with your ultimate goal. Begin with the end in mind!

Thank you, CWMI. Let me first start by saying that I do not *take* any of my BF's *advice* because she has the worse relationship history of any person I know. I know she is just trying to "protect" me because we have been friends for many, many years. Through marriages, births, divorces, affairs, breast cancer, a tornado. My mom cannot stand her because she does not have a filter, but funny thing is, either does my mom. LOL

I am going to our MC, but by myself. We "graduated" from MC a while back (which I thought was ridiculous) and my H is too busy with work and we are having a really hard time coming up with sitters to go together. I believe he feels this is my issue, so I should be the one going, anyway.

Thank you for the suggestions, I appreciate it. The closer the time comes to the appt, the more antsy I feel.

Really, why is this so stressful? Maybe because I have never been to IC before.

You maybe nervous right now but I always feel better & more positive after I see my IC.

She's explains a lot of my feelings to me that I do not understand or want to acknowledge.

Just a nudge You will feel better I promise If he/or she is any good.

If this was you first appointment, talking about how you are "losing yourself" may be more than you can cover in 50 min.

I hope it went well.

Well, I really feel I did not get anything out of it at all. I feel like I paid someone my $10 co-pay to be nice to me. Our MC is a really nice person. But as a IC, I feel like I got nothing out of it.

I am really disappointed. Basically he said I need to do some more things for me. Even though I had just got done explaining for 50 minutes, that we have 4 babysitters outside of family, yet the several times we have tried to get one so we could get out of the house, no one was available. It just is not that easy sometimes. My "homework" for last night after my appt was to go do something nice for myself and not go home until after the kids' bed time so I could go home and not have to take care of it. I text my husband my plan, to which he replied "have a glass of wine waiting for you here" and that he was putting the younger 2 to bed. I grabbed my favorite snack (my nice thing for me), then headed home to ONE kid in bed.

Before I left for the appt, and I was happy my H came home early in order for me to go, he did not say anything about it. In fact, since I told him I made an appt to see the counselor, he has not mentioned a single thing about it. No questions, no comments (which I read as no concern for the space I am in, but I know that would be a DJ).

Well, when I came home, he is just staring at me with this look on his face like he wants to ask me something. He is not looking at me in a "I care for you" way - I wish I could explain it. Then he asked me what we talked about. Ugh. Here we go. If it is true, is it still a DJ?

My H wanted to know what we talked about, meaning what *I* said about *him* to the counselor. I immediately started to shut down, because I knew this conversation would not go well. I did not feel like arguing, I did not feel like defending myself. I really wanted some actual concern from my H about how I am feeling and why I felt the need to see the counselor in the first place.

I explained that he insisted that I must do more for myself, and I must delegate more often, meaning getting more support from H to allow me to get a break. Before I got the chance to say anything else, he cuts me off with "I tell you to take off and see your friends ALL OF THE TIME". *Sigh* I asked if he could give me an example of when the last time he encouraged me to do something for myself (I said this very calm, I think I did the right thing here??? by asking him to give me examples?) He says "just a couple of weeks ago, a month tops" (which is not accurate and he could not come up with an example at all). The last time I left the house was a month ago after I emailed him and TOLD HIM that I was going to meet 2 friends for dinner because I was feeling cooped up.

Anyway, after he cut me off and then gave me no examples, he gets upset and says" I KNEW you what light you would paint me in to the counselor. I KNOW how you can be about this".

I got very upset, instantly flushed and I rolled my eyes (not cool, but it was the bet I could do at the time), but said simply "we did not talk about YOU, and in fact talked about ME" and left it at that. Conversation over.

Really? This is what I am left with? A husband who does not care about my mental health, but how I portrayed him to a freaking counselor? THAT was his concern!!! How did I end up in this place? I am so hurt. I do not even know what to do. This is what makes me want to just throw my arms up.

If you believe in the marriage builders program, you should consider talking to Steve Harley instead of your MC. It seems as though you have been giving givin giving and your husband has been taking taking taking. So your MC says for you to take more, but without considering the impact on your DH.

I would love to. I cannot afford it (yes, I know "you cant afford not to), but realistically, I cannot afford $$ it.

Oh, sure - the counselor suggests I take my time, then give him his time (and this is exactly how my H thinks it should work).

I forgot to add I was also supposed to go to bed with earplugs early and try and get some sleep, because I am lacking big time in this area. I told my H how tired I was and what the counselor suggested, then he turns the TV, brings a bag of chips and dips TO bed (which is on of his biggest LB, he knows it) and then when he is ready, just turns off the light and goes right to sleep. I was up most of the night, stressed out.

You paid 10 bucks?...that's some good insurance...I pay 30 bucks...LOL.

Gdar, my wife and I both see the same MC as our IC...and yes, I sometimes feel that my wife could be painting me in a bad light and it's tempting to try and pry information out of her, but I don't...I ask her how her meeting went, she replies..."It went fine"...and I reply..."that's great"...if she wants to elaborate, cool, if not...I don't push the issue.

This was your first meeting and should have been a...get to know the counselor...and the counselor getting to know you and your issues that brought you to his office. This could take some time to unwrap everything, to really put a finger on the pulse of your problems.

Give it 5 sessions...you'll know within 5 sessions whether or not this counselor is working out...it could be you'll have to change counselors...

Are you on any medications...antidepressants, sleep aids?

Mr. Anderson, I know the counselor well. He has been our MC for 2 years.

No meds and I do not feel comfortable taking sleep aids because with 4 kids in the house, at any time and often enough, a kid is up sick (and then we had a home invasion 2 months ago and now it freaks me out) or up needing something.

5 sessions. I have an appt to see him in 2 weeks. After how my H made me feel about going, I am not sure how I feel about going back. Not a good space right now.

I just do not get it. I am tall, thin, attractive, fashionable, smart, funny, open minded, forward thinking, love SF, a good mom. I meet his needs (at least he says I do). Why is it, that when he KNOWS what mine are, we are in this spot? So frustrating. The more layers peel away, the more selfish I think he is. And he thinks he is anything but.

I agree with wanna. I have been reading your posts throughout the forum & this thread...I see you giving and your H taking. He seems to feel entitled and you seem to feel obligated. This dynamic is difficult to break - especially for the person who takes; however, it can be done with the right tools & guidance.

Be prepared for major (and sometimes ugly) resistance from your H because he sees no reason to change the way things are & (from what you say) views you as "the problem." I say be prepared because I think that if you're prepared you'll be able to deal with it better.

When he fires back with some of the more hurtful statements to the effect that:

-you're in the wrong
-your concerns are not valid
-your observations are not accurate
-you're being too emotional or you're being irrational
-you're too ((insert insulting description here))

you can stop to think and remember that people (especially those who perceive they are losing their rightful place on top) will work like mad to restore the relationship to its prior state.

You can also be calm enough to use reverse babble in response to some of these things:

-you're in the wrong
These are my feelings and feelings aren't right or wrong. They just are.
-your concerns are not valid
Since I am half of this marriage my concerns are very important.
-your observations are not accurate
My observations may be different from yours because I am looking and listening through my own eyes and ears.
-you're being too emotional about xyz or you're being irrational about abc
I am interested in having a better relationship with you. My feelings about you and my thoughts about this situation are a big part of that.
-you're too ((insert insulting description here))
I'd like to focus on having a better relationship with you. I am just not happy with things the way they are.
or
I'm sorry you feel that way about me. Let's come up with ways to make things better between us.