Yes, plan B is for personal R but also MB tells us that the A will eventually die and that exposure will make this death faster.
In reality when you enter a plan B even if you exposed the A does not seem to die. It goes on and on. This is when WH and OW are now in love and meet all the EN. WH contact with BS becomes farther and farther and the hope to save the M is less and less. WH finds something in the new life that he was longing for and by no means wants the old ball and chain life he had with his W.
OW is a wh@re and knows the art of keeping the WH thrilled and addicted to her. In plan B we are no competition. Actually we are no competition. Period. In this day and age leaving your W to find you own happiness is notonly the norm, itis encouraged by the media and... you name it.
This is the reality folks, and even if the A dies as MB says, WS will very unlikely return to the M, this is also what Dr. Harley says, he says that plan B gives very little hope for M recovery and that should be the last resort.
Blessing

I happen to agree with this.

People outside of the fogged-up, fantasy-driven, emotionally-addicted WS see these waywardisms for what they really are�deceptions, misdirections, evasions, denials, hedges, OUTRIGHT LIES, or (at best) exaggerated half-truths that serve to justify or rationalize the WS�s behaviors and attitudes.

People on the �outside� CAN include family, friends, co-workers, clergy, counselors, MB vets�basically anyone who has strong values they don�t sell-out by enabling, validating, or over-looking the WS�s affair. Note, I said �can� because all of these individuals are capable of being bamboozled or �drinking the Kool-Aid� out of ignorance, naivety, misplaced �loyalty�, or their own agenda [MB-vets excepted].

The BS is part of the triangle (whether it is known or not) and he/she is so emotionally traumatized by their spouse�s �alien abduction� words/deeds toward them that he/she is usually incapable of seeing the waywardisms for what they really are initially. He/she often takes them at face value at first (after all, they are coming from the one person they historically trust, care about, and intimately value MOST OF ALL). Usually, it is not until time has passed, knowledge/wisdom has been gained (esp. here), or both that the BS starts to see these quotations for the bulls**t excuses and a$$-coverings that they actually are.

The active-WS has ZERO ability to see real truth at the time. He/she is lost in the fog and high on neuro-chemicals. Active adulterers have virtually no genuine self-awareness or sincere introspection at all. I don�t mean that they �don�t know what they are doing� (they do�and have moments of self-hatred and shame they must actively suppress), but that they very rarely will make a realistic, fair, and honest self-appraisal in the emotionally-addicted state they�re in.

• Typically, WHs delude themselves that the affair �isn�t that big a deal and no one will get hurt�.
• Typically, WWs delude themselves that the affair �is the right answer and key to their future happiness�.

It�s only after full de-fogging that a fWS can see their previous waywardisms for the nonsense that they were. At the time they were spoken, they were likely very �real� for the WS.

A lie is still a lie, I am only trying to let people who need it why their WS do what they do and say why they say it.

And everything I posted about what I have said and did to my DH when I was a WS, is exactly true for me, those were the things I was thinking about, and the reason why I did them.

I haven't been saying "even tho we lie, its because their is some truth to what we say and do"

Sorry if the title is confusing, maybe I should change it.

I was hoping other WS would get on and help what they thought about when they were saying and doing all of the lying and cheating.

SR i know that you are trying to make BSs feel better about what the WS is saying to them.

The point i am trying to make is that a WS does not have the thoughts you are talking about until they have unfogged. And i would rather not lead BS to believe that is what ALL WSs are thinking because i think that clearly not ALL of them are or else they wouldn't STILL be WSs, they would be (F)WSs

At the time you were in your A i am sure you did not have those thoughts (and like i said before i have never been a WS so i could be wrong), however now that you have de-fogged you can look back and SAY that is what you were thinking AT THE TIME, however i find it very hard to believe.

If you were thinking those thoughts AT THE TIME, then your BS would not have had to do anything to get you to come home because you are already thinking that you should.

IMHO during the time of the A you are thinking of more ways to get your fix and not have your spouse find out about it not much more than that so you lie and connive and do anything you can to get that fix.

When you have de-fogged then you start having the thoughts you are speaking about, but while you are actively wayward i can not imagine those are the thoughts running through your head.

If it is not helping then I will delete this thread

Sorry, thought this would help, had a lot of people wanting to know, even my husband thought it was a good idea, but obviously it's not, so I will just ask my husband if he can delete it for me, since it is not helping.

I agree with this. The mentality of a wayward is the same as that of a falling down drunk or a crackhead. They are high on their addiction and are insane. There is no rhyme or reason to their thinking. What they do respond to best is an injection of REALITY. The BIG STICK, baby!!

It's done, I notified a moderator to delete this thread.

TY

Sapphire, no, no!! I think your thread is just great!! I think what the others are saying is that outside objective viewers have a better window into the insanity of the wayward mind than the wayward. It is apparent that you are gaining that ability too.

You are doing a great job, so don't be discouraged!

I really don't know a HUGE lot of MB, I have only been on here for only a couple of months, the only thing I do know is what was going through my head during the A.

I get a lot of people saying that I am not helping the BS, and to me that is a big conflict for me considering that is why I created this thread.

I am a type of person who doesn't like to feel negative, or have any conflict, I will literally leave a room if some people are gossiping, or talking negative about an event, etc.

I therefore ignore it, or just walk away, so I don't have to think those things.

When I come on here and find out that I'm NOT helping, then I want to just do that, ignore it or walk away

Sapphire, I know your heart is in the right place. I would devote as much time as possible to recovering your marriage. That way you can help others come out of the fog. That would be a very productive focus, IMO.

We do know what is in a WS's head: FOG! The solution is to refocus on recovery.

Hang in there, you are doing great!

This is all too familiar.

A WS starting a thread to help BS's see into the wayward mind.

The wayward mind is insane. Folks, it is best for BS's to NOT TRY to make sense from the senseless.

Yes; please don't take any shortcuts or make any compromises with working this entire program.

The program is like an onion: each layer has another layer underneath.

Keep going through ALL of the concepts and looking for more and more ways to put them into practice.

For Wheels.

This is the exact reason melody that I want to delete this thread, people who think this just makes me sad, I am not a negative person, and so when I read when people post something like this I will just ignore it and walk away, so I don't have to dwell on those negative feelings.

TY

SR,
Reading your thread has helped me somewhat understand what MIGHT be going through my WW's head. It helps me cope with the damage she has done. It also gives me hope that if the fog ever clears she may see things for what they really were.

If posting your feelings about your mindset helps you with recovery then drive on. Your thread has helped me with my own recovery.

Thanks

TY NW I have been reading your thread and I am so sorry that you are here

I'm not trying to give people "false hope" or justify what I did during my A, I just thought it might explain some things.

I rather delete this post and help people on their own thread instead of having this one, I don't deal with a lot of negativity, but I'm glad it has helped so far

So what is false hope? From my expieriance hope is kind of like happiness....it's what you make of it.

Your thread is another viewpoint to offer. If you want to delete it, do so, but it has helped me and I would imagine others.

Thanks

SR, a BS can drive themselves crazy trying to make sense of fog babble. We play it over and over in our minds. But the truth is...there is no sense to the senseless. That was some of the best advice I received here when I was desparately trying to understand how this could happen.

A BS has so little emotional energy, and they need to use it wisely. Investing emotional energy into trying to figure out something they will never understand sucks away the energy they NEED to be able to follow the MB Plans.

That doesn't mean this thread needs deleted. That's a bit extreme. Instead of feeling like you've blown it by starting this thread, consider that what YOU'VE learned on this thread can help you understand a bit more about your BH.

SR, a former wayward is at risk of using up emotional energy unwisely as well. I encourage you to invest all you have into learning and implementing the MB program to its fullest. Think of it as being a season in your life to soak up all you can learn. Be a student and a practitioner.

It's good to want to "give back". The more focused you become on learning and implementing MB, the more opportunities you will have to offer help to the many here suffering.

TY

Sapphire, please don't have the thread deleted. We need as many of your posts as possible so we can see you, understand you, and help you when needed. Consider this a long-term investment. I'm sure you'd find it a real eye-opener to take some of the people posting to you who joined in 2002 or 2005 and read their early posts.

The thing that worries me, that gnaws at the back of my mind, is the question of what you are doing for Wheels in your recovery. We're not seeing a lot of that, because you're not posting a lot of it, and you don't necessarily need to. But we don't know if you've read any more of the Marriage Builders books; we don't know if you and Wheels are spending 15+ hours of UA time together (ought to be 20 right now) each week, nor if the time together is good or not; we don't know if you've eliminated love busters and implemented extreme precautions.

It's good that you know what you've learned about exposure, ending an affair, the wayward mindset, and it's good that you want to help people. But the most important person in the world for you to help right now is Wheels! He has got to be your first priority. Recovery is not over.

Post to learn, and don't ever let this forum take precedence over the main site and the books.

SR there is no need to delete your thread.