Hi Stanley.

I also did not expose my FWW's A to my children or our immediate family. However, that would certainly NOT be my approach if the OM continued trying to interject himself into our lives like your FWW's OM is clearly doing.

The funeral was 14 months ago. Since then there was one more attempt to communicate. My wife has changed her email more than once, but OM generally finds the new email by asking someone in the family. He may say: "Hey, how is FWW doing? Do you have her email, I think I lost it." Family members immediately give OM the details because they don't have a clue.

A couple of years ago OM sent a present for the birthday of FWW. Like I said, OM is a sick individual and I cannot imagine what my wife thinks about the fact that she had an affair with a psycopath.


You should hear this man talking. I heard his voice early on when I tapped the phones when he was calling home at all times. He is smooth, charming, and very convincing with his arguments. He has a sixth sense and knows exactly what to say and how to manipulate.

What I discovered is that practically everybody in my wife's family fall for this type of smooth talk. From my side I always thought smooth talkers were despicable, but for them it sounds like music.

It is my constant fear that I may have met this OW. Or that maybe since I am unsure of the methods that my parent's followed for this recovery that she may still in some way, shape or form be in our lives.

I do unsterstand that exposure is mostly to end an affair but I think that MelodyLane makes a very good point that it is a great policy no matter what. While I am able to forgive my Dad for what he did as long as he has made amends I KNOW that I would never want to see/talk to/or anything with this woman.

I think that half the reason the children should be told is to protect them. The last thing that I would want is for this OW to enter my life in some way and to never be aware of what she is.

HI MIM:

I remeber you!

I hope everything is well.

CIAO

During the affair my wife took my daughters with her and met OM for lunch. I was fuming and said to her. Would you like it if my kids had lunch with my concubine? You should have seen her eyes and the face of disgust. Sometimes wayward people cannot see what it looks like from the other side.

Stan - I really feel you should expose this man to your family. If he is coming around your family and is charming and they all (with a few exceptions) think he's great and you KNOW he's a predator you are setting them up.

What is to stop him from moving in on one of your family members? Starting another affair and damaging another marriage, one which may not survive. How will it feel to see another family in shambles because you withheld vital information for the sake of your pride?

It's like watching a convicted pedophile set up a candy shop right next to an elementary school but you don't want to tell anyone b/c a few years ago your wife sampled his snickers.

If your wife is repentant, she will see the danger this man poses to your family and WANT to expose. Her pride wont matter compared to the danger this man is.

You also need the support of your family. If they knew who this man was, do you think any of them would have let him in the door of the funeral home? You need their help protecting your marriage from ever coming in contact with this man again.

And what would happen, heaven forbid, if somehow this man ingratiates himself with your children? He's stalked you before... and has been incredibly persistent. Why is he still doing this? because he can, because you do nothing about it. Tell your families. Tell his family. Make it very unpleasant for him to contact you - I'll bet his attempts will stop.

The people around you need to know that he is an ENEMY. You protect no one, you save no one by trying to protect your wife's 'pride'

My wife comes from a dysfunctional family where affairs were common. My wife is supposed to be the only one in the family that never cheated and she is sometimes seen as "THE DIFFERENT ONE". For some reason she is disliked by many members of the her family for no apparent reason.

If they find out they will have a field day putting her down. My wife wants to avoid that.

I would bet that every time an email comes, a package comes, a family member makes a comment, there is a sick and heavy feeling that just overtakes her inside. This may sound strange, but - even if there is initial sneering - she would feel SUCH a huge weight lifted if this secret weren't a secret. None of my friends brought up OM to me....because they knew what had happened. DD stopped asking if she could take guitar again, nobody asked me to places he might be or vice versa. There were a whole host of things I didn't have to be afraid of BECAUSE people knew. It was actually more of a protection to tell them because they knew what to avoid and how to be more sensitive.

Could it be because they have been told the truth and they are waiting to see WHEN you and your W are going to come clean???.....

This man has wormed his way into so many aspects of your life, you have no idea what has been said or done. Heck, he may have told one of children himself. I am willing to bet a bazillion dollars your kids know more than you think.

Stanley, you have boxed yourself into a corner and I fear it will get uglier before it gets better. And when this finishes playing out, there is going to be many hurt feelings and anger all around. And a good portion will directed at YOU, for helping to help and a bade your W in keeping this secret. You are not doing your children, your wife, nor yourself by keeping silent.........

Not2fun

Stan,


The fact is that your wife lives with the "truth" anyway.


She lives IN FEAR of the truth.


What kind of life is that?


Regardless of what you do or say, she already faces the truth every day, wakes up to it, goes to sleep to it.

Her dysfunctional family says and does things behind her back anyway, and they have a field day anyway.

Truth is, they probably already make up far worse than the "truth".


SB

You are 100% correct.

Six years after D-day I am doing fine. My wife still has guilt and has to endure a lot of negativity even though I never talk about the affair anymore.

My kids do not know, but I feel they suspect something went wrong several years ago. My oldest son who lives in the west coast always asks how we are doing as a couple when he phones. The negative talks about infidelity at the dining table are common and I believe they want to make sure neither of us thinks about going there. They know something was not right, but they will never ask directly.

I am not worried, but my wife is very fearful.

OM is 2500 miles away. When a package comes my wife shows it to me and we throw it away. It does not seem to be a big deal anymore.

However, the funeral was a big deal and I knew he would show up because my wife's brother asked him to come to the wake so he could offer comfort to the family members. As I said he is smooth and they fall for that sort of style. Like I said-------most of them are very insecure and have low self esteem. Smooth talkers do well with folks like that.

Hello Doc,

I hope you and your wife are well.

As far as disclosure to your children, your family members, your friends and the world at large, my position was, is and always will be, do what best fits the circumstances. That may come in direct conflict with a whole bunch of people who post here but I do not believe that disclosure is �one size fits all�.

You and your wife are six years down the recovery road and if you now feel that disclosure is necessary to take a step forward then indeed you should consider it. Reading your posts it seems that you are not so sure that such an action is in your interests. I sympathize with you, because disclosure in my case was NEVER more than a consideration very early in recovery. I will also point out that despite the quotes that others may attribute towards Harley supporting disclosure, throughout my entire consul with Steve Harley, disclosure never became a topic. We didn�t need it to recover; it wasn�t the right prescription for us. Of course, I am not you.

Also, consider that the term �disclosure� and what it means. What are you disclosing and to whom and for what purpose? If we are referring to your children, what might you tell them? Do you say,

1. Your Mother and I wanted to let you know that a few years back our marriage ran through a patch of trouble, or,
2. Your Mother and I wanted to let you know that a few years back she had an affair with another man, or,
3. Your Mother and I wanted to let you know that a few years back she had an affair with John Doe that lasted for three weeks, or,
4. Your Mother and I wanted to let you know that a few years back she destroyed me by having a three week affair with John Doe and had sex several times at the Motel 6 down the road and fell in love with him.

I could go on and on regarding the level of detail disclosure might entail but the point of the above illustration is that disclosure comes in many sizes. So the question of disclosure becomes how much you need to say to whom and for what purpose.

If I found myself in your position, personally, I would no problem in letting anyone know that our marriage had a problem spot, but I would have a huge problem in revealing any details. As far as the OM is concerned, I would have zero problems letting anyone know that I don�t want that scumbag around my family for any reason. If anyone pressed for reasons I might simply say, �I got my reasons and they�re mine. Just keep him away from my family.� And I would say it just like that.

Mr. G

MrGoodstuff, I wanted to point out here that Steve is a marriage coach, whereas, Dr Harley is the brains behind Marriage Builders. Dr Harley is the originator of these concepts and is the trainer of the coaches. *HE* sets the standards. I am sorry that Steve never told you to disclose your w's affair, but Dr Harley DOES tell people to do that. And that is what should be done. It is the right prescription for everyone and is the standard set by Dr Harley:

Exposure

If it had been done, then it is very unlikely that he would have had to deal with the OM for so many years. That is just a ridiculous risk that should have never been taken. The solution is to RECTIFY that mistake, not perpetuate it.

In Stanley's case, of course it should be done. That cannot even be debated in the face of all the evidence that the OM continually ingratiates himself into this family. Her potential "embarrassment" is not a valid excuse to avoid exposure. She SHOULD BE embarrassed. So what?

Because of this failure, the OM is allowed DIRECT contact with Stanley's wife for the sole reason that STanley and his wife need to continue to protect a LIE.

There is simply nothing about hiding this secret that aides recovery or helps him or his wife. Nothing. There is only ongoing HARM from keeping this secret.

As long as this is kept secret, the OM is free to involve himself in the family. The OM is FREE to pursue Stanley's wife, daughter and other female relatives. And the OM knows Stan won't stop him.

MrG, of course we are talking about disclosure of the AFFAIR here. We are not talking about pettifogging the issue with doublespeak. Exposure means exposure. People can use their judgment about how much detail should be given, but usually people who possess working minds respond well to simple concise statements like: "your mother had an affair with Joe Blow 3 years ago. The affair has ended and ..........." We don't need to complicate this.

And we all know the reasons an affair should be exposed already.

Please, lets not complicate this unneccesarily. It really is very simple.

Mr. Goodstuff:

I am glad to hear from you! I hope everything is well. My wife loved your posts because you seldom used the 2X4.

In retrospect exposure to my kids would have been a blessing and my wife would have shortened her withdrawal and concerns for the damaged heart of OM. She felt awful about the affair and wanted to fix the marriage, however was also concerned with the suffering of OM. If my daughters knew my fight would have been much easier.

Exposure to my wife's family would have avoided a lot of trouble, but these troubles were not necessarily getting in the way of recovery. My wife was dedicated to recover the marriage and she wanted to avoid a public flogging.

Regarding failure to expose and a restart of the affair. Despite everything i somehow trusted that my wife would never re-start the affair. No one can be that stupid!!!!!!!! I actually trust her.

As you said: I cannot imagine telling the kids that we acted strange 6 years ago because mom was having an affair with OM.

The fact that OM became a friend of the family to keep track of my wife affirmed the fact that the guy is a classic antisocial person with smooth manners. This friendship was embarrasing to my wife and she had to endure how OM fooled all her family members--------------------------just as she was fooled. It must have been a light bulb moment to learn how these folks operate.

I think I missed the boat on exposure, but ended with a rather nice result.

Well, this is not quite true. It interfered with your recovery all the times she saw the OM after the affair. It dragged her back to Day 1 of recovery and triggered her feelings. It did the same to you. Every time there is contact, there is a triggering of the feelings that prevents full recovery.

It interferes with your recovery even today, Stanley, because he is still free to associate with her family and keep you both perpetually triggered. One of these days she will act on that trigger, mark my words. And no one in her family will stop it becuase they don't know the history.


That is so ridiculous that I don't even know even know what to say. You shouldn't trust her if she still leaves the door open for the OM. That is like saying you trust me to go drunk driving.

Honestly, Stan, sometimes the stuff you say makes my jaw drop..

STan, leaving the door wide open for a future affair is not a nice result; it is to play chicken with your marriage. If you don't want to get your [censored] run over, the solution is not to become a more adept chicken player, but to get out of the road.

The solution to a mistake is not to continue the mistake, but to UNDO the mistake.