Thank you princess Hate that I am here but am greatly thankful for all teh help and advice.

His marriage ended in 98 due to his wife having a physical affair. He kicked her our the moment he found out and did not try to work things out with her.

My first marriage ended because we grew up and found that we no longer had anything in common except seeing who could make who the most miserable.

Mulan,

I have been reading your thread but have not gotten all the way through it yet. Hopefully I will be able to in the next few days.

Hi wounded,

Sorry to hear that you are going through this and welcome to MB
I have been following you thread and agree with the advice so far however I felt that the detail you gave about your H's first marriage brakedown and how he was cheated on and just ended that marriage. I find this makes alot of sense and goes a long way to explain the way he is acting now.

I think your H is in desperate need of reassurance from you that you love him and still want him, after all his reaction to his EXW affair was to simply cut her off and he is expecting you to do the same to him as its what most perople do or are expected to do when they discover they are being cheated on.

I know it can be frustraiting having to let your guards down and reassure him after all he is the one in the wrong and he is the one who should be groveling to you but he needs a life line right now, he could be thinking that you will leave him and if he ends contact with his so called best friend then he will loose everyone (as you say he has not other friends) so I can see the logic in a sense of him not wanting to let go of her just yet.

The best advice I can give you is to reassure him but stand firm that the only way he is risking loosing your love is by constantly bringing up his best friend, and this triggers you and makes you think about his A more than you need to so put it to rest once and for all and tell him that right now you love him and want to be with him however he is risking your feelings for him by introducing and wanting to keep a third person in your relationship. So NC with OW and no negotiations about that.

It seems to be part of the wayward script that a WS can see that the BS is experiencing tremendous pain, fear, insecurity, and anger while wanting to recover the marriage and yet does not understand that the BS feels those things BECAUSE the BS DOES love the WS.

If the BS didn't love the WS (even if that love is reduced by the affair and other poor treatement from the WS), wouldn't it be easier to just boot the WS out the door?

When my WH told me that I needed to just "get over it", I told him that if I could just "get over it", I would have been out the door in a heartbeat.

If that isn't the perfect answer - ! Quick, somebody put this on the Notable Posts thread!

Brutally,

I think you have hit on something. I do know that he has made the statement that he doesn't know if his best friend will have anything to do with him after him breaking his promise to her and if I leave then he has no one.

We have a day out planned for tomorrow. Hopefully we will have an argument free fun filled day together.

Lady,

I have told him time and time again that if I didn't love him then I wouldn't be here and be willing to work on fixing us.

We had a great outing yesterday. Spent most of the day just the two of us. We took my daughter out to dinner for an early birthday celebration. We also bought HNHN, Love Busters, and Not Just friends. I had them order Surviving an Affair, it should be in next Thursday.

We started reading Not Just Friend's last night. He read some and I read some. The only problem I have with this is that he still doesn't get it!. He draws conculsions from these books to support the way he feels about his best friend. We diescussed what we had read but not in great detail because I got frustrated (but didn't show it to him) by his conclusions. I did find it funny that in one of the samples couples in the book the OW has the same name as his OW. He said see I told you that wasn't her first time. lol

I did tell him that sometimes I feel like I need to hit him over the head with a 2x4 made of understanding and knowledge. lHe haid that he felt the same way. lol

I just pray that the fighting is over and we can start discussion things like adults.

Off to wake him up for work and spend some time with him.

I think you are making a mistake by trying to read these books with him while he is wayward (Yes, I consider his best friend OW2, an EA at a minimum). This is basically going to be a lovebuster and seen as "control" by him.

It sounds like you are following your own plan...but here goes one last try: I would beg/borrow/save/whatever to get a VAR while you Plan A the heck out of him (no educating him, no lovebusters, no fighting) and see what happens over the next few weeks.

I personally think you are approaching this all backwards.

We have had a wonderful few days!! No fighting.

We have been able to talk about anything and everything. For the first time in our marriage I feel like he cares about my feelings and is listening to what I have to say.

In one of our conversations he told me that even if I told him I was ok with him talking to his "friend" (no he did not say his best friend this time) that he would not because he wants us to be happy together. He did say that "if" down the road we decide to get back in contact with her then the three of us would be hanging out together.

He says and his actions are now proving that he wants us to be happily married. He is finally putting me and our marriage first.

We are going to go buy a tree and plant it for our anniversary this Thursday. He was planning on spending the day cooking for my daughter's birthday party until he realized it was our wedding anniversary.

Does this mean he is out of the fog? Of course I am still snooping but there is nothing going on. He doesn't get on the computer unless I am right with him. He isn't getting defensive with I look at his phone. He is telling me about his day at work.

Even if he wants to read the book together? He was with me when I bought the books and he asked if we could read them together.




Why would I get a VAR if there is no signs anywhere else that he is in contact with OW2 (his best friend)?

I am Plan Aing the heck out of him and it is working. We are closer than we have ever been. He is starting to talk to me about his day at work. He is asking about my day at home. He is talking about our future together.

I am meeting his ENs; making home a place he wants to be (he told me this weekend that he is looking forward to coming home again); talking about the good memories in the marriage; I am now taking pride in my appearance; and all the other things listed in Plan A (Carrot). I have also done the Stick part of Plan A.

How is this following my own plan?

I understand what you are saying, but you should always keep snooping, remember that.

And the reason why to put a VAR in his car is because most likely if he was still seeing the OW then he would be talking to her in his car.

It's only a precaution, that's all.

I do still snoop and there is no sign on contact with any women. I can see all his phone calls and the phone numbers he texts to. If I don't know the number I have a friend that calls them to see who it is. So far they have all been men that he works with (I know by the names).

He has started meeting my ENs too. Is it too soon to consider us in recovery?

We already have our UA time scheduled for this week. He gets two days off a week, so the plan is for us to do something fun together on one of those days.

You left out the part of your previous post that I quoted that demonstrates what I consider NOT to be a good idea while in Plan A:

The only problem I have with this is that he still doesn't get it!. He draws conculsions from these books to support the way he feels about his best friend. We diescussed what we had read but not in great detail because I got frustrated (but didn't show it to him) by his conclusions. I did find it funny that in one of the samples couples in the book the OW has the same name as his OW. He said see I told you that wasn't her first time. lol

I did tell him that sometimes I feel like I need to hit him over the head with a 2x4 made of understanding and knowledge. lHe haid that he felt the same way.

What I was trying to say earlier is that it is not a good idea to try to go through MB material with a wayward because they will see it as control or education. Besides he probably won't "get" it because he is so foggy...

Your H is under the assumption that once you two "fix" the M, he can go back to his friendship with OW2, right? He may be trying to appease you so that he can hurry up and get back to having contact.

In any case, as a bare minimum, if I were in your shoes, I wouldn't skip having a VAR & keylogger. That would be way higher on my priority list than reading MB stuff with him right now. I predict it is just a matter of time before he takes communications with OW2 underground. But that's just my opinion. Do what you feel is best. Good luck.

SusieQ,

Ok, now I better understand where you are coming from.

Since that discussion he has brought up the subject of OW2. He says that he is so happy now with us that he doesn't want to contact her until I feel comfortable with us doing so.

Isn't part of starting to trust your FWS snooping to prove your feelings wrong not snooping to prove them right? I do realize that I will never blindly trust him again.

It would probably be a good idea to start planting the seed now that any 3rd party in the M isn't going to be OK with you.

I agree but I am not going to push the point right now because I feel like it would be LB right now. I do plan on gently discouraging the three of us getting together later down the line. He has already made several comments that he doesn't know if she will want to be friends again because of him lying to her about never letting a gf or wife come between their friendship. So I am pryaing that she will not want to start the friendship back up so that I don't have to take the bad guy role again.

This has been an emotional weekend for me.

On 9/11 OW2 (his best friend) sent my FWH a text stating that she woke up thinking about him and just like 9 years and realized it was because she would love to hear his voice. FWH did all the right things. He told me about the text as soon as he got, let me read it, and he did not reply.

It did cause a discusion because he was afraid I would be mad at him. I told him that I wasn't mad at him because he did all the right things but that I am mad at her because she continues to disrespect me, him and our marriage. I did ask if we could block her number from his phone. At first he said no but later agreed to do so (and I have blocked her). I asked him if he would write her a NC Letter to which he will not. He said that he knows that any contact with her is not good for our marriage but it made him feel good that she still cares about him.

I did remind him of the example in LB about the wife who had a friend that the husband didn't like and they solved the problem by the wife giving up the friend and them finding couple friends. He replied that that did apply in this situation because in the example the friend was being disrespectful. I asked him what he thought OW2 was being. He said that he can see how I would think she was being disrespectful because I don't know her as well as he does. According to him, she is not the type to be disrespectful on purpose!

On top of that today would have been my Mother's birthday and tomorrow it will be six months since her passing. FWH did do everything in his power to keep me occupied and keep my mind off of what today is (until he had to go to work). He has held me and just let me cry.

In some ways FWH had come along way and in others he still has a way to go.

Any advice other that Plan B?

Wounded, does this mean he intends on resuming contact in the future? This has absolutely nothing to do with your "comfort" but with the safety of your marriage. That is like saying he will beat the hell out of you in the future when you feel "more comfortable." The solution is to stop abusing you, not try it again when you can feel comfortable being beat up.

i am very startled after reading your recent post that your H has not even taken steps to prevent that ho from contacting him. It is clear to that he does not get it. Is there a reason why he had not blocked her before?

He seems to not GET how devastating his affair was to you, which leaves you wide open for a resumption. I promise you he is thinking about OW tonight because he has been triggered.

This contact has placed him back to Day 1 of recovery.Your H has a startling lack of boundaries that tells me he does not even get it.


The purpose of snooping is to find out the truth of what he does when he thinks you are not looking.

[quote=MelodyLane
Wounded, does this mean he intends on resuming contact in the future? This has absolutely nothing to do with your "comfort" but with the safety of your marriage. That is like saying he will beat the hell out of you in the future when you feel "more comfortable." The solution is to stop abusing you, not try it again when you can feel comfortable being beat up. [quote]

I understand what you are saying. Just a reminder...OW2 is his female best friend of 20 years. I knew about her when we were dating and was ok with the friendship because they never spent time alone together. After his A with OW1, I let him know that I did not feel comfortable with him spending time alone with any woman including OW2. I even told OW2 how I felt but she still waited until I was out of town to ask him to breakfast (where my SIL works) which resulted in them spending the whole day together.

After that I asked him to go NC to which he pretty much chose to her over me. We came to a compromise that once our marriage gets back to where it needs to be then the three of us will be in the friendship but they will not be allowed to spend time alone.

[quote]
Is there a reason why he had not blocked her before? [quote]

I had not asked him to block her number before now because everytime we discussed her (up until yesterday) it has ended up in yelling and screaming.

[quote]
He seems to not GET how devastating his affair was to you, which leaves you wide open for a resumption. I promise you he is thinking about OW tonight because he has been triggered.

This contact has placed him back to Day 1 of recovery.Your H has a startling lack of boundaries that tells me he does not even get it. [quote]

I agree he doesn't get how devasting the A was to me. He feels like his A with OW1 has nothing to do with his friendship with OW2. As many discussions as we have had about it he still doesn't understand. He still believes that just because his best friend has different "organs" than he does it doesn't mean anything becausse they have been friends for 20 years.

He does however understand tht he doesn't need to start any new friendships with any females.