Thanks Melody
I will discuss it with him. I will let you know what he says.
This has been a truly bad day for me.

I am so sorry, teaser. {{{{{{{{{{{teaser}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Thanks for being there.

He was just telling me that someone had posted to the effect that the online program is a waste of time but I don't see the post. I guess this means that he is not sure that he wants to do it.
For sure I can tell you that I cannot continue to live the way I have been, so my next choice will be to walk away from the marriage and try to get IC for myself.

No, its not a waste of time. Just ask some of us who are in recovered marriages!! The online program is the same as the weekend seminar except now you don't go listen to DrHarley in a hotel ballroom, you listen to him online.

Many of us have gone through the course here and our marriages are fully recovered now.

The person who wrote that it was a "waste of time" said:
So I guess he thought it was a waste of time becuase you have to actually DO the work! It doesn't work like magic against your will. It is not the osmosis program for sure!

Would you mind posting to him and telling him that? I don't even see the post that he was referring to, did you see it?

I noticed that you have already posted to him.

teaser, here is the post. It is pretty funny. here

Here is the link to the online program. here

Thank you so much for being there!!!

He's cherry-picking quotes. Of course, not everyone will have the same result using any given program. Ask him to read the bazillion other quotes that say MB saved their marriages.

What he's doing is pretty normal for someone who is not used to having to make a sustained effort.

Hey, teaser? Go to your doctor and get some meds. I just read that you were hitting yourself. That won't be a one-time incident and it will escalate, so get meds, okay?

Teaser,

so glad you came to the board so the vets here can help you get through your situation, they are good people that truly care about the broken hearted who show up here.....
Your husband has hurt you very badly and I can understand your devastation, but you can over come this, stay calm and try to put together a plan for yourself....
First of all go see your doctor and pick up a script to help you with the anxiety you are feeling.....maybe some IC as well......
Then you can deal with your husband and what has gone on in your marriage, if he is willing to set up time with the Harley's that is great, if he is not you can get great help here as well.....
You need to get the whole truth from your husband and the affair has got to be over before you can make any decisions for your marriage, give yourself time, don't rush yourself, you are not equipped right now emotionally to make any big decisions......
Your marriage can be saved, it will be hard work on both your parts and your husband will have to be on board for this to work......
Like I said give yourself some time, go to the doctor and remember you are worth the time and effort it will take........you are one of God's children and he has his hand on you ..............believe that he walks with you and keeps you strong.........

MB

Thanks for your response.
I had gone to the doctor before and was in fact put on AD, I stopped it myself( I know I should not have done that) but I guess I will have to go back on them.
I am struggling so hard cause I have a job that is demanding, I am the head of my department so I make all the decisions, this is proving to be so difficult
I believe that if WH was doing what he was supposed to I could have stayed off the meds, but, the fact that he has not been following the plan like he should combined with the fact that I KNOW he is not being open and honest sort of took me back to D Day so I guess this now means I have to start all over.
You are right, I was hitting myself before-I think the reason why I do it is because I think that I am stupid for not seeing the kind of person WH has been. And I am thinking that I am even more stupid for still being here and ALLOWING him to continue to jerk me around. I am honestly starting to see what a cruel self absorbed person he is. My conclusion is that I need to be kicked in the a..., I have no one to do it so I have to do it myself.

Hi Jess

Thanks for your support.

One of the things I realized since D Day is that neither one of us is equipped to handle this on our own. WH seems to have taken a while to recognize this. He started posting yesterday and that is only because I demanded it, and even yesterday he got mad cause he said that I was trying to counsel him, but I still insisted. I am not sure if he is aware of the fact that I am just one step away from giving up on the M and just concentrate on healing myself.
The problem with me getting IC is that we live in Central America, there is only one psychiatrist here, she is the only person I would trust to not leak out my business (I have a high profile position). We both started IC but at my last session, I realize that there is a conflict for her based on things she said to me, so I told WH I would rely on MB, but that he needed both MB and IC.

I have been praying so hard for God to continue to stay by my side and help me to get through this but I have gotten so despondent that there are times when I question whether he is still there, but in the end, I KNOW he is so I have to accept that this is not something that I can rush.
I had already been put on AD and had stopped them myself, I will start back today.

This emotion is also normal. You're going to find yourself looking at gwill with a different perspective, and that is borne of being so cruelly hurt by him. The rose tint is gone from your glasses. You'll be scrutinizing him. I think it's a way of protecting yourself.

I think you'll eventually come around to embracing the realization that you did nothing wrong. In the meantime, you need to concentrate on being good to yourself, not punishing yourself.

Now get back on those meds!

MB
Its done!!!!

Glad to hear he is posting, teaser. I will go find his thread.

From what I can see he IS playing games...well past the point it makes "wayward" sense. I have never been convinced that he's gone complete NC with OW (or maybe a with different one--we have established that he is a serial cheater, no?)

The proof will be in the pudding. Let's see what he does now.

Hi

The answer to your question is YES he is a serial cheater. This was the trigger this weekend, I had seen an e mail from a female who wished him luck with his new love. I then said to him, you have been denying that you are/were in love with OW but I see where Sharon was wishing you luck with your new love? his immediate response(tinged with anger, too busy trying to deny love for OW) "how can I tell one woman I am having an affair with that I have a new love? its just not done" BINGO!!! now you have to understand, this is not a current affair, this person lives in NY, so the affair had to have happened before 1991 which is when we moved from NY. So now I am finding out about older affairs, so I am not sure what part of our M was real for me, I am at a loss.

Also he wrote in his post that on D Day I also discovered other inappropriate relationships with other women. This description is really pi..ing me off, he needs to understand that there is no such thing (at least in my book) as inappropriate relationships, for God's sake the ones he was having here, he had been in his vehicle and god knows where else, and they were groping each other, well, for an "impotent" man, that is called SEX, that to me then is what we dumb idiots call an affair. I guess "inappropriate relationship" somehow makes him feel better about the relationship. I am sure he will have a way to explain this away.
By the way he posts under gwilli.

MB
I have a general question.
Has anyone ever come here and posted such a horrible scenario that your advice is there is no hope for the M? and from this I eliminate the obvious like domestic violence, child abuse. I am referring to a situation where when all the facts are taken into consideration, it just seem to have no redeeming qualities.

Or are you all of the opinion that, no matter how bad it is a M can be R?

I will tel you what my opinion is. I do question posters about why they want to attempt a recovery with a certain type of person(serial cheater, etc). I HAVE read some threads of recovery that I COULDN'T believe. I don't know if I would have lived through that. I DO BELIEVE THAT FOLLOWING MB CAN AND DOES SAVE MARRIAGES EVERYDAY. Even DrH himself says that he can not determine which marriages WILL and WON'T survive.

It really IS up to the BS. DrH says that most marriages that end after an affair, are because the BS decides they don't want to try anymore. It doesn't mean it doesn't happen the other way.

teaser,

I would say that we have varying opinions on this. I don't think that there is a single, collective opinion.

We were having this discussion yesterday on a thread that is now locked. Some people se certain situations - such as those involving serial cheaters - as beyond salvaging, and I'm sure you can see why. If someone has had more than one affair, and might even have had affairs throughout the marriage as a way of life, then it is unlikely that NC with the current affair partner, and a plan for recovery will change their behaviour. The serial cheater is unlikely to ever have valued a proper (i.e. faithful, caring, protective) marriage in the way most of us do, and it is unlikely that he or she will see the value in such a marriage - ever.

I have seen many posters advise the BS of a serial cheater to leave. I have seen many posters advise other BS's to end the marriage, also; for example, when the WS does not immediately adhere to NC.

I think this advice is well-intentioned. What would you advise a friend in a serial cheating situation to do? Wouldn't you try to protect her from more hurt?

The BS on the receiving end of this advice should look carefully at the argument, I think. However, if they still want to attempt recovery, there are usually people who will help them.

Some people will stop posting to those in what seem like hopeless situations. Some will continue to post, urging an end to the marriage. Others will express their misgivings but offer advice on NC, spying, EPs and the rest.

There is no party line here, and everybody does their best to help the BS avoid any more pain.

teaser, ANY marriage can be salvaged and and rebuilt into a better one, if BOTH partners follow the program in good faith. Foggy WS's often take some time to get on board, and some never do. That part is entirely up to him. In my case, and many others here, it took many months before our WS's got fully on board. About drove us crazy...

Your H broke the covenant between you. Not once, but many times. It will require a big change of attitude and behavior, over time. Takes many, many months. That's a LOT of change he will have to commit himself to. It will require a tremendous amount of effort (and humility) for him to do this. The question is, is he man enough? Only he knows.

The other half of the equation is you. If he comes through, and you work your side of the street--becoming more the woman he fell in love with all those years ago--you will both have the marriage you wanted in the first place. It's many months of one step forward, one step back...and keeping your eye on the goal. I have never subjected myself to such self-discipline in any other endeavor. But it was all worth it. My marriage is better than it ever was before, and my family is intact. Both of those things mean the world to me.

You will be required to develop more patience and fortitude than you ever thought you could muster. His work will be even harder, if you can imagine that.

Boils down to: How bad do you want it, and are you both willing to really work the program to get it?