That is all the evidence you need to confirm the affair is still on.

Now, can we help you save your marriage? Did you read our posts?

She has agreed to NC. I will update with answers to questions and more detail later today. Yes - I have read the posts and have been working through all of this. I understand the need to give you more detail to get more help.

I exposed to her family and friends and his wife about a month ago. His wife has since filed for divorce. Yes, I know this to be factual because I have been in contact with OMW for months as a way to gather information about their activities and verify the A.

OK. How long can I expect withdrawal to last and what should I be expecting (examples please)? She has severe mood swings (asking for divorce to telling me she loves me). She is drinking almost every night and wanting sex often. I don't complain but I get the feeling she is trying to cover up her feelings for OM. I think it has only been a few weeks since last contact and about 2 months since they saw each other last.

At one point she told me she saw in him all the good things she wished I could be. Ouch.

I think the Harley's say depending on how long the A went on withdrawal can last a few weeks up to a few months. Or maybe that's the defogging. I'm sure Mel will clarify the correct answer for me.

I can tell you from experience that my husband was foggy for almost a year afterwards. Even when we first got back together. Watching the defogging was text book and quite interesting to witness.

I can't offer what withdrawal is like because my H's
A was over before we began talking again and he had lots of time to withdraw, not to mention I was in Plan B, a dark one and in my sitch, the A ran it's course.

I would imagine withdrawing from you, mood swings, anger, etc.

Thanks. I hope this gets better soon. Her mood swings are hard to deal with. Also, the total lack of remorse and unwillingness to really own what she did is difficult. She still puts him on a pedestal thinks of him as some kind of perfect man. You'd think that the fact he was willing to have an A would be concidered a major character flaw...

You say watching the defogging was textbook. What is "textbook" for defogging ? What should I be doing to help? I feel like screaming "WAKE UP" at her sometimes but I know that won't help.

I'm sorry you are here but......

The A is still going strong, just further underground.

You seem to be ignoring VERY valuable advice!

Tell your children IMMEDIATELY!

Stop trying to appease the WW.

If she wants to leave tell her thats fine, you will not chain her.

Stop blowing up at her - she wants you to be the monster.

YOUR KIDS MUST BE TOLD NOW!!!!!!!

Oh and change the title of your thread to "How to stop an A"

Your WW is a long way from withdrawl

Well as some of you may have predicted I am back. I will try to get you up to speed.

The affair ended in June and things were slowely getting a little better. I am 100% confident there was only a couple incidents of contact. Once early on they met for lunch and then once in mid July she sent him a FB message telling him how much she missed him. He didn't respond. I believe there was no other contact beyond that - until recently. But before I go there let me explain what happeed after the A ended.

She went through a phase of being extremely angry at me but eventually things settled down. Unfortunately, they settled down into the same patterns that were unhealthy for our marriage before the A. She lived very independantly and resisted any attempt by me to integrate our lives. I was able to change my work situation so I was home basically from lunch through the edn of the day - working only for a few hours in the morning. I spent my time working on outside projects and hanging with the kids. I tried every day to have some sort of conversation with her but those attempts were always rebuffed (one word answers, refusal to participate in any kind of dicussion). I would ask her to dinner or some other date and she would decline. It became very clear to me that she had no desire to work on our relationship. The feeling I got was that she wanted to coexist and focus her attention on the kids first (something she has always done).

My frustration gre to the point that I explained to her (calmly) that I thought our marriage deserved to be a higher priority in her life and that I had no desire to go back to the same way we lived before. Her response..."Why can't you just understand that I have a lot to do around here. 5 kids, cooking, cleaning, sports, laundry, etc. Why can't you understand that I'm doing the best I can."

Me..."I do understand. I ma here more now I can help with some of those things so we can have some time for us."

Her..."You don't understand. THIS is who I am. It's what I do. How would you feel if I walked into your work and said 'I'm here to help. What do you want me to do?'"

The topic was dropped and things never changed.

There were other issues along the way but the biggest one from my perspective was that she told me she didn't understand why her feelings towards me weren't changing. I said I thought it was because she wasn't changing some critical behaviors. We weren't spending time togehter. She refused to let me help around the house and got angry when I helped with the kids (something I did anyway). I asked her if she expected her feeling to just change by themselves one day. She said yes - just like she awoke one day and realized she wasn't in a marriage. Ouch. I explained that I thought actions would need to be taken and patterns changed before feelings would change. She dismissed it.

In spite of all of this things were still getting somewhat better. We went on a family vaction over Labor Day and had a great time. We still struggled with deep conversation because we could never get away from the kids and, to be honest, she wanted to discuss relationship issues that would have reopened old wounds that I really didn't want to go into so I would deflect the converstion another direction or get silent (something I know that bothers her but I couldn't come up with a way to not create an argument).

So, we were going along make very small progress but at least the affair was over, right? Well about 2 weeks ago my DD10 sports season started and he has a daughter on the same team. THis is how my W met him in the first place. The saw each other at picture day and and an event the follwoing weekend. I had asked her several times to put our D on another team but she refused because "why should the kids pay for my mistakes and I feel NOTHING for him so it doesn't matter."

Things have rapidly gone down hill since that first encouter. I DO believe her that she did not talk to him at these events but I know she saw him - she told me she did. The night after the first encounter she came home that night and laid into me for things I don't even remember now. She said some very hurtful things including comparing me to OM by saying she felt nothing for him and the he used her - JUST LIKE I DO." I let that go until a couple days later I sent her a text telling her to never compare me to a snake who would prey on married women again. She responded by posting on her FB "Towel thrown."

Things calmed a little after that but then some of the A behaviors began to come back. Should couldn't look me in the eye, she was angry often, going to the gym in the middle of the night, etc. i explained that these things were triggers for me and they bothered me and she assured me nothing was going on. I believe her but it bothered and hurt me that she had so little reguard for my feelings.

I had a couple of AOs during this time. Once where I felt attacked for past mistakes by her and my DD18 and I felt the need to defend myself. The other times I wasn't angry but I asked her if she was meeting OM at the gym (something she used to do during the A) and one other accusing her of meeting him at a sports bar when she was out. I have no proof either of these things happened so I was wrong to bring it up but I was so hurt that she would loeave me open to the pain of having to relive the A. She called the questions "verbal and emotional abuse." I obviously don't agree.

Now she has been talking to her attourney again and hinting that she has reached a breaking point. She will "no longer be accused of being the horrible person I say she is by accusing her of doing sdomething she isn't." She has become completely unintersted in interacting with me in any way. She bounces around the house happy and smiling while she rips my heart out.

The situation I am in is I have no proof that anything is going on and a big part of me believes she is being truthful that there isn't anything going on beyond just seeing each other at sporting events. The problem I have is that it is driving me CRAZY that OM is around my family and any way and she refuses to do anything about it. OM even had the nerve to send my DD10 a cany gram as a gift at her last event. When I found out I about lost it. My W doesn't see anything wrong with that and doesn't understand why it bothers me.

Now I am going crazy. My W is preparing for D or seperation she because she can't take my "verbal and emotional abuse." I feel entitled to want the OM AWAY FROM MY FAMILY forever. My wife is non-resposive to anything I try to do to show her I love her and want a better marriage. I think about plan B but don't know how to do that with 5 kids. Also, I honestly believe she is so angry at me right now that getting away from me (even without OM in the picture) may seem like a good thing. So then I think about possible re-exposer and try plan A again but I don't really have anything to expose. Do I expose that they see each other at sporting events on weekends but don't talk? I think I would look nuts in most peoples eyes. But I DO believe our relationship has gone backwords bc OM is around again. What I struggle with is it MAY just be me being paranoid bc I feel threatened by it and so I act in ways that are unhealthy for our marriage.

Questions? Thoughts?

Your wife is getting ready to throw you under the bus.

READ this ***LINK*** which discusses "document document document"

You should be in Plan A, for now.
However, you should at the same time, be documenting everything.

Spy on your wife. Hire a PI, NOW. Get your information, because they ARE on again.

Behaviors speak loudly.

Sbt, you are headed towards a train wreck and if you don't take control of this situation, you are going to find yourself slapped with a restraining order and booted out of your house.

I think you need to get into Plan B, but you are going to have to do it in a way that protects you and your children legally. That would require that you file for divorce - on grounds of adultery if you can in your state - and get her out of the house legally. You will want to go for possession of the house and primary custody of the children.

I do not believe that anything less than that will wake up your wife. She is on a destructo mission and does not believe you will do anything to stop her.

But here is how I would approach this. I would first have a discussion with her and just plant the seed of what your expectations are. After that, I would remove your children from the sport that exposes them to the OM. Expose the affair to the kids and to the school. But, it is your responsibility to protect your kids from him. You can't blame your wife and just sit by idly. Tell your kids WHO the OM is and that is why you are taking them out of that sport. Don't screw around with this, sbt, you are their father and it is up to you to protect them.

Set her down and have a discussion like this with her:

Dear, I love ya but I am not willing to remain in a hostile, loveless marriage. I will not accept anything less than a passionate, loving marriage. I am willing to forgive you for your affair and stay in this marriage if you will work with me to affair proof and recover this marriage.

That means that all contact ends with OM, taking the kids out of sports, opening up your life to me [complete transparency, etc] and commit to a plan to recover this marriage. I am not interested in anything less. If you can't commit to this, then I would ask that you move out.

She will likely tell you to go to hell, but that is ok because you will have planted the seed of what you will accept. If she won't get in line, then you have nothing to lose, SBT, because she is so destructive that she will tear you and your children down. You will have to file on her in order to protect yourself.

I have a bad feeling about this one and think that if you don't stand up and take control of this situation that you are headed for a train crash.

The most important thing you can do for your marriage is get the OM out of your lives. I would make that happen no matter what.

Set your DD down and tell her who the OM is and take her off that team. It is not appropriate for her to be around the OM in any way.

ETA: never mind what I said about exposing him to the school, I misunderstood and thought he was the coach. I would touch base with the OM's wife again and see if she knows anything.

Amen to what Mel said.

You must take immediate control.

Get evidence NOW.

Make a very strong move to protect your kids from this OM and your destructive wife. She is not trustworthy with your kids - she has shown that to you. Her mind is set on exposing them to this OM who does not care if he interferes with their family or their mother's marriage.

CALL HIS WIFE as soon as you get more evidence. EXPOSE THIS AFFAIR. It has not stopped.

I have notes for a lot of it but not all. I will go back and document the missing pieces.

I AM watching closely. I have not hired a PI yet. There are very few times I don't know where she is. In the spring I found and destroyed the affair phone. I have not been able to find another one. I know her account passwords unless she has some secret accounts I'm not aware of. I have checked her phone periodically and haven't found anything. She doesn't use the home computer - only her phone. I honestly don't think she is seeing him outside of the sporting events and then she isn't talking to him. There are a few times during the day where they could be meeting at a store or something like that. I guess I could have someone tail her to find out. Its also possible they could be working out together but I know she is at the gym - not going somewhere else.

Is it possible that just seeing him at the events is enough to kick off this behavior? It's also possible that I am over reacting and paranoid therefore fulfulling my own destiny??

Yes! Every time she sees him her feelings are triggered.


I don't understand what you mean here. It is irrelevant whether she is in an active affair or not. The fact that she sees him regularly and will have nothing to do with your marriage is enough to take some decisive action in this situation. If the affair is not active today, it will be tomorrow.

Without a PLAN of recovery here you are facing a long, slow death of a thousand cuts with other affairs. There will be other affairs or a resumed affair if your marriage does not recover. The fact that she is not in an ACTIVE affair with the OM is not relevant to this issue at all.

sbt, you have lowered the bar so low in your marriage that your wife is simply living down to your expectations. She disrespects you for tolerating her abuse. And the abuse will get worse as her hatred for you grows. Women HATE doormats.

I have a hard time believing that but all that facts point that way don't they.


I agree and I'll talk to an attorney to see how that would be possible. I am in a no fault state, she is the primary caregiver and to top it off she home schools 2 of our kids. I'm not sure what leverage I will have to get her out of the house. (obviously I really don't want her out I want her to wake up)


Agreed.


I agree she will tell me to go to hell. She will most likely file for D imediately. But, that doesn't mean I shouldn't do this. Some things you should know about my W. She is a control freak. She has always needed to be in control of everything. She is an attorney. She is NEVER wrong - about anything. The only time she admitted she was wrong about something was when she told me her A was wrong and she was very sorry. Unfortunately, she didn't change any behaviors except stopping the A in the spring.

I'm also not sure how I remove my D from the sport. My W will just ignore it and take her anyway. Then what? It would come to some sort of confrontation which would not be good for me trying to avoid having a restraining order slapped on me.

I'm actually not sure how filing will protect me or my kids. Unfortunately, there are complicating factors - see my previous post regarding home schooling, etc. I need to get to an attorney to figure that out.

Heard loud and clear. I just didn't want to make a mistake and push her further away if there was really nothing happening with OM. But the reality is, even if there isn't, I can't and shouldn't have to deal with OM around my family.

You can't have a RO slapped against you for withdrawing your DD from this sport.

Also, have you told your DD that your wife had an affair with this man and that he is a scumbag? If she doesn't know, that needs to change PRONTO. If you don't tell her the truth, your wife will tell her lies.


If you don't file, you can't get her out and you leave yourself wide open for any legal shenanigans she will try and pull to get you removed from your home. You may not believe that she would do that, but we have seen it here so many times.

I would find out if adultery is admissable in your state even though it is a no fault state. Texas is a no fault state, but adultery is taken into account.