</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> If I were to meet any of you who I consider to be friendly with for dinner sometime, I'm sure that I'd get along with you as well as I do online.

What is the difference? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">See, that's just it Slap. I don't think there is.

Now if we were talking about a romantic encounter then YEAH! Online relationships have to come into real life fairly soon in order for the people to determine whether or not they can sustain real life. Physical attraction, etc. IS important in my view.

But as far as just platonic friendships? Why not? I mean if I decide I like someone just as a friend then my criteria is based upon only
the inside (values, beliefs, sense of humor, intelligence) all traits that we can "see" right here online.

I really believe this -- there are few traits in life that you CAN'T fake. You can't fake humor. You can't fake intelligence (you can tell people
you are highly educated, but in time the truth of the matter is quite clear for all to see) and you can't fake integrity or morals or honesty.
(again you can SAY you are all those things, but time is a great predictor of that and sooner or later you'll mess up for all to see)

Pretty much everything else you can fake. You can pretend to be rich,
and beautiful and notorious, but those are all traits that I could care less
that my friends have.

So really I think online friends are WONDERFUL because rather quickly I can see if they posses the characteristics I am looking for.

As I say, finding love on the net is a good starting place and a good way to find people, but I think it is rather unhealthy for a relationship to stay only
online. IMO

-------
ILMF? Does that mean if we are "associates" that we have at least made it a tiny
way into your heart? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

LOL

DZZZ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The one thing that bothers me is to talk with people over several months and then they just disappear. I am still worrying over one that posted for several months and then never again. If it was someone I know, I would just call them up and asked what happened. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Believer, I feel like this too. Sometimes I will see people make a thread asking if anyone has seen so and so.

I think about different ones and especially if they are in an abusive situation it makes you feel just horrible that you'll really never know if they are ok.

I think that is where we can just pray and ask God to watch over them..what else can you do?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

DZZZ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> But I yes, it did surprise me when I first noticed it. But that was 11 years ago, so it doesn't surprise me anymore. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wow WhirrledPeas!(your nicks still cracks me up by the way! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> it's only been about 5 years for me. I remember coming online about then and being surprised to hear that others were online for 5 or so years. I must have lived under a rock before then. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Whirrled? What is your story btw? I don't think I have heard it.... if you want to tell that is?
I do remember you telling me you were a moderator for another forum is that correct?

DZZZ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">OTOH, after a disagreement here, I also received a nasty email followed by a sudden deluge of porn in the email addy I use here. Oh, and one irate message from a wife who thought her H emailed me too often. So, now I am a bit more careful about sharing my email on the board...you just have to use common sense, ya know? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ya I do know. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> My personal experiences on MB have all been good. I have a few people I e-mail off board but they are all good.

But I have had some bad experiences in the past so I DO know what you are saying Kathi.

I think in the case of MB it is probably a good thing to use hotmail or Yahoo (if you do choose to post your email for just anyone) and sadly if things do turn sour you can delete and block them.

I don't think I have ever had to do that tho. Like in real life I have only had a couple friends that I have ever had to break off friendships with for one reason or another.

Online friendships I think wain too and die natural causes just like in real life.

For instance when I am working I would only have time to keep minimal contact. When I was a stay at home mom I had TONS of time.

Of course your friendships would revolve around the time you had to give to them. Sometimes people just naturally move on.

Like we are all gonna do some day from MB right Kathi???!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

DZZZ

Yes to all of it.

I have a couple of friends that I *met* online. They have stood the test of time, sometimes we have a lot of time together, in the past year though there has been very little. I also have most of my real life friends online now that I get to chat with as they are ALL living in different states.

The thing that I found the most amazing was how it drew me out of my shell. I had built so many walls around myself with H and the rest of my family that a few months after I got online the first time they all started commenting on my new found sense of humor, etc. It wasn't that it was new it was that I was letting it out with my new *friends* and it was carrying over into my real life. For a while it seemed like I had split personalities, the real me that I let my online friends get to know, and the subdued me that just couldn't let myself be known to those around me. Does that make any sense? I didn't have to protect myself with those online because they were not able to hurt me.

I have also found that my real life friends that I have known most of my life that I chat with online now know me better than ever. I am more open with them and don't hold back.

It was also odd to have my MIL start calling me by my nick after asking if *nick* could come out and play and leave *realname* at home.

As far as impacting life, absolutely, even my kids would ask how my online friends were.

<small>[ January 28, 2004, 02:00 AM: Message edited by: MyBestFriend'sWife ]</small>

Hi Dzzz...

::: I was online when the *hot* modem was 2,400 baud. Now, it's 56,000 baud.

Yeah, I've done moderating work in another part of the net.

My story? Pretty simple. My life partner and I have been together for decades. No affairs, no infidelity, no major issues. But always looking to deepen the relationship, you know?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Diamonzzz:
<strong>Were you surprised at yourself the first time you realized that people you had never technically met started to impact you in your real life?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I find people interesting online, and often listen to what they say. I quit developing emotional attachments a long time ago online.

I am as real online as I am in person - same personality, same everything. When I first got online I learned the hard way that not everyone operates on the same principle. I fell quickly and deeply in love. We emailed, we chatted, we wrote, we phoned. He sent me poetry, we planned our vacation and lives. I could not believe I had found someone so simpatico. And then he disappeared. When he resurfaced 4 days later, it was to tell me he had been in the hospital with his wife while she gave birth to their second child. That was the end of my becoming emotionally involved online <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

My husband, who I also met online 9 years ago, bore the biggest brunt of that decision. He fell in love, I steadfastly refused to commit to anything until we had met and he became real.

That's pretty much how I feel about everyone online - until I know them in real life, they don't really exist for me emotionally. Intellectually, yes. But not emotionally.

Slapnuts,

--All the internet is, is a communication medium. I am reminded of my kids asking me if "the Rock" is a real person. They had the idea that nothing on TV is real.

TR--Let your son know yes, he is real--he's actually my husband's second cousin--although they haven't seen each other since childhood--as life choices have kept them from doing so--

Dz,

I can share some of these met online stories--

Let's see--I met one couple online--when they came to visit family while on vacation--we met for dinner--we still keep in touch occassionally

I have a couple of friends in the Upper P--I met online--they asked me if I knew a friend of their's who lived in my hometown--I didn't--but we eventually met through them--her family was at my wedding last month--her husband took wedding pictures--and made an awesome DVD--they were also at my daughter's baptism, I've met her family--(who actually live in the same town as my now in-laws)

I met another lady online and while I was visiting another friend her and I met for breakfast--when her grandmother died--I was impacted by that as well--as she had shared so much about this lady--it felt as if I knew her--

another lady I met online--I met in person when she came here on vacation--when she was trying to adopt a child--many of us encouraged her to keep trying--she took in a pre-teen from an abusive home as a foster child--the adoption went through last year--

So yes, the lives of those we meet online can certainly make an impact on our lives--

I've even talked to a couple of folks from here on the phone--whom I hope to one day meet in person--

Diamonzzz,
Some of you more than the rest. . . but to this particular question (posed in good spirit, and appreciated):

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Diamonzzz:
<strong> [QUOTE]ILMF? Does that mean if we are "associates" that we have at least made it a tiny way into your heart? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by ilmf:
<strong>Being subject to soft-heartedness myself, I always keep a little distance and though these are “heart-matters” on many accounts, I consider the cost of much attachment</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So. . . . “yep”

It’s just a little “distance” I actually maintain because I really do care what happens to people here. (Personally, I think that anyone who doesn’t care really shouldn’t be here at all. . . and we see some like that show up from time to time.) For my own sake, I don’t want to be “missing” anyone, or in much of a throe over something 1,000 miles away. . .though 1,000 miles away I must acknowledge that something’s a circumstance that someone really has to deal with. It always encourages me to see someone doing well, and is a little discouraging when anyone is doing poorly.

Ironically, it’s that “professional distance” (geez, that’s a fancy way to put it) that may sometimes make it seem like I am a hard case. Where I really am only just brusque at times, out of sincerity. All my bits about “love” as a chosen behavior, and that to inspire good feelings. . . blah, blah, blah (typical ilmf ramble) is because I am hoping that something will work for people whom I know want something to change or improve in their lives. I realize that I am no more than just another fellow adding his point of view, and that it may not even be right on all accounts. . . . but I am here getting advice and encouragement, and hoping at times to return some. I suppose that a place in one’s heart isn’t quite the same as caring. . . but I think that in practical terms the difference can’t be much more than something almost poetic. Making the distinction though, is something that I do both for my own self, and for others.

So to Diamonzzz, and all my professional associates here at MB, I do thank you for what you’ve provided for me in the way of helpful advice, encouragement, and probably a better understanding of “how things work”.

Hmmmm. . .”professional”. . . “Slapnuts”. . . . .

Hey, Diamonzzz. . . I think I just came up with another oxymoron, too! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Diamonzzz:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The one thing that bothers me is to talk with people over several months and then they just disappear. I am still worrying over one that posted for several months and then never again. If it was someone I know, I would just call them up and asked what happened. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Believer, I feel like this too. Sometimes I will see people make a thread asking if anyone has seen so and so.

I think about different ones and especially if they are in an abusive situation it makes you feel just horrible that you'll really never know if they are ok.

I think that is where we can just pray and ask God to watch over them..what else can you do?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

DZZZ </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yeah,

I know what you mean, there was this couple I spoke with on the phone a few times and also via e-mail, making sure to e-mail both of them lest one think something nefarious was in the works.

Seems they fell off the planet, lost my toll free number, e-mail.

I wonder what happened to them.

Tony

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Yeah,

I know what you mean, there was this couple I spoke with on the phone a few times and also via e-mail, making sure to e-mail both of them lest one think something nefarious was in the works.

Seems they fell off the planet, lost my toll free number, e-mail.

I wonder what happened to them.

Tony </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I think HE lost THEIR e-mail addresses and THEY thought HE fell off the planet.

But that's only my "guess" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

DZZZ

Nope,

I distinctly remember getting an e-mail asking for the 888 number again and saying they would call.

I sent the number but never got a call <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Maybe my e-mail got lost?

Tony

dizzy,

When I first came here....I think I probably developed stronger...but less healthy attachments. I say less healthy because I was genuinely hurt by some of the comments made to me and worried alot when posters disappeared. It's not that I don't care about folks anymore, or that I'm impermeable to hurt, but a little detachment is a good thing. I no longer feel defensive, or even insulted when folks send barbs my way. I no longer find it necessary to convince anyone of anything, or admit to my own failings. I don't need to get on soap boxes or waste any time "teaching" something anymore that there is no interest in their learning. I have learned that those who wish to know me better, will seek me out....and I have yet to have a bad experience with that...but I am quite careful. If someone wants my advice and thinks it has any value...they usually ask for it...which is great because then I'm not using my time unwisely. I only "talk" (IM) to a few people offline...but I truly like all of them and while I haven't actually met any of them....I hope to one day. I do get plenty of emails from both sexes....and those remain less personal and more guarded. And like WF....those things have been POJAd. Honestly, because so many of my friends live around the world and the Internet is where we keep in touch....I do feel as though all the folks I interact with are real....because they are. It was a huge shock to me to realize that many people are different on the forum than in real life....but the surprises were usually good ones. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Nope,

I distinctly remember getting an e-mail asking for the 888 number again and saying they would call.

I sent the number but never got a call

Maybe my e-mail got lost? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">We got the said e-mail. You were going to tell us what time. You feel asleep and didn't wake till morn. We were gonna tell you when we'd call again. We dropped the ball.. sorry ....
Then life happened and we lost touch ...


<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
DZZZ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Diamonzzz:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Nope,

I distinctly remember getting an e-mail asking for the 888 number again and saying they would call.

I sent the number but never got a call

Maybe my e-mail got lost? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">We got the said e-mail. You were going to tell us what time. You feel asleep and didn't wake till morn. We were gonna tell you when we'd call again. We dropped the ball.. sorry ....
Then life happened and we lost touch ...


<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
DZZZ </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well,

I'm free every night until Friday.

Tony

<small>[ January 28, 2004, 12:08 PM: Message edited by: javaSansContour ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> For a while it seemed like I had split personalities, the real me that I let my online friends get to know, and the subdued me that just couldn't let myself be known to those around me. Does that make any sense? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">MyBestFriend'sWife:

This makes total sense to me and I can also relate. When I was going through my divorce I was tired of sharing and venting to my family and friends. I would go days and even weeks without sharing what was REALLY going on. But my online friends "saw" the day-to-day.. much like MB..so yes, I can relate.

I guess this is good and bad. It is good that God blessed us with some really good friends online, but a sad testiment to the fact that we couldn't be open with the people we probably most wanted to.

Anyway, those dark days are behind me but I have retained many of the online friends I have (well I should clarify..the female ones..the males had to go to delete when I remarried) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

--------

WhirrledPeas: Can't we all use some help! You seem to know your way around here already in a short time, but welcome to MB anyway!
We're a pretty good bunch all in all...

Is this site pretty much what you are used to in other forums that you moderate? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

DZZZ

Star: Made me laugh and think of that post I made waaaaaay back there about being invisible??! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

What a dork I was then! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I have to agree with you, I have changed as well. I rarely get hurt by things. I also don't have a huge need to convince anyone of my view point. I will pass up more posts than I comment on for that reason. I used to find them irresistible.

One thing tho that hasn't changed I really still do care about people and therefore, I really do try to be careful about the "advice" I dispense.

To me, they ARE real so I feel a responsibility to be careful what I say, especially to the newbies.

I have noticed that some people like you for example, have maintained a level of integrity.

I think maybe once or twice I suggested (maybe hinted was as strong as I got) that someone 'leave the bum'...

Anyho .. so I guess I have arrived now huh? I am not invisible anymore? Now I am debating my own existence. heehe

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

DZZZ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> When I first got online I learned the hard way that not everyone operates on the same principle. I fell quickly and deeply in love. We emailed, we chatted, we wrote, we phoned. He sent me poetry, we planned our vacation and lives. I could not believe I had found someone so simpatico. And then he disappeared. When he resurfaced 4 days later, it was to tell me he had been in the hospital with his wife while she gave birth to their second child. That was the end of my becoming emotionally involved online </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wow KS41! You hear about stories like this and forget that they really do exist. Gosh I really am sorry. I don't want to dredge up any ugly memories but how in the world do you reconcile that? I mean all your dreams and hopes dash in one day....

I can't even imagine! In the case of affairs ...your world "feels" like it has ended but many good people as evidenced here, get through them, and go on to have an even stronger marriage then at the beginning.

But this? You have lived an absolute lie from day one. No WONDER you never trusted anyone again online. How could you?

I noticed in your tagline that your current husband has had online affairs. I am so sorry hon that has to be so hard.

It is a wonder with all you have been through that you even come online.

I have an observation to make in that regard. I often think that when people meet online and establish a 'habit' of chatting online, it is a difficult thing to break after a person finds a mate and marries. Sometimes I wonder if it is more a manifestation of an addiction, than the need to fulfil with an affair. You know what I mean?

I hope things are better for you these days.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
DZZZ

<small>[ January 28, 2004, 07:42 PM: Message edited by: Diamonzzz ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Diamonzzz:
<strong> [QUOTE] WhirrledPeas: Can't we all use some help! You seem to know your way around here already in a short time, but welcome to MB anyway!
We're a pretty good bunch all in all...

Is this site pretty much what you are used to in other forums that you moderate? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

DZZZ </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks for the welcome <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I watched the forum for a few months before I jumped in to post. Because I, like you, see people as "real" and want to be careful about any advice I might give. I also wanted to be really sure I understood the Harley concepts before saying anything. So that may be why I just kinda "pulled up a chair".

The fascinating thing is, that the human dynamics are pretty much the same Dzzz. It's just the questions that are different. My usual hangout has questions like..."Is POSIX support improved under the new linux kernel?".

So unless you are really geeky (I plead guilty), MB threads are catchier. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Some threads make me blush, but they are all well thought out and respectful, and I find it all pretty insightful.

Whirrled: I can see where transferring from one forum to another (as you say once you have the concepts down pat) would be pretty easy.

I think I understood at least some of the basic concepts and I understood net etiquette to a degree, but oh my goodness was I ever a dorkapheliac when it came to Forum 101 ..

For instance, I couldn't even figure out what the heck the "bump" thing was. (OMG I even made a thread to "ask".. how goofy is THAT!) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Thinking about it now makes me really blush but for real, I would see that "bump" and it never occurred to me it was to send the post up....

I think I HAVE improved there. LOL

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

DZZZ