That one isn't painful, not really. Yeah, it's about a messed up relationship - a vile, turbulent love/hate full of passion, fire, anger, spite... so complicated. Until today, I didn't care for it as much as another from that same album which is much worse. "Love the Way You Lie" just wasn't "us." It is for now, because we are both hurting terribly and just trying to hold on.

I got one for ya;



I�m not strong enough to stay away.
Can't run from you
I just run back to you.
Like a moth im drawn into your flame,
Say my name, but it's not the same.
You look in my eyes I�m stripped of my pride.
And my soul surrenders
and you bring my heart to its knees

And it's killin� me when you're away,
i wanna leave and i wanna stay
I�m so confused,So hard to choose.
Between the pleasure and the pain
And I know it's wrong, and I know it's right.
Even if i try to win the fight,
my heart would overrule my mind
And I�m not strong enough to stay away

I'm not strong enough to stay away
What can I do
i would die without you
in your presence my heart knows no shame
im not to blame
cause you bring my heart to its knees

And it's killin� me when you're away,
i wanna leave and i wanna stay
I�m so confused,So hard to choose.
Between the pleasure and the pain
And I know it's wrong, and I know it's right.
Even if i try to win the fight,
my heart would overrule my mind
And I�m not strong enough to stay away

There's nothing I can do
My heart is chained to you
And I can't get free
Look what this love did to me

And it's killin� me when you're away,
i wanna leave and i wanna stay
I�m so confused,So hard to choose.
Between the pleasure and the pain
And I know it's wrong, and I know it's right.
Even if i try to win the fight,
my heart would overrule my mind
And I�m not strong enough to stay away

not strong enough, strong enough
not strong enough, strong enough to stay away
not strong enough, strong enough
and im not strong enough to stay away

Chin up!!! Get up, damnit!!!! FIGHT!!!!

If you don't get up, I swear, I'll sick FWW on you!!!!

thanks, HHH...you are good at the pep talks...I have a hard time letting everything sink in sometimes.

Bad, bad couple of days. H slept on the couch last night. I've been withdrawn and sullen and I apologized to him for that. I took the girls to visit his dad today - I had asked H to come along but he did not. His dad is much worse. When I went earlier in the week he was more alert and able to carry on a little conversation. Today he was on a lot of pain medication and slept much more. He talked a little but you couldn't really understand him.

Had to take the girls for haircuts afterwards and we were going to stay downtown to see the Christmas parade - H wasn't interested in that either. Although we ended up skipping the parade for a couple of reasons - main one was it SNOWED today, other, DD #1 was in rare form, acting up and just being a handful.

Anyway, main reason I am posting is I sat down to talk to H tonight. Told him how much I loved him, how I didn't want to give up on us. Pretty much the only thing he said to me initially was, "Then you shouldn't have done what you did." After a bit he talked a little more, asked if I understood why it was hard for him to believe me, because I'd said all these things "before" (I was assuming he was referring to the trickle truth over those first 4 months). I said I couldn't change what I had done or the things I said, and that I know my words are worthless currency now but that was why I was trying to show my love for him through my actions. He said he didn't trust my actions either. I then brought up to H how I was willing to do anything to earn his trust:

Me - If you want me to tell OMW, I will tell her.
H - I've already said I want you to do that (note: he has never stated this directly to me)
Me - I asked you to let me know when you wanted it to happen. I want it to be a way you agree with and you can verify that it was done. Do you have an email address for her?
H - At work.
Me - Has she gone back to work yet?
H - I don't know.

OK - so, how do I do this? I said I would send an email, figuring most folks these days are able to check their work emails from home, and follow up with a phone call or a certified letter. Apparently he wants me to do it and not him.

So what do I say? How much info do I include? Do I give her a way to contact me? Do I give her a way to contact my H?

Folks, I don't know what else to do. Whether it helps my M or not this needs to be done for her sake. And maybe mine as well. It won't change who I was, but it can reflect who I am now.

A few things of note, just from my own experience of contacting OM's GF; there may be denial on her part, and of course you may face the question I had to face - "Why now? Why all of a sudden?"

I simply told her this; "It's not about him, it's not about me, or my FWW, and it's not about punishment. It's about you having the right to know the truth if the person who you are going to dedicate your life to won't give it to you."

The rest of the conversation never occurred, but I now know that I gave her the opportunity.

WPG, I haven't said those things to FWW, but I'd be lying to say that I don't have to bite my fool tongue to not say those things some times.

I have been in a real bad anger phase lately, and today at lunch I burned her face off... I hate it, but I'm finding the only way that I can get this out, get my head straight, is to tell her what I'm thinking, tell her what I'm feeling.

I hate it because the last thing I want to do is hurt her, and I fear driving her away. That's a DJ on my part, and I am learning that big time. I can't tell you how much respect and admiration she is regaining from me by letting me be open, and not punishing me or belittling my pain and anger.

Maybe I've been wrong. Maybe you do need to prod a bit, and let him know that you would rather be miserable with him and get through this than ever face any idea of happiness without him. That is what she is showing me, and I'll be damned if I will allow this misery to last forever. I can't express how thankful I am that she is facing this, and how proud I am that she is willing to.

Cauterize. It's old medicine.

HHH, I've told you before - if anything like me, your FWW would much rather hear your anger and pain than for you to keep it bottled up! I told H tonight I want him - ALL of him. All the anger, all the misery, all the pain.

I really believe you and your FWW are gonna be OK, you know.

Here's a first draft. Let me know what you think.


***I've thought about creating a new email address that H and I both have access to (although he has all the passwords for mine anyway) - or maybe it should be an email that only H has the password to? That way he can verify communication?

I think you need to be very careful to handle OMW so that you feel comfortable that she has the information she needs, delivered in the most compassionate way you can do so.

Because it is one thing to tell her -- I believe she has a new baby?-- in a way and form that is sensitive to that, and it is another thing to tell her in a way and form that is going to be satisfactory to your H.

I urge you to adopt the former. OMW is an innocent bystander to all of this.

For your H to BELIEVE you have told her is a different issue altogether. I suspect no matter what you do, he is going to CHOOSE not to believe you.

Which may leave you returning to the issue and telling OMW over and over again in different ways hoping to find the method that will satisfy your H, which, BTW does not exist.

You do NOT get to torture OMW by doing that just to appease your H.

SO, do this in a way that is verifiable by your H in the unlikely event he chooses to believe you, but in a way that show compassion and care for OMW who has a new baby.

I suggest a telephone call. If you know anything about her family or friends, I would make an effort to make sure she has someone present to support her through the call. Remember what it is like to have an infant? Throwing this at her out of the blue with no warning is CRUEL.

OMW is an actual HUMAN BEING -- not a pawn that you may be willing to sacrifice on the altar of your M. I hear NOTHING in your posts about her as a mother with an infant -- it's all about you and what you need to do about her to appease your H.

Sickening.

Tape it if you think it will make any difference to your H (he will suggest you have doctored the tape, but at least you will have tried.)

My question is this; is your low opinion localized to WPG's H, BH's, or men in general?

Thank goodness you aren't the only one guiding recovery here.



WPG, let me put something out here for you; YOU did nothing to HER. What you did, you did to your husband, your children, your family, and your self. It was not YOUR job to protect HER marriage, it was your job to protect YOUR marriage.

HE was the one who did this to her.

I don't have a vindictive cause against OM because HE did anything to ME. FWW FAILED to honor her vows, she failed to think of anyone... she failed to even think of her freaking self.

If I have something against OM, it isn't that he lead her into adultery, which is horrible on it's own, it is because he treated her so far beneath what I value her as, that I want to murder him for disrespecting the light of my life. I hope for my own legal safety, I never see him. I scan for CA plates every time I pick her up at work, and visually fantasize the beatdown I would deliver - and it isn't anger that I envision - it's pure, unadulterated, gleeful justice. I would be the happiest man alive to get my hands on that piece of trash.


It's not about YOU WPG. It's about HIM, and how his slimy little [censored] can't own up to the disrespect he unleashed upon his wife and children.

Yes.

What's your opinion of him, like for real?


WPG, you had an A with her H -- you totally did something to HER.


No, it isn't. Right now it is ONLY about OMW. WP and her H and OM matter not.

OMW is a person, not a tool or a pawn.

Dehumanizing her for YOUR convenience in saving YOUR M because this very moment it is expedient for you to tell her so you can appease your H without regard to her particular situation is just as reprehensible as dehumanizing her so you could have an A with her H.

Doesn't matter what you do, or how you justify it WP -- she's still an actual human being with an INFANT.

Remember what that was like? Come on -- are you seriously going to take the easy way out and send an email under these circumstances?

NOW is where you get to begin to decide who you are, what your values and boundaries are, and, seriously, how low you are willing to go.

How low am I willing to go? If he wanted me to stand at the busiest intersection in town, wearing a sandwich board proclaiming that I am an adulterer, I would do it.

Pride is a sin. And it was one of the sins that allowed me to have an affair.

I get knocked down. It takes a little longer each time to claw my way back. But I am willing to do whatever it takes and that means whatever my BH needs me to do. I am the one who put the "B" in front of the H, after all.

But I don't think it sickening or reprehensible that she know the truth now or whenever. Yes, my H needs it. I think he wants to see me take ownership of my actions and the consequences. And she needs this as well, because knowing the OM, he has continued to lie to her. There's never going to be a good time to tell her. There's never going to be an "easy way."

WPG,
Seekingbalance has just advised you to do it differently then what you agreed with your husband. I would reject this advice as well as any other advice that is non-MarrageBuilders-consistent advice. (Beyond that, I don't really see the point of it. If you're someone with an infant/small child, and you are told by a stranger one day that your spouse had an affair, the news itself is going to hurt, irrespective of how it's conveyed.) You told your husband you would send an e-mail. So that's what you do. CC: him on it when you send it. Also, just to leave as little room for as possible for misunderstandings, I suggest you add the caveat that you do NOT wish, and will not accept, respond to or acknowledge any contact from her husband for the rest of your life.

Provided she does not know about the affair, OMW will be deeply hurt regardless. If you want, you can add that you're getting in touch with her not to hurt her but to at least give her the minimal decency of knowing the truth; but no matter how much lipstick you put on the news, it's a pig inside.

To clarify, I did not see where you had agreed with your H to send an email � I saw where you asked what the best way to do it was.

I encourage you to revisit the issue with your H so that you are confident that whatever method you choose takes into consideration to the extent possible the emotionally vulnerable state of OMW.

Certainly, she deserves to know with all due haste. Do you have a mutual friend you could dispatch with the news such that OMW won't be alone when she gets it?

OMW has an infant. Post partum depression may be triggered by this, which could result in long-term damage to both her and the baby. Her ability to care for her infant in light of this news may be compromised. She may have trouble sleeping and eating. If she is nursing, she may encounter difficulties.

All par for the course and to be expected in any event but this particular OMW has a baby to care for and will not have the luxury of falling apart for a few days or weeks.

A delicate situation calls for a delicate hand.

I do not see that delicate situation entering into your consideration of how to deliver this news. I see you ONLY considering your H and how notifying OMW might mollify him (it won�t). THAT is what I refer to as sickening.

WPG, you and I are the only people currently on your thread who have actually had a baby. Think about that 2-3 month mark -- the fatigue, the weight that doesn't appear to be going anywhere, the grinding exhaustion, the sweats, the tears for no reason -- I KNOW you know better. Maybe sunny or writer will wade in.

Seriously?

Self debasement is a sin too.

So is self loathing.

I wish you would take a step back and see what you are doing to yourself.

I also wish you would put into place a "no taking it out on the kids" boundary. You say your kids didn't know their dad was mad when he kicked the couch.

They knew. Kids KNOW. They just do - their very lives depend on you two. Darwin and all of that.

See if you can get the guy to at least agree to show enough maturity and self control to attempt to direct his anger at you and not them.

I throw myself between my H and kids when he is raging -- "remember it's ME who had the A, not S or D." And I say those words, in front of the kids, since they already know. Your kids should know too.

Sure, I'm scared he's going to hit me, but so what? These are my CHILDREN.

There are elements missing here... hmmmm...


Really?


REALLY?

If your H has put his hands on you, GTFO. Do not pass Go, do not collect $200. It's that simple.

There are few things people around here are quick and solid on, but that's one of them; if you are being abused, get out. If you are married to an addict, get out.

Don't drum it up for dramatic effect and project on to other people with it, fix your situation first.





So... what do I think about WPG's H.... hmmmmm. I think that he and I are alike in many ways. I think that our FWW's are quite possibly and identical woman split between 2 bodies. My FWW agrees.

I think the guy made his wife and his children the center of his entire existence in what he thought was the best way he possibly could, and that he was wrong - he neglected the relationship, as did WPG.

I think that when he thought he was losing her to another man, that when he thought the line hadn't been fully crossed, the fight in him woke up and he went into top gear trying to "save" the greatest thing in his life. He tried to make up for his failings, and then some. She responded, he was on top of the world because he averted the worst crisis he could ever face.

And then the rug came out...

And now, now he's paralyzed by fear, anger, hurt, shock, and disbelief.

Now he avoids talking to her, because his brain is screaming with the most horrible thoughts and accusations, the begging questions... Now he avoids looking at her, because he can't see her over the screaming in his own head - he can't even look at her, even more so in the eyes.


This wasn't supposed to be him, this wasn't supposed to be his family... his wife. He's not a bad man... he did what he could... he's good to his kids, he spoiled his wife when he had the chance... things just got busy, that was all... it would have gotten better, right?

It can get better.... IT CAN GET BETTER! Oh, if I just stick around. I'll show the girls daddy can be happy. I'm not giving up. Oh, God... I can't look at her. I CAN'T LOOK AT HER. If I just stay busy maybe I can keep the look of my face, and she won't pick at me. How could she do this to me? GOD.... all she had to do was TALK TO ME. How can she possibly love me?

Fu^&!!!!! Nevermind, it doesn't matter. I love her... HOW COULD SHE DO THIS TO ME!?!?!?!?!? Okay... breathe... oh, wow... I didn't know that your heart could have the sensation of nausea, weird. Ok, stay busy, get through today... tomorrow will be better, then we can start being happy. WHY WON'T THIS FEELING STOP!?!?!??!?!?!!?!?








What do I think? I think I have more than a clue where the guy is. I think he is paralyzed by shock, fear, anger, pain, and disbelief.

I think he is on lockdown waiting for the magical happiness gnome, or some crap, to leap out and help him get over it.

I think the guy loves his wife more than he can possibly express - and that because of that, he is being dishonest by total omission. He is being a protective liar.

I think that he's trying to protect her from the section of her crap pile that involves him.

He has little slip ups - he sends a nasty text, kicks the couch... whatever... and then he just digs deeper into his shell.


He's the exploding man, and he doesn't know how to save himself without destroying everything he loves the most. So he just bottles it up, and shuts everyone out. Not as if he's given himself any outlets.


Though, that's just what I think...

HHH, your post made me cry. Maybe a DJ on my part, I don't know, but I think you have described my H perfectly. And now he is dealing with what is going on with his father and I think he's just completely overloaded.

On that...He got a call yesterday his dad didn't have much longer. He went to see him yesterday afternoon. His dad has been real restless at night, and he got up during the night and fell and broke some ribs. I don't think he was conscious yesterday while H was there.

Anyway, whether it was a good idea or not, I sent the email to OMW. I bc'ed H on it. He has not acknowledged the email in any way. He wouldn't send me her email address that he claimed to have, so I searched online for one yesterday. I only found two - one connected to her work, the other connected to OM's business. I chose the one connected to her work, as I was afraid OM might have access to the other one. If I still had a FB account I guess I could have contacted her via FB, but I've not had FB since the first D-Day.

I've had no response from OMW yet. It's possible she can't check work email from home and has not gone back to work yet - I'd hoped she would have access to work email from home (I didn't get an out of office autoreply or anything like that).

And H was very cold to me yesterday. Terse replies to texts and emails. Did not want to kiss me goodnight. He walked away from me to the garage and I asked for a goodnight kiss (maybe I shouldn't ask?). He glared at me but stopped at the door. This after an afternoon of amazing SF on Sunday.

I went to bed thinking that my attempt to contact OMW was a mistake. Not that she doesn't deserve to know, I don't mean that. That seeking - along with my family and friends, who all kind of think the same thing - is right, NOTHING I do can possibly appease my H. And I would do anything. If that is self-debasement, so be it. I can't possibly go any lower than I did when I gave myself to another man.

My birthday is tomorrow. Yay, me. I think I need a break from the boards for a while. I am not in a good place and I don't know how to get to one anymore.

Thank you for all the advice. seeking, I am sorry if I was rude to you in my post. I love my H despite everything that I have done to him and maybe I was misguidedly trying to defend him. You are right about one thing, though. I have to find some confidence in myself again, I have to stop hating myself for what I did. Logically, I understand that my acts of adultery don't define who I am now. Spiritually, I profess to be a Christian (though faith is a struggle for me) so I know that God forgives our sins if we ask Him...God doesn't see me as an adulterous wh*re (or a murderer, I can't forget the abortion I had 16 years ago). I have a difficult time seeing myself as God sees me because I am so focused on how my H sees me (hence the struggle with faith). It's easy for me to "know" all this, but living it is a different story.

All I have to say is that I love my H. I wish he'd read the things I say, I wish he could understand it (me?) all somehow. I wish he could be assured of what is in my heart, that I KNOW why the A happened, I regret it and the lies with every fiber of my being, I know what to do to avoid another one, that OM was and is NOTHING compared to him...I know what to do to be the best wife I can be and what I need to do on my end to have an amazing marriage. And more than anything I want that with HIM, not anyone else. That I'll never stop wanting my H, wishing he'd take my hand and let's rebuild US.

WPG,

It's never wrong to make ammends.

This part of the process needs to have closure in order for it to stop triggering your H. Sending the email will offer both you and your H the closure necessary to now move forward. I'm guessing from your emotional outpouring that you were expecting some kind of praise from your H..... But that's not how it works. Typically these ammends cause a short term triggering that sends your spouse right back to D-Day again. But it's a process that can't be avoided. It just takes time. If you have some other ammends to make, do not avoid or postpone them, you'll just prolong the recovery both you and your H need.

Listen, you and your H would not be having a Sunday of wonderful SF if your weren't making progress. There will be one good day out of every 10 or 12 for maybe 3 months time...... then two good days out of every ten or twelve for maybe another 3 months and on and on until most days are very good.... IT'S A PROCESS!!!

I do pray your H get's on board with things soon though or he's going to find himself with a big red ring around his rear end from sitting on his pity pot for too long...... And WPG, you best be mindful of that as well.... your own pity pot is a pityful place to sit yanno.


BTW..... Happy Birthday!

1) Happy birthday, WPG.

2)^^^^^ What da bear said.

I had 1 good day last week. One. O-N-E. The rest of the entire week I was sick with anger.

Didn't really have to have huge triggers, FWW is textbook at meeting EN's and avoiding LB's... we get every ounce of UA time we can each and every day... and I still spent most of the week unable to look at her, not wanting to talk to her... I didn't even really want her to touch me.

I did it all anyway. I nuked... TWICE.

Nope, sir. I don't think I like it. But, it's a process. It's a rollercoaster. You have to hang on.


FWW and I were talking about you and your H, and she may post some time, but I'll tell you what she said;

"She's there, and she's standing in the fire, getting burnt to a crisp - and he isn't in the fire. Every time he takes a step back, she takes 3."

You each have a wall around you; he of pain, shock, and anger - you of shame, guilt, and sadness. Those walls are keeping you apart, and since you each have this shell around yourselves neither of you can really get at the wall of the other.

His wall is crushing him. It's muting him. And yours is beginning to do the same to you.

It's lose/lose.

Happy Birthday WPG!

(((WPG)))

Happy Birthday! Hang in there!

WPG, Part II of "Love the Way You Lie," her perspective;



Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie
Ohhh, I love the way you lie

On the first page of our story
the future seemed so bright
then this thing turned out so evil
I don't know why I'm still surprised
even angels have their wicked schemes
and you take that to new extremes
but you'll always be my hero
even though you've lost your mind


Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie
Ohhh, I love the way you lie


Now there's gravel in our voices
glass is shattered from the fight
in this tug of war, you'll always win
even when I'm right
'cause you feed me fables from your hand
with violent words and empty threats
and it's sick that all these battles
are what keeps me satisfied

Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie
Ohhh, I love the way you lie



So maybe I'm a masochist
I try to run but I don't wanna ever leave
til the walls are goin' up
in smoke with all our memories

[Him]
This morning, you wake, a sunray hits your face
smeared makeup as we lay in the wake of destruction
hush baby, speak softly, tell me I'll be sorry
that you pushed me into the coffee table last night
so I can push you off me
try and touch me so I can scream at you not to touch me
run out the room and I'll follow you like a lost puppy
baby, without you, I'm nothing, I'm so lost, hug me
then tell me how ugly I am, but that you'll always love me
then after that, shove me, in the aftermath of the
destructive path that we're on, two psychopaths but we
know that no matter how many knives we put in each other's backs
that we'll have each other's backs, 'cause we're that lucky
together, we move mountains, let's not make mountains out of molehills,
you hit me twice, yeah, but who's countin'?
I may have hit you three times, I'm startin' to lose count
but together, we'll live forever, we found the youth fountain
our love is crazy, we're nuts, but I refused counselin'
this house is too huge, if you move out I'll burn all two thousand
square feet of it to the ground, ain't you can do about it
with you I'm in my mind, without you, I'm out it

Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie
Ohhh, I love the way you lie

Hi all...sorry for staying away so long. I feel a little like I've lost this as a place to be honest since I think H reads my threads. Not that I mind, but I didn't want him to see just how hopeless I really felt, you know?

Thanks for the b-day wishes. I wish it had turned out a better day, but I'd be lying if I said it was a good b-day. H completely ignored it. I was determined not to let him know that it upset me, so I didn't mention it other than to say there was some chocolate cake in the kitchen that my mom had made if he'd like a piece. And I was pretty good at not mentioning the dang b-day to him at all till last night a Chuck E Cheese commercial came on and I joked that he could have taken me there for my b-day. I understand that he doesn't feel like celebrating but it still hurt big time.

And I was reasonably OK until Sunday, even though he slept on the couch Friday night. Sunday I just broke. I found some letters he had written me early in recovery. One of them was from the Love Dare and was written while I was lying to him about the A not being a PA. The second was a longer letter about his last serious relationship before me and other things, about how he built his wall, and how he felt about me when we met. I can't remember when that was written - during the lies or after. It wasn't written recently. In both he admitted to not being a good husband, not loving me the way I needed, etc. In the longer letter, he closed with how he wanted me to help him to forgive me. How he wanted me to help him learn to live and love.

I found those letters and I got so angry. Angry at him, angry at myself, angry at the whole stupid situation. I started slamming stuff around, stomping around, just being a stupid child. He was on the couch and had fallen asleep, and finally snapped, "What's your problem?" I snapped back I didn't have a problem.

He ended up going w/my dad to pick up a car he'd had some work done on. When he got home he acted like nothing was the matter and we took the kids out to eat, picked a couple things up at the store (I was so excited I found him hockey-theme Christmas ornaments - I used to buy him one every year and then it got so I couldn't find them and stopped...and I kind of thought he didn't care anyway, to be honest) and rode around looking at Christmas lights.

Anyway, we talked a bit after the kids went to bed and I was trying real hard to be upbeat. Then he just up and says "Goodnight" and goes to bed. I couldn't take it. I couldn't go lay in our bed another night and want something with my H that he'll never be willing to give me after what I did. I slept in the other bedroom Sunday night and moved into the bonus room and slept on the couch last night. I know I shouldn't have done it and I'll probably get a 2X4 for it. I can't tell you the last time I heard him say he loved me. The last time he really kissed me was when we last had SF, and that was nearly 10 days ago.

So this morning I made copies of his letters and put them in an envelope with a letter of my own. I told him that finding these letters was part of why I was so upset on Sunday. That I'm mostly angry at myself. I told him how I read the part about me helping him to forgive me, and how I've failed to do that. That I have tried to be the wife he needed me to be but I have failed. I'm not strong enough to live every day and face his hatred, and that I just couldn't come to bed and lie there and be oceans away from him, when all I wanted to do was be his best friend and help him through this with his dad, hold him and tell him that everything would be OK, that together we can get through anything. I told him how I'd loved him since the morning he came back to me (lol, can't remember if I mentioned in our history we kinda hooked up all those years ago as a "booty call"...I figured he was going to be a one-night-stand and use me like so many other men had but he proved to me that he was different...God I love him so much...and sometimes I hate him too...) And I said if he had any love left for me, to please come back to me again, take me in his arms, and I swear I'll never let him go.

Screwing up left and right, that's me. Freaking mess. I know that recovery is a long process and now H has his dad to deal with. H is in such a bad place and I want to help him, I want him to just give me a little crack in that wall to let me love him. I want him to take a step towards me, not away - or really, just stop standing in one place because it's quicksand...

Oh, and not a word of response to the email I sent to OMW. I can only assume she has not received it - maybe she hasn't gone back to work and is not checking email...I can't imagine that anybody would receive a message like that and not respond.

Anyway, thanks for those of you who are still reading and responding on my sitch...one thing I do believe is that MB is awesome stuff. All the books I've read MB looks to be the best tool for having a passionate, romantic and fulfilling M. But I just don't believe one spouse can do it on their own. Maybe, just maybe, even realizing that nothing I could do then or now controls my H, I could have brought H around on my own if I'd found it before the A.

Now? I believe that MB CAN help a M to recover, but both the WS and the BS have to be willing to engage in it. Even baby steps. But when one spouse - whether it be the BS or the WS - is completely unwilling to engage then...well, you get my sitch.

And don't get me wrong - the BS is completely within their rights NOT to engage. They have the "get out of marriage free" card. But I don't understand why it hasn't been played. If he hates me so much, if he's so miserable with me, if I can't give him what he needs, then why stay? He didn't want to stay only for the "sake of the kids." Nor do I. They know we are miserable. DD#2 said to me last night, she was telling me how she wanted her daddy to quit smoking, and I said yeah, we both (meaning me & H) need to quit. She said, "But Mommy, you only smoke when you are sad, and you're sad." I asked her why did she think I was sad, kinda had to pry it out of her, she didn't want to tell me...she responded, "Because Daddy doesn't like you." Oh geez...I tried to explain to her that I'd hurt Daddy's feelings and done something really mean to him and Daddy was just hurting. We've had the convo before - just to try and reassure them that none of this was their fault, that it was Mommy's fault and that Mommy was sorry and trying very hard to make things up to Daddy.

Sorry for the rambling update. It takes too dang long to post here at work, with everything going on it's taken most of the morning. Just wanted to post what was going on with us, don't really think there's any advice that anybody can give us other than what's been said, but I just didn't want y'all to think I'd disappeared!

ahhh...fudge... Got this email from H. Shaking.