WPG,

I agree with Maritalbliss, you Do have to tell him, and Be very clear and specific, that You want to keep fighting for your M. He needs to understand that you are not giving up on Him or your M. Now, please don't say that it is what it's best for your DD's or anything close to that, because he's going to say that you should have thought about DD's before deciding to have sex with another man!!! Sadly, but true. I would, IMHO, and the vets can correct me if I'm wrong, talk about how much You have change and learn through MB, about your NEW boundaries and how to protect your M. That you would love to have a chance to show him how much you have change. Let him know that together (under the same roof!!!), you can acomplish that.

Now, I still believe that if he wants you out of the house, it is your moral responsibility to accept it. That, I believe doesn't show that you are giving up, on the contrary, I believe it shows that You are owning your mistakes, and that you are accepting them.

It is not fair that he have to leave the marital house, when you were the one who failed.

Try to convince him, that it is best to stay together, and to give you a chance to heal together. POJA the decision together, and try to contact Steve, and see if you can get FBH onboard, too. Try everything before leaving.

Stay strong!!!!

I have asked for divorce/separation for no less than 3 times so far.

ASKED. Not left, not kicked her out. Asked.

Would not be here had she said yes, or accepted any terms I offered.

WPG,

I'm not saying that you should pack your stuff right away and leave. You have to talk to him, and try to do your best to let him understand that you would do whatever it takes to work on the M. That you want the oportunity to stay Together under the same roof. Ask him to make a list of things that he wants you to do in order to give you a second chance.

He might think about it, and it will buy you time. No matter what, you should keep working on Plan A. And you have to focus on HIM, his healing!, not yours (for now).

I'll pray for you...

WPG,

Let me add... Before moving to the US, ElC decided that he was done, and moved out. We had already rented our home, but were suppose to stay for a month or so, before moving to the US. I had to go live with one of my sisters. In the meantime, I kept asking ElC for another chance, he was "determined" to end the relationship. He even told me to stay in PR with DD's, and that he would move to the US alone.

I told him that it was better if I move to US with DD's because even if we were not together, at leastDD's were going to be able to see their dad. I kept telling him, that since the house had a basement with a room and bathroom, we could leave in the same house, but in different areas (if that will suit him). I try to offer as many options as I could. He kept saying that as soon as I move to the house, he would leave and rent a house.

Well guess what, we are still living under the same roof, as roommates (no affection from his side), but still together. I pray to keep having the chance to prove him that I have change, and that I want to help him heal and work on our M.

Nevertheless, if one day he ask me to leave, because he is done, I will have to accept it. Not right away!!!!!, but if after talking with him, he still decided that he was done, I guess I will have to leave. You have to be strong, and fight to stay together (no LB's, AO, etc), but at the end of the day, it is his decision, IMHO....

Don't lose hope, and keep fighting, the good fight. Like I told you, my FBH seemed to be sure to leave me, but we are still together....

I found some evidence of my own. Found a thumb drive where he had saved all the info he had about my A, which he'd told me repeatedly was destroyed. In fact, we burned it together.

There is a file on there downloaded Dec. 9, 2010 containing sample separation agreements. Looks like he was already planning this. This was before I LB'ed over my b-day. Dec. 5 we had pretty intense SF. And we were intimate the other morning but I guess that was nothing.

There are copies of work timesheets and all kinds of info from the computer I can't make sense of, too. Computer logs from March of this year, which I can't figure out, keylogger data, looks like.

I just figured out what it is. He put something on my work laptop. I took the laptop with me on a work trip. He saved the file from that week. I purposely left the computer lying around the house when I got home because I did not have anything to hide. There's some venting emails on there to my girlfriends. Ha there is an email on there to one of the girls who works w/me and I said "I miss you too, lol." Followed up by "let me know how it goes with your mamma on Thurs" (her mom has breast cancer and she had asked off to take her to the doc). Nothing out of the ordinary unless I can be charged for visiting webkinz world on a state-owned computer.

I completely understand and deserve the lack of trust.

I'm not leaving. I'm not giving up on the M. I can't decide what I am feeling, I go from completely despondent to angry to numb to crying to wanting to hit something...

I went through our emails from the last year. Found one from H Feb. 6, 2010: "Please don't give up on me. I need you now more than ever."

I have a copy/paste file of text logs from Feb 2010 - along with the Cell # for the OM.

I routinely check phone calls, texts, FB. I intermittently physically check her phone.

If I had the resources, that phone would have flexispy, the computer would have a keylogger (I also partially consider this for keeping tabs on DD13).

That lack of "trust" keeps me safe. Keeps my marriage safe... kind of.

One misstep and I step.

The venting e-mails suck... but checking for that type of activity is what lead me to discover the truth.

We can't possibly know what's in our WS's head... and even after things move on, it's impossible to believe what we are told.

(((((WPG)))))

Oh, WPG, I feel for you!

Stay strong, girl.

There are so many of us out here praying for you and broken.

Your H has so much sadness on his plate right now, with the death of his father, and the time-frame.

Don't lose hope.

I truly wish I could give you a hug in person right now.

Stay Strong!!

QFT

DO NOT GIVE IN. DO NOT QUIT!



He never thought he cared so much about the minute hand
Until he started praying for, a second chance
If he could only do it all again
He'd trade the long nights that he spent behind his desk
For all he missed

He tells his wife "I wish that this moment in this room was not me dying, but just spending a little time with you."

You only get just one time around
You only get one shot at this
One chance, to find out
The one thing that you don't wanna miss
One day when it's all said and done
I hope you see that it was enough, this
One ride, one try, one life...
To love....

She never thought she cared so much about those little hands
That held on tight the day she left
Til she was scared to death
Sitting all alone on a hotel bed, the end of the road
The sun had set on her big plans
To feel young again

She picks up the phone, dials the number, hears that little voice
That's haunted every single mile, since she made that choice

You only get just one time around
You only get one shot at this
One chance, to find out
The one thing that you don't wanna miss
One day when it's all said and done
I hope you see that it was enough, this
One ride, one try, one life...
To love............

You only get just one time around
Only get one shot at this
One chance, to find out
The one thing that you don't wanna miss
One day when it's all said and done
I hope you see that it was enough, this
One ride, one try, one life........
One ride, one try, one life........
To love....
To love....
mmmmmm......

The venting to the girlfriends back in March was as a result of him ignoring me while I was on the trip. He did not respond to my texts and emails, had recently sent me a very mean email (before the trip) and I was upset, and I felt "punished." Stupid venting. After finding MB, I have done so much better in avoiding things that are LBs. I've learned so much, but I guess I wonder now what is the point?

I just sent this response to his email:


tst - you said something earlier about ADs - he went totally off his script, on his own, not per dr's orders.

Harmony, thank you for bumping Dorry's thread. I had started reading it at work but had to leave for a bit so will finish this afternoon.

Thank you everyone for your thoughts and prayers. Please keep them coming. I strangely can't even make myself pray right now, and I don't seem to have any tears left. I honestly don't know what I am feeling right now. More empty than anything else.

I deserve this, I know. And on one hand, I do agree with Rizos that me leaving is what I deserve. I broke this. It's my fault. Yes, we were both responsible for our M before the A. But what I did is totally my decision. Nothing anyone said, did, whatever, nothing justifies it. H shouldn't have to suffer any more than he already has. But I cannot - I will not - abandon the girls. I will not stop wanting to be married to H.

geez, HHH...I just said I didn't think I had any tears left, and you go and make me cry...

Don't feel bad, after I posted, I went into the kitchen to get DD4 something for breakfast, and made snot bubbles...

I can tell.... But like I said, that's way off topic now! Don't go there, OK.

If your H is willing to talk to Steve Harley again, then Steve can discuss AD's at that point.

I guess if we all got what we deserved..... We'd all be nailed to a cross, wouldn't we!

Abandoning your girls would be a poor choice.... all because of a past poor choice.... That's not wise or good....
I wouldn't be expressing this advice to you unless I knew you were a repentent wayward.
Keep up the good work, OK!

Keep in mind that there are only two ways to really release pent up stress/emotions.... Laughter or Tears. I believe some tears are appropriate for the situational stress you are feeling.

But,,,,, Let it all out and get back up, so you can make good decisions. You are useless to your H and your girls if you remain a slobbering mess.
Surrender to God, and be O&H with your Husband and believe in miracles as I do!

WPG,

Stop beating yourself up. It's true what HPB says, You are a repentant FWW!, you and All of Us (repentant WS and BS) deserve a better future!!!

Now, it's time to Concentrate on Your FBH feelings and healing, and not You! Trust me, I understand how you feel, and how hard it is to even try to recover an M.

Somedays I lose all hope, and then others I'm ready to fight back for my M. You need to focus on Him, and stop dwelling on minor details. It is Ok for him to keep info related to the affair (for now), it is not helpful for either of you, but whenever he's ready, he'll get rid of it. We are all different, for some BS is easier to work on restoring their M, for others is just harder. My FBH knows all about MB, he knows that in order to restore our love we have to spend time together, etc. For now, he has chosen to do the opposite, and I have chosen to keep working on Plan A to give him time to heal.

It's hard to give without any expectations, definitely easier said than done. You have to take easy, relax, breath in, breath out and keep working on being a better you. That will be more attractive to your FBH, than a person who keeps being sorry for herself!

He's still very hurt, you have to keep it together, and like he said, don't give up on him. You are going to take a little crap here an there, but keep he took a lot more. Don't lose hope, keep it together, and be ready for New Years Eve. You are the one that have to be strong now, and you CAN!!!!!

Stop telling him everytime that you see him to forgive you, instead be there for him, as much as he lets you. Do things for him, even if he doesn't ask. If he doesn't say thanks, don't worry, be happy that you did a good thing for him. Take one day at a time. You are still married, aren't you? Just keep adding everyday a little bit....

Take care, and don't lose hope.......

You have made yourself suffer enough!

I have seen the sincerity in your words, I can feel the emotions that you post with...and it makes me sad that you are still hurting yourself, punishing yourself, and taking ALL the responsibility on yourself it seems.

Yes, you made a bad choice. You have repented. We all make bad choices from time to time...we are human. Often times, it seems, people DON'T take responsibility for their choices...they don't repent for their actions and make plans to not repeat them.

Your husband, it would seem, cannot let go of the past and see the future that you two can (should!) have together as a loving couple.

Its hard...I know.

If I am honest with myself, I still have word docs saved showing all the things that I learned when I recently discovered my wife's emotional affair.

Guess what?

I'm going to make my post here...and then go and delete them.

A couple weeks ago, even when everything was going good between my wife and I....I looked at those messages they'd sent.

Guess what?

I GOT ANGRY

I got upset and it really threw my positive mood right out the window for awhile that day.

Hanging onto that stuff does NO GOOD. All it does it hurt...and I, for one, don't want to hurt anymore.

I will pray that your husband can find it in his heart to release the anger he has, that he can find the wisdom to look forward and to walk this journey with you as his wife.

tst, H was unwilling to participate in any coaching sessions with the Harleys. I had 2 sessions with Jennifer Chalmers and we focused on what I could do to try and encourage him to participate in MB. He felt like he'd had enough of counseling (been to 2 different MCs, one who he saw on an IC basis later, he also went to a psych/MD and was meeting with the pastor once a week until the last couple months or so). Even mentioning that what they do is more education/coaching and less of a traditional counseling approach didn't interest him.

I guess my question is, how do I deal with him now? Do I continue to try to make contact as if nothing has happened (sending goodnight texts, sending emails, etc) or what?

Things were going better until his dad took his turn for the worse. We had bought a bunch of stuff for the house for improvements we planned to make - I mean, literally I have a living room full of 2000+ square feet of laminate floor in cartons. I felt like even though we still had our rough moments, we were making plans for the future, our future together. Our home.

On a related subject, my mom's sister and her husband from out of state is visiting. She had an A and married her A partner. Quite honestly I'd planned on avoiding them this week - my grandma (God bless her) has told her everything and she'd been wanting to talk to me for a while. I was figuring she would spout some "Follow your heart" garbage and I didn't want to hear it. I had called Mom this afternoon and my aunt is in the background going "Give me the phone, let me talk to her." Whereupon she told me how she "knew exactly what I was going through" etc. I thought, like he77 she does! Yeah, maybe we are the same in that we both betrayed our husbands and degraded ourselves for the attention of another man, but she didn't want or even TRY to recover her M, she walked away. How in he77 does she know what I am going through NOW??? She said if I didn't feel like coming over she'd be glad to come hang out with me so I wouldn't be alone. Blah blah.

H hasn't responded to my email nor has he called to talk to the girls. SHould I even try to take the girls to see him this weekend, assuming he's still at his stepmom's? I honestly don't know what I should do.

Sincere praise and admiration... they go hand in hand with making love bank deposits...

Yes,
Continue to make contact.
Continue to keep the girls involved.
Continue to show up.
Continue to Plan A.
Continue to demonstrate your willingness to care.
Continue to email him.
Continue to tell him about your plans to remain married to him.
Continue to protect him.
Continue to be transparent.
Continue to be O&H.
Continue to follow EP's.
Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue......
Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue......
Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue......
Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue......
Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue......
Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue...... Continue......

WPG,

You need to lighten up? You have to stop trying to control how your FBH reacts to your actions. My God, I can relate with you so much, that it actually hurts to even try to help you! I used to be just like you, literally thinking about what I did or did not to make him feel Ok or bad! Guess what, I realize thanks to MB friends that I can not control his reactions, but I can definitely control how I react to his own reactions.

WPG, he needs you to be strong, specially when he's in his meanest state. Like I told you before, that doesn't mean that you are going to be a Giver forever, but for now you have to still keep working, against all odds!

I was going nuts, if BH was upset because he couldn't practice BJJ (martial art), I would be going crazy thinking what I had done wrong. It was killing me and ultimately our relationship. Don't get me wrong, last week I was like, this is it, I'm done. But then, I remember that it's not about me, and I have to fight for Us. Hopefully someday he will join me, and I hope to be there for him. Now I don't worry about every single detail. I make h breakfast, dinner, buy stuff that I know he needs, etc. He on the contrary doesn't even talk to me unless it is necessary, no SF, not even a kiss.

What I do, I kiss him goodbye every morning!!!!! If he moves to the end of the bed I kiss him, and touch him! He doesn't responds, but he's still sleeping on the same bed! It hurts to be rejected and it's really hard, but I'm making sure that if he decides to leave me, he'll remember how great I was at the end. I want him to remember good Rizos, and to miss the things that I did for him!

Send him a good night email, keep it light. If he responds cool, if he doesn't or tells you to avoid sending him emails (like ElC told me once), don't feel bad. Just remember that you are doing the right thing by sending him an email, and start feeling good about it.

Of course visit him, offer to bring the girls. Use any oportunity to be close to him, without being overly aggresive. Remember, you do have to respect his feelings.

About family, you know. The Harley tell everybody to tell family and close friends for exposure and support to keep us accountable NOT for counseling. I know that after we tell them, they want to add their 'knowledge', but unless they are pro MB, you should just respecfully ignore them. That's what I do with my family!!!! If it was for them, I would be divorced already, and probably with OM, you know, as long as I'm happy even for a short period of time! So stick to MB advice, and keep working at your M, you are doing great.....

Sorry for the lenghty answered.... , and keep in mind that English is my 2nd language!

^

WPG - you blasted the guy in the temple with a lead pipe. You've been applying triage, and trying to stand him back up. Then you stop, and you look at the damage you cause, and you recoil in shock - then you let go, and he's on his [censored] again.

Then you go back to trying to get him on his feet, rinse, repeat.

Yeah, he's going to hit points where he's like "Will you get the hell away from my, ya crazy harpy? I'll get up on my own now, thanks!"

And then you recoil. And he just sits there and bleeds.

Since when does anyone know what they really want? There are very few things in life that we can honestly say that we want, that we NEED, with every fiber of our being.

If that is what you are saying about your H, then prove it.


When you love someone - really, truly love someone - when is enough enough?