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 Have I mentioned things are looking up?  Hurray!
BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
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Hi Prisca! I am so happy to see you posting here and being open about things.  I hope you and Markos have a wonderful vacation!
Happily married to HerPapaBear
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Have I mentioned things are looking up? Oh, goodie - I just clicked on your thread and this is the first thing I saw. That's a great thing to read, Prisca!
D-Day 2-10-2009
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Hey, Prisca? Want to check in with us?
D-Day 2-10-2009
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It hasn't been a good day. The last few days have been great, but today was a disaster. It was an exhausting day full of activities yesterday, and I had a hard time waking up for UA time this morning at 6:00. It wasn't that I didn't want UA, like Markos accuses me of. It wasn't that I decided that I wasn't going to pay attention to him, as he accuses me. I just had a hard time waking up. This has not been normal for me for the last few months -- I usually show up for UA enthusiastically and ready to enjoy each other. I realize it hurt him. I would've liked to have made it up to him. Once I did wake up, I got up and put on a movie for the kids, so that Markos and I could make up the lost time together alone in our room. But it's been one DJ after AO after DJ from Markos ever since. He even yelled at me on the beach, which was embarrassing on top of being painful. What I posted to Dr. Harley this morning: Dr. Harley,
Do I have to listen to complaints when they are full of lovebusters? We are having a conflict over UA time, and Markos is accusing me of not wanting to spend time with him. He had an AO and made threats over it, telling me he deserves better than me and reminding me of how much I tortured him last year, and made accusations that I'm not willing to work the MB program. He made threats along the lines of "I'm not going to live like this," which to me sounded like "straighten up or I'm leaving you."
It is not true that I do not want to spend time with him. I have thrown myself into UA time, and have enjoyed the time we have together.
He is refusing to talk to me unless I listen to these complaints of his. His tone has been very demanding and harsh all morning, and he refuses to listen to how he has lovebusted me. I'm willing to try to work with him to make UA time better for him, but I don't like the way he is treating me. Do I have to listen to his complaints when he is treating me like this?
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Prisca, sweetie, I'm going to wait a little bit to think about what you've posted before I say much about that, except for two things: 1. Dr. Harley,
Do I have to listen to complaints when they are full of lovebusters? What was the point of your email to Dr. H? You know the answer to this. Think. What is your real question? 2. Dr. H himself has underscored the importance of getting enough sleep in a successful marriage. Are you burning both ends of the candle too often? Are you getting enough rest normally?
D-Day 2-10-2009
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Thank you Marriage Builders!
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Prisca, sweetie, I'm going to wait a little bit to think about what you've posted before I say much about that, except for two things: 1. Dr. Harley,
Do I have to listen to complaints when they are full of lovebusters? What was the point of your email to Dr. H? You know the answer to this. Think. What is your real question? 2. Dr. H himself has underscored the importance of getting enough sleep in a successful marriage. Are you burning both ends of the candle too often? Are you getting enough rest normally? Am I understanding that you are on vacation and waking up at 6:00 to satisfy his request for UA? Am I understanding that he CRIED this morning because he believed you had fallen asleep while he was talking to you?
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Prisca, What you posted here It hasn't been a good day. The last few days have been great, but today was a disaster.
It was an exhausting day full of activities yesterday, and I had a hard time waking up for UA time this morning at 6:00. It wasn't that I didn't want UA, like Markos accuses me of. It wasn't that I decided that I wasn't going to pay attention to him, as he accuses me. I just had a hard time waking up. This has not been normal for me for the last few months -- I usually show up for UA enthusiastically and ready to enjoy each other.
I realize it hurt him. I would've liked to have made it up to him. Once I did wake up, I got up and put on a movie for the kids, so that Markos and I could make up the lost time together alone in our room. But it's been one DJ after AO after DJ from Markos ever since.
He even yelled at me on the beach, which was embarrassing on top of being painful. Is not the same as what you posted to Dr Harley: Dr. Harley,
Do I have to listen to complaints when they are full of lovebusters? We are having a conflict over UA time, and Markos is accusing me of not wanting to spend time with him. He had an AO and made threats over it, telling me he deserves better than me and reminding me of how much I tortured him last year, and made accusations that I'm not willing to work the MB program. He made threats along the lines of "I'm not going to live like this," which to me sounded like "straighten up or I'm leaving you."
It is not true that I do not want to spend time with him. I have thrown myself into UA time, and have enjoyed the time we have together.
He is refusing to talk to me unless I listen to these complaints of his. His tone has been very demanding and harsh all morning, and he refuses to listen to how he has lovebusted me. I'm willing to try to work with him to make UA time better for him, but I don't like the way he is treating me. Do I have to listen to his complaints when he is treating me like this? Your post to Dr Harley makes markos's comments sound as if they came out of the blue. I'm not saying that being too sleepy for UA at 6AM was wrong; I am just pointing out that you did not tell Dr Harley the context of markos's disappointment. What did Dr Harley reply?
BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
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What was the point of your email to Dr. H? You know the answer to this. Think. What is your real question? That was my real question. Markos was insisting that I had to sit and listen to his "complaints" even though his "complaints" were full of DJs and he was pretty terse. He would not listen to me when I told him I wasn't going to sit there and take it, and insisted that I wasn't following MB. He wouldn't listen to me, but I knew he would listen to Dr. Harley. Markos has asked me in the past to go to Dr. Harley when Markos is treating me wrong, because Dr. Harley can get through to him for me. So I did. 2. Dr. H himself has underscored the importance of getting enough sleep in a successful marriage. Are you burning both ends of the candle too often? Are you getting enough rest normally? I usually do get enough. I lost a lot this last week due to getting ready for the trip, and I was running low on sleep this morning. Markos runs low on sleep quite often.
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Am I understanding that you are on vacation and waking up at 6:00 to satisfy his request for UA? It's not his request for UA. It's the time that we both agreed on, and both were looking forward to. I've been enjoying our morning time together, actually. He's not forcing UA time on me. I want it, too. I just had a difficult time getting started this morning, and he took it as being wrong motives on my part. He assumes that I am doing what I did last year -- agreeing to UA, but skipping out on it whenever I can. I'm not doing that, but I think it triggered the memories and he lost it. I've been so desperate for him lately, more than I've ever been. I want UA so bad. I missed it this morning, too. Am I understanding that he CRIED this morning because he believed you had fallen asleep while he was talking to you? Yes he did, and I don't fault him for that. Not one bit. I cry too when I've been disappointed. I had no problem with him crying. All I felt for that was concern. The only problem I had came later, when he lovebusted me. I don't believe his crying was manipulative in the least bit. His tears were genuine, and his disappointment valid.
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Yes he did, and I don't fault him for that. Not one bit. I cry too when I've been disappointed. I had no problem with him crying. All I felt for that was concern. The only problem I had came later, when he lovebusted me.
I don't believe his crying was manipulative in the least bit. His tears were genuine, and his disappointment valid. In fact, Dr. Harley has told me that Markos needs more UA time than I do -- which makes us kind of an anomaly, since it is usually the woman who needs more UA than the man. But that is why he is so much more desperate when UA is missed than I am.
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Your post to Dr Harley makes markos's comments sound as if they came out of the blue.
I'm not saying that being too sleepy for UA at 6AM was wrong; I am just pointing out that you did not tell Dr Harley the context of markos's disappointment. I did not intend for that, and I'm sorry. What did Dr Harley reply? He says no other problems can be solved until AOs are eliminated.
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That was my real question. Markos was insisting that I had to sit and listen to his "complaints" even though his "complaints" were full of DJs and he was pretty terse. He would not listen to me when I told him I wasn't going to sit there and take it, and insisted that I wasn't following MB. He wouldn't listen to me, but I knew he would listen to Dr. Harley.
Markos has asked me in the past to go to Dr. Harley when Markos is treating me wrong, because Dr. Harley can get through to him for me. So I did. I don't understand. Is this something Dr. H thinks is a good idea? It would sound to me like Markos is removing himself from ownership of any of the hard discussions, and you agree with that plan. Is this correct?
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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Yes he did, and I don't fault him for that. Not one bit. I cry too when I've been disappointed. I had no problem with him crying. All I felt for that was concern. The only problem I had came later, when he lovebusted me.
I don't believe his crying was manipulative in the least bit. His tears were genuine, and his disappointment valid. Prisca, I appreciate that you feel his disappointment was valid, but I'm really having a hard time wrapping my mind around this. I mean, sheduling UA time is a basic maintenance project. You plan it, you carry it out. Sometimes, despite your best intentions, something gets in the way and you have to be flexible to work it in in another way. For Markos to cry? It seems like a very strong reaction to your exhaustion. Is there anything else going on that the two of you need to talk about, do you think? And quit looking at Markos' stuff while he's on his thread, okay, chickie?
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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That was my real question. Markos was insisting that I had to sit and listen to his "complaints" even though his "complaints" were full of DJs and he was pretty terse. He would not listen to me when I told him I wasn't going to sit there and take it, and insisted that I wasn't following MB. He wouldn't listen to me, but I knew he would listen to Dr. Harley.
Markos has asked me in the past to go to Dr. Harley when Markos is treating me wrong, because Dr. Harley can get through to him for me. So I did. I don't understand. Is this something Dr. H thinks is a good idea? It would sound to me like Markos is removing himself from ownership of any of the hard discussions, and you agree with that plan. Is this correct? No. By bringing Dr Harley into the discussion, Dr. Harley can bring Markos back to reality in a much better way than I ever could. Dr. Harley knocks sense into him when I cannot (because it would be a lovebuster for me to try). Markos knows this stuff better than I do, he just loses sight of it when he's angry or hurting, and needs someone whom he respects to knpck him over the head. He respects Dr. Harley in more ways than words can tell, so Dr. Harley seems to be the ideal person for me to go to.
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Yes he did, and I don't fault him for that. Not one bit. I cry too when I've been disappointed. I had no problem with him crying. All I felt for that was concern. The only problem I had came later, when he lovebusted me.
I don't believe his crying was manipulative in the least bit. His tears were genuine, and his disappointment valid. Prisca, I appreciate that you feel his disappointment was valid, but I'm really having a hard time wrapping my mind around this. I mean, sheduling UA time is a basic maintenance project. You plan it, you carry it out. Sometimes, despite your best intentions, something gets in the way and you have to be flexible to work it in in another way. For Markos to cry? It seems like a very strong reaction to your exhaustion. Is there anything else going on that the two of you need to talk about, do you think? And quit looking at Markos' stuff while he's on his thread, okay, chickie? Last year, Markos begged and begged me to have UA with him, and I often refused. The times I did have UA with him, I made it a miserable experience for him. I let him believe that if he just tried harder, and kept trying, that I would eventually give him UA. He basically plan A'd me for months on end, and I drove him into the ground. So any sign from me that I may not want UA brings back those awful memories, and causes him to panic. It's not just routine maintenance for him. It's a sign of whether or not I'm committed to our marriage. And he is very fearful that I'm not.
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So any sign from me that I may not want UA brings back those awful memories, and causes him to panic. It's not just routine maintenance for him. It's a sign of whether or not I'm committed to our marriage. And he is very fearful that I'm not. What are your actions showing him? I am still concerned about his reaction to your exhaustion. I know you're in a different place than H and I are, but when our UA time gets bollixed up by life, we catch it quickly. No tears. No recriminations. We just reschedule. Have you talked to Markos about this? I'm going to tell you this weird trick I heard that sounds as stupid as you can get - but it worked for us. During recovery, H and I had issues we needed to talk about that involved POJA. They were tricky issues, stuff that we would have squared off about in the past. We knew we couldn't butt heads like that anymore. So we'd start working on a POJA and start to square off. We'd back off, calm down, try again. It's tough for two strong-willed people to learn to POJA!  One of the things that helped us while we were learning was to hold hands while we were talking. Weird, yes? But oddly enough, it really helped us stay calm. Maybe that will help you two.
D-Day 2-10-2009
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Thank you Marriage Builders!
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We are just totally screwed up ...
Last edited by Prisca; 04/16/11 11:19 AM.
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BW
Married 1989
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2 kids.
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Before I edited that post, it was all about what I need to do to take care of Markos and avoid triggering him.
But I don't feel like doing anything for him right now. I feel like quitting. I do. He has lied to me for 3-4 years, and I'm bouncing between tears and being pissed. Right now, I'm pissed.
I need to go calm down.
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hello
by Woodham - 09/22/25 03:47 PM
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