CWMI:

So what is the compromise position? Oral sex is the highest form of intimacy possible. There are NO SUBSTITUTES for it. If we have oral sex, she loses. If we don't have it, I lose. There is NO MIDDLE GROUND as far as I can see.

Good grief...oral sex is the highest form of intimacy possible? Who says, Dr. Cemar?

Can you back up your opinion with proof from someone qualified to make this statement?

I doubt it but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt.

Or he does, and just gets a kick of continually making people rise to his bait.

Originally Posted By: Dr Harley
Uh, where do I begin. I can't tell you how many couples I've counseled where one spouse did just what you suggested -- sacrifice their own enjoyment for the pleasure of their spouse. The reason I'm counseling them, of course, is that the one doing the sacrificing eventually can't take giving without receiving anymore, and wants a divorce. One recent cases that comes to mind is a pastor's wife. He gave your message to his wife throughout their marriage. They have reconciled, but only because he finally understands the concept of mutual care. Unless both he and his wife enjoy their sexual experience, she comes to hate it. Now they make love almost every day, not out of sacrifice, but out of mutual enthusiastic agreement. By the way, they've given up OS.

It's dangerous stuff you're recommending. It ruins marriages.

Best wishes,
Dr. Harley

kerala:

We all have different definitions of intimacy. One way that I look at intimacy is "to make onself vulnerable to another". OS definitely about the man making himself vulnerable to his wife. She has COMPLETE control of the sitution. He is vulnerable to her. So from my perspective, it is a very intimate moment for me. In my case, my wife does not like to perform OS onme, so the message she is sending me is loud and clear, I am not important to her.

Good grief...oral sex is the highest form of intimacy possible? Who says, Dr. Cemar?

Can you back up your opinion with proof from someone qualified to make this statement?

I doubt it but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt.

"It seems that well-known relationship gurus "Dr." John Gray and "Dr." Barbara De Angelis have bogus credentials reports Men News Daily.

Apparently the two both obtained their touted "doctorates" from a "diploma mill" shut down two years ago by the California state attorney general's office.

Gray and De Angelis received doctorates from Columbia Pacific University, which California officials described as a "diploma mill" that issued "totally worthless degrees."

Nevertheless these lauded experts have been a hot ticket on the lecture circuit (Gray is $30,000-$50,000 and De Angelis starts at $15,000) and they hold forth on such popular TV shows as Oprah, Good Morning America, and Larry King Live.

Gray and De Angelis routinely pass themselves off with the attached title of "Ph.D."

Gray's bestseller Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus has sold 15 million copies worldwide and developed quite a cult following for the author.

De Angelis has written more than a dozen books, produced a video series, infomercial and was featured on CNN as a "relationship expert."

Some might think that John Gray is trained in psychology and/or counseling, but instead he has degrees in Eastern Philosophy and they are hardly Ivy League. Gray reportedly picked up both his Bachelor's and Master's from the Maharishi European Research University in Switzerland.

Maharishi Mahesh Yogi is the founder of the Transcendental Meditation (TM) movement. And Gray was once one of his celibate monks, before becoming a guru of sorts himself.

Well, maybe it takes a guru to make a guru.

De Angelis has more in common with Gray than a "worthless" Ph.D., the two were once married.

De Angelis was Gray's first wife, though he was her third husband. Barbara then went on to marry twice more, while John is still on his second marriage.

Another TM devotee magician Doug Henning was Barbara's second hubby. Maybe she met Gray while attending a seminar at Maharishi U? Wouldn't that be guru-romantic?

De Angelis did double duty as Henning's assistant in his magic act. Perhaps she is now playing the role of a "doctor" for her second act.

"Secrets for Making Love Work," is the title of a De Angelis produced video series. But will Barbara learn the secret herself the fifth time around?

And do these two phony "doctors" really posses the personal histories and/or credentials to commend them as "relationship experts"?

The popular radio "Sex Doctor" and perhaps the gold standard for a relationship guru might be Dr. Ruth Westheimer.

At least "Dr. Ruth" really is a doctor (Ph.D.) and though twice divorced, her third marriage has held together for more than four decades.

In fact both of Westheimer's children have an accredited Ph.D., which is more than you can say for either "doctors" John Gray or Barbara DeAngelis."

I hardly think earning a doctorate from a now-defunct, unaccredited "college" through a correspondence course makes her a legitimate authority on anything.

In my case, my wife does not like to perform OS onme, so the message she is sending me is loud and clear, I am not important to her.

De Angelis was Gray's first wife, though he was her third husband. Barbara then went on to marry twice more, while John is still on his second marriage.

Here's what I discovered about Barbara De Angelis and her so-called PH.D:

"De Angelis received a master's degree in psychology from Sierra University in Los Angeles,[3] and a Ph.D. in psychology from Columbia Pacific University.[4] She was awarded her degree from this now-defunct unaccredited institution after completing a correspondence course."

I hardly think earning a doctorate from a now-defunct, unaccredited "college" through a correspondence course makes her a legitimate authority on anything.