BTW, it is great to hear that you are scheduling with Steve Harley. He's great, and will be able to really help the two of you ...

No sarcasm. One of you alluded to calling family members for an intervention or to 'try and talk some sense into' one of you.

Calm down. That's not what he's acting like.

It is true that a neutral 3rd party, like the Harley's, will be more able to help you than either of your parents (who will be tempted to take sides).

And the Harley's have massive experience in handling situations like yours. It would be wiser to call the them instead of his parents.

Prisca,

you have no idea what happened last night. As for the AO on my half, yes it sure did come out. FYI I told him three times that I would talk to him in the AM and that I was barely awake. He came back with I can't believe your not responding, he was furious and all sorts of ugliness. So yes I was pushed to the limit. At first I was extremely calm and tried to handle it for as long as I could and he kept pushing. You were not there. All my AO's occur after trying to maintain and diffuse. So you tell me how much I should take when I've made my point, walk away. Again you were not there, didn't hear what was said. This is a serious nightmare!!

tgrace, I know you are offended by your H asking you about an A, but will you please listen to me? Getting angry about it or defensive will just make him more anxious. Try your best to use body language and a calm tone when reassuring him there is no A.

Yes, you did mention an intervention with your family about this issue before and I agree with KT that that is NOT the way to handle it. I literally cringe and feel very badly for your H when I hear that you suggest such a thing to him.

Anyway, you two will really like Steve, he is great. You could also email/call the radio show ~ the link is above towards the top of the page.

That is all I need to know.

AOs must be eliminated on your part, too. NOTHING he does ever deserves an AO. EVER.

Do you agree that AOs are abuse? You've just abused your husband, Grace. You've left him bruised and bleeding. What are you going to do about it?

How are you going to control your AOs in the future? What are you going to do the next time you are angry? How are going to protect your husband from yourself?

Grace, I understand it is a crisis. I have been just exactly like hilltopper.

I want you to know that your husband can learn to get his behavior under control. It is really encouraging that he is here wanting to work this program and that he is willing to talk to Steve Harley.

In the meantime, be aware that people who live with Selfish Demands, Disrespectful Judgments, and Angry Outbursts tend to develop the habit of responding with SDs, DJs, and AOs themselves. Anything you can do to stave off this tendency in yourself will help make it possible to build a good relationship on the other side.

My last post was written before I read this.

I don't hear that you did the one thing that could have helped diffuse this situation. I don't hear that you reassured your H that there is NO A and that you will do whatever you can to help convince him of this in a calm, non defensive way.

Grace, where do you want to be a year from now?

I've mentioned to Hill that you two remind me of Markos and me. You both seem to want a wonderful marriage, yet your posts about each other are so negative. When Markos and I first got here, our posts were focused on how wrong the other was -- how horrible the other was treating us. We were full of frustration and hurt, and that's what we focused on. We were both in full Taker mode, and way too busy pointing fingers and wanting to nitpick every single conflict.

Where did that get us?

We went through hell.

Here we are, a year later, starting over by doing things RIGHT. It breaks my heart to think that we could've had a wonderful marriage a year ago, if we had only been focused on caring for each other rather than being right.

Your husband thinks you may be having an affair? Don't get angry and incensed and have an AO. He's insecure -- be the balm that soothes his insecurity. Care for him. Be gentle. Do what ever it takes to reassure him and let him know that he is the only man in your life.

Do you want to be right? Or do you want to be in love?

You are not each others' enemy. Follow the program, and learn from each other how to care for each other.

Where do you want to be a year from now? In love? Or starting over?

LOL .... nope DEF not. If I was .. I would be suggesting a specific Brand of maca .. but the brand doesnt matter. As long as its certified organic, your good to go.

Also I am sorry you had an explosion of emotions last night. MY wife And I had something similar as that and my wife called my dad.

I had gotten to the point where I felt my wife didnt want me (she had said so many times how auful of a person I was) and I had tried for many years to win her back from our slump (before she took on MB) to the point that my wife said she wanted me to die and go away. I was furious and blinded by my own hurt from those words and the frusterations of my wife not loving me for SOO long. We had been fighting for days and weeks and that night we had been fighting for well over an hour, THEN I got my rifle out and was going to shoot my self in a blinded rage of tears. With my wife in a fetal position on our bed and me in a blind rage over her VERY hurtful words (our AO's, SD's and DJ's went on for days at a time during this crisis) I fumbled for my bullets and when i didnt manage to grasp them on the first reach i was then hit with a TON of bricks like god slapped my up side the head and dropped my rifle (I would have never hurt my family, just myself, becasue my wife had said she wanted me to die so in the heat of the dire situation i was going to fulfill that request) But killing myself would have hurt my family .. and then my dad came the next day (after my wife called him) and took my guns out of my house and said I would not get them back until I was stable emotionally. THAT Was when i finally descided to get some counselling .. which didnt last long til my wife adopted MB full heartedly and we dropped the MC.

Not long after .. my wife apologized for the things she said that fed my insecurity such as wanting me to die etc. She KNEW what buttons to push on me .. even if it was not intentional .. it was a habit that she overcame using MB and god. We BOTH overcame alot of emotional turmoil and now we are dealing with our kids who seem to get as emotional as we used to... but even that is now filtering away as we LEAD our family towards the security and comfort they need.

I know the severity of your situation and the feelings that go along with that dire need to FIX things .. and how easily it can escelate .. especially after both of you have put off your TAKERS instincts for such a long time.

Hang in there ... it gets better ... trust me! If I can do it ... you can.

MNG

p.s. I got my guns back after doing the MC and things had cooled off after diving in MB with my wife... just in time for hunting season. phew. I look back at that moment now and think .. WTF was I thinking!? It took 6 months to get my guns back from my dad after that .. and I am thankful he did that even tho I was mad at him at the time for doing so in whatever kind of emotional fog i was in.

Grace, not too long ago I exhibited behaviors similar to your husband while my husband behaved similarly to you. I actually did exactly what your H did last night a few times, waking my H up and demanding he talk to me and he responded with words like psycho and crazy.

I stumbled upon MB and over time, it changed everything for us (and my H isn't on board with MB, but he is aware of the basic concepts- so with you both on board your potential for success is greater). Let me explain how this change happened.

When I DJed and SDed it was because I needed my love bank filled and UA time and was feeling insecure. I learned, though MB, that it wasn't that I needed to learn to need my ENs met less (which is really difficult, if not impossible), instead, I needed to learn to ask for them to be met in a more productive way. At the same time, my H needed to get better at meeting my ENs. He resisted, in part, because I was annoying and in part, because he engages in a lot of independent behavior and didn't want to feel responsible for my happiness. But, with a little exposure to MB, he tried to meet my ENs more and there was a drastic reduction in my SDing and DJing.

Now, when I want a need met, I have learned to try to make my request fun and funny (but it took time for us to get there). He responds to that well most of the time, but when he doesn't, I struggle to not slip back into DJs and SDs. My point is, you are blaming this squarely on your husband, but you are at least 50% responsible for his behavior. You do things that make him feel more and less secure, and there is clearly a need for a shift in YOUR behavior.

Where do I want to be in a year? Anywhere but here in this position. I want to have a happy, healthy marriage. I take 100 percent responsibility for my AO. I went against my better judgment and should have stuck to my guns and got up and left.

Have you told him that?

MNG,

Thank you for sharing your story. For some strange reason I feel so much comfort reading it. I may have had a suicidal thought from such helplessness and depression but would NEVER attempt such a SELFISH act as well. I'm happy to hear that such a devastating story could turn around and make for such a happy marriage.

Nope Penni for thoughts. You need to read the thread. I am not "blaming this squarely on my husband" and please DO NOT put words in my mouth. I am half responsible for this matter and 100 percent responsible for neglect of affection and causing his insecurity and I see that. If I could take back any actions/behavior I have done since the baby was born I would to it in a heartbeat.

YOU are neglecting the fact that I have accepted MB (at first I didn't have much interest), I've sat down and worked on the workbook with him, starting reading the books, starting meeting his most important EN's affection, Sexual fulfillment, left open access for everything on the table, making efforts for UA time. Anything my husband has requested of me I have either tried or done. Hell, I even had sex with him two days later after he said I "had a loose vagina". I am responsible for my ugly words last night and I should have known better and from here on out I will walk away no matter what to avoid AO. The difference is I'm trying!! Do you hear me Penni for thoughts. I'm working at it everyday.

In fact last night I sensed something was wrong. No faces, just a bad vibe. Again the affection thing came up. I kissed him when he walked through the door, texted him all day and told him I love him. Later I asked my husband what he would like to do because we were basically sitting on the couch like vegies. I suggested we read. We even went upstairs and read MB and I wrote in the notebook. We tried cuddling but it didn't feel right, I sensed it again. So he went downstairs instead of going to sleep. I then sent him a message to come upstairs and really get quality cuddling which we did and I loved it and thought he loved it.

After we cuddled again he went downstairs and I fell asleep only to wake up to someone making accusations at me and telling me how much I suck in the affection department. So please excuse me I am trying to work on this marriage and I feel like my husband is taking us back to square one. I did not help the situation by flying off the handle. I'm on this forum to learn and get help. When I look back at day one just even a week and a half ago, I've already learned so much!!

Ok so glad I asked and did not contact my father in law. Thanks for smacking me around a little bit.

No because I really don't feel up to a conversation with him yet. But I will, not sure if that will be today or tomorrow. I HAVE told him I accept my responsibility for making him feel unloved and insecure several times.

I am glad you found some comfort in my story. Its a hard one for me to chew on and admit that it even happened, even typing it out is bringing my flash backs to that moment.

I was in such a DIRE need for my wife to be my wife ... that I was willing to do WHATEVER she asked of me. EVen if it was my own death. The sad part (but good part) was that my wife was NOT having an affair .. possibly an EA unintentionally from her guy friends she met online which created a contrast in her mind to compare me to through the conversations she had with them in comparison to what she had at home.

I am still to this day (even tho it was just last hunting season that it happened) very ashamed of myself for even THINKING of doing that ... let alone going through the motions of actually getting my rifle out and digging for a bullet in a blind rage of emotions .. and seeing my wife in a fetal position on our bed blinding herself with her hands over hre head and telling me to go ahead if i really felt that i needed to. ))*shivers*(( .. gah ... what an idiot i was. STILL AM sometimes too! lol .. but never like that again..... That was most likely the darkest time in my life .. next to my childhood growing up being bullied so often and having similar thoughts but no tools to do it.

I didnt come here and post in my thread very often to get help or perspective from an outside source BUT I SHOULD have so it didnt get to that point that it did ... i found it difficult to complain to the ppl here, when all their situations seems SOO much worse than mine .. yet they seemed to handle it far better than I did. *shrugs* I needed to get a better hold on my emotions and thats what I did. I started working out and getting her to notice my confidence i was building in myself ... once i did .. my wife came along for the ride and she is VERY thankful i found MB because she was very resistant to it for a LONG time. It was only AFTER she seen the changes in me and after the COSTS of MC that she considered MB at all.

You have come a LONG ways Tgrace in a much shorter time span than my wife and I. I hope your Hubby knows how lucky he is to have you on board with MB so quickly.

Keep up the process ... before ya know it you guys will be head over heals in love again and have a hard time keeping your hands off eachother. You will look back over this thread in the next year and most likely think to yourself "wow did that actually happen"? Becasue as you rebild your love ... you will rewrite history again into positive light.

MNG

I have a lot of trouble understanding this. Your H is feeling insecure, (which is not something he can just "control" and will away), and it sounds like you have been doing things to just escalate that insecurity (getting defensive, angry and threatening him with family intervention).

Now you haven't talked to him all day? Wow, if I were him, that would have just made me feel even worse

Yes too, I have MASSIVE patience[/quote]




Grace, it seems like you are quick to be defensive (see the quotes above) to people who are not trying to attack you or hurt you.

I have read your thread and I do know you are on board with MB, which I acknowledged when I wrote to you.

My point was, when your husband makes a DJ or an SD, he is requesting that an EN be met or an LB be stopped in an inappropriate way. You could learn to respond to this by asking him to reword it into a thoughtful request. When/if he does, you could then meet that thoughtful request right away or POJA it. You could ask him to reword it by saying, "It sounds like you want a need met but that felt like a DJ, could you reword it into a thoughtful request so I can better understand what you need?" My H did this to me (although not using MB terminology) and it really helped me get better at realizing when I was DJing. Before that, it would float out of my mouth before my brain realized what I was saying. When he did it in a way that seemed like he really wanted to know what I needed but in a respectful way, which I am sure was hard for him given my DJ, it was easy for me to respond with a better thought out and worded request. However, my need did not go away. So, if he would have responded to a request for affection by telling me he wasn't in the mood and no information about when he would be in the mood, it would often escalate anyway.



If conversation is a need for him and you are avoiding it right now, it is going to result in him feeling even more emotional and less secure.