Wonderful, WPG I am really glad for this update. Finally, some light at the end of the tunnel!

You are amazing. Keep up

I'm not out of the tunnel yet - there's still a ways to go - but maybe, maybe, that light at the end is not an approaching train!

jessi, you said he was scared - I keep talking about how scared I am to push any fragile development too hard, but of course he's scared too. And I tend to agree that right now is not the time to push any R talk. Despite what everyone IRL tells me and wants me to do, I feel like I need to do things *this* way...there will be plenty of time for R talk if he comes home and commits to the M.

I did have a nice time - you know we used to go out to dinner and it seems like every restaurant has a TV these days, and he'd always sit and watch TV. But last night we talked...I mean, he could have sat in surly silence and eaten but then what would have been the point of going out to eat??

Baby steps. Time and patience.

But it isn't at the cost of her self-respect. SF is a win/win for them. Go back and read her post. Both of their need for SF is being met, which is huge in creating intimacy. SF is mutually enjoyable - she likes to hop his bones!

Taking this mutually met need out of the equation in order to gain some sort of upper hand would be disastrous for WPG and her H, IMO.

How cool is that - your wife might be coming on board? Sweet! I'll be looking for her!

Well, I guess it depends on how the reader interprets the posts (according to their earlier experiences, knowledge, attitude, Weltwissen etc). I understood it more like Reynolds did - the SF was good, but since it always seemed to be followed by negative experience like shattered hopes & expectations, feeling of no connection (a huuuuuge trigger for me personally) etc, I was not sure that the net result was positive.

And for me, taking SF out of the equation is not about gaining upper hand, it is about preserving sanity.

But! Since the train is approaching (tee-hee... JK, calm down, folks, it is just the flashlight at the far end), the discussion is moot And we'll all keep our fingers crossed for you two...

I'm happy.

I'm glad y'all are hopeful...I will just leave it to you all to be hopeful when I'm not. I had so much hope for so long and I kept getting dropped, I guess now I don't 100% trust it - him - this - probably any more than he trusts me. Sometimes I AM afraid he's setting me up to be run over as punishment/payback for what I did to him.

I think that's a key - I'm afraid.

Another "key" is that I know a lot of my problem is getting frustrated over still having expectations that I haven't quite gotten rid of yet. You'd think after all this time I would have that down by now!

Sometimes I just get this nagging feeling that he'd rather just be "friends with benefits" without all the "stuff" associated with being married to me. You know, stuff like I want to hold his hand and touch him all the time, stuff like I'm a cheating wh*re, stuff like that. The warm fuzzy feelings I had Saturday night have disippated. lol either I am extremely needy or my LB$ is extremely empty. Probably a combination of both!

I know, I know, "baby steps," and I said it myself. We'll just see what happens from here.

Got the day with the girls so we're going to go find fun stuff to do!

wuffpack girl,

I think when you say you are afraid that we can all relate to that, we are all afraid, to trust someone else with our hearts is a scary thing, but you know what wuffpack girl that is living instead of existing.........
I deal with the expectation this as well, I know that is my problem and that my husband doesn't even think the same way as me, I have to stop that just like you do, I think we disappoint ourselves and set ourselves up for rejection at least in our heads when it just doesn't happen the way WE think it should.......
They did nothing wrong, they didn't even know that they should have been doing it, whatever that was, it was in our expectation not theirs...... make sense.........
I think right now don't borrow trouble, I would go with the good feelings you had and the effort your husband made, I think if there is a chance to have more of those nights and feelings that this is all you focus on, let go of the past that wasn't working anyway.........start fresh with what you have in front of you, and just learn to enjoy today..........if you want to show affection do it, it is who you are there is nothing wrong with that, if he choses not to return it, that's his choice......If it makes you feel good do it, he is your husband and you are showing the love you feel for him that is not wrong...........
I am needy like that too, and I miss it when our lives get busy, but I do it and get what I need, I don't feel badly it is who I am I can't be anything I am not, it feels right to me..........
enyoy the day with the girls..........
laugh and look at today only don't let that past screw today or tomorrow......
don't let that win.
jessi

That is your extreme "taker" voice.
Your Taker is trying to protect you. OK, fine.
Sometimes you have to recognize when Miss Taker is being overly creative and presenting feelings as if they were facts.

To a degree, this is good. You don't wanna wreck the biscuit!

Baby steps. One day at a time.

Let him come back now, WPG. Let him chose the woman you have become, and the woman you are trying to become.

He's a long way gone, and he can't get there any other way than one step at a time.

jessi, you are so positive - I really appreciate that about your posts!

I know fear holds me back...when we were watching TV Saturday night I wanted so bad to scoot over and snuggle with him but I was afraid of what his reaction would be. On the one hand I got the whole pre-A rejection of physical affection, and now...sheesh. Afraid of pushing him further away.

I think my taker - my extreme taker - is a catastrophizer. I absolutely imagine the worst-case scenario.

Better or worse than crushing my biscuit???

How long can a person keep their Taker under wraps? I know that what I am doing is the right thing, but that doesn't stop me from being lonely, or feeling resentful. I am getting "better," as far as that goes. It's sporadic, but I try to do stuff for myself. I'm still sort of scattered, I'll start something and then kind of lose steam and then pick it back up a couple weeks later. Like my front yard, I need to get back out there and plant some stuff (although lately I have been occupied with finding new and different ways to kill fire ants, ugh). Get a bonus in my paycheck this month so I bought some new jewelry tools I have been wanting for a while and am thinking of using the rest for more plants for the front yard and a little table and chairs for the front porch, so I can drink my coffee and read the paper, and the girls and I can sit outside and watch the hummingbirds. Lately I've been thinking about actually writing a novel. I've always wanted to write and I certainly have time to do it, if you factor in all the time I end up wasting during the day.

I was looking in the cabinet tonight for some video game stuff for the girls, and stuffed in the back of the cabinet I find the letter I wrote to H when I coached with JC the first time - back in Sept of last year - she'd helped me write a letter to try and get him interested in MB. Stuff like that reminds me that right now, I don't have a biscuit to crush!

I know he's a long way gone, I just hope I can keep on keeping it together for the long haul.

Ya know, I've been thinking the same thing the whole time I've been reading this thread.... have you done any secret research to see whether he is currently wayward? In all seriousness.

You been sneakin' round the men's thread?



I raise a call to quit calling Broken a "cake eating wayward."

Just my unprofessional, unqualified, un-asked-for opinion, but I think given recent developments that... ok, he's a cake eater. But, I think it's a choice between NO CAKE, and the delicious cake that WPG is leaving on the table.

I'm just suggesting she make sure that's the only cake he's getting.... just to be sure.

I just want to let you know that I think you're awesome and thank you for contributing especially to the (lurking) WW!

I hope that your husband will realize that you had been refined and became a precious diamond.

lol who, me??? nuh-uh, no way, no sirree!

While I suppose it would be possible H could be having an A, mehr, I highly doubt it. He's a man of very strong boundaries, always has been. I don't see him compromising his integrity the way I did. He could easily find somebody if he wanted to - I think his self-esteem was shaken by what I did (not a DJ, he's said as much), but whether he knows it or not, he's super sexy...strong, silent type, blue eyes that would make a woman melt, strong hands...lol the first thing I noticed about him was his, uhm, well-developed back side. He's an attractive man and can be very charming and funny, I have no doubts he could find someone else if he wanted that.

I could snoop on the cell phone records, sure, but that is now the only thing I can access. He's changed all passwords to his email accounts and is now using a bank account I don't have access to. I never had a reason to doubt him in all the years we were together, although he could have once said the same about me.

I do see him as fence sitting, though. Me and the M on one side, and divorce and single life on the other. And at least he's taking a little bit of the cake I'm offering. I'd be more worried about which side of the fence he was leaning towards if he was ignoring my cake.

aww, shucks, Lost... thank you! I just want to pay it forward, you know? At least I have hopes that someone, even if they are just lurking here, learns something from my mistakes!

Wulffpack girl,

I read that and a couple things I see is you wanting to cuddle on the couch watching a movie, you want to do that and you are afraid, I dont' want you to be afraid anymore.
After my husband's affair and I was trying to connect with him again, he really wasn't interested in me anymore since he was in love with OW.
I would ask him if it was okay for me to sit beside him, he said yes, after he got used to that, I would touch his arm in a funny spot or find a reason to brush up against him, eventually a little hand holding.
When the movie was over before I got up I would gently kiss him on the cheek, I didn't do anything if he didn't respond to it positively.
I didn't want to push..........I used to say to myself I feel rejected anyway so I was going to at least try........I think you should too....
The other thing you said was he could find someone else easily, he would be gone if he really wanted to be.............but he isn't .............
I don't think this is over for you, I think he is just learning to trust you again, he is trying to believe in your commitment again.......
He is slowly letting you back in, and if he really didn't want you in his life .......HE WOULD BE GONE........
Jessi

I appreciate what I have learned here. I think it was melody who posted an audio for me. It put a finer point on my idea regarding forgiveness. moving on is more nearer what I mean. Thanks Melody, I didn know there was any audios for relationships on the net. I have taken the moving on to heart. Im moving on, both in regards to my spouse and in regards to continueing our relationship. She has been a master of analogies,and of diminishing consequences of her shortcomings and as I dont have the energy , the expertise, or time, Im moving on. I will continue to read and learn . Thanks so much for all of you , even papa.

well, jessi, I didn't get up the courage to ask if I could sit near him on the couch tonight (he hung around after dinner and after the kids went to bed and we watched some TV), but I did ask him if he wanted to come on vacation w/me and the girls. I'd mentioned it a while back, but hadn't really said a whole lot after that. And I said, "The girls and I would like it if you could come."

Afraid? H377 yes. Hopeful? Maybe. I'd say I am much more fearful than hopeful. Even though I'm still trying to school myself to not have expectations, it is still going to hurt when he says no. But yeah, I had to at what you said about feeling rejected anyway, so what the heck, right? Nothing else to lose.

Ball's in his court, as it has been.

neverknewyou, this really is a wonderful place to learn, and if you stick around you will see that the folks here are an amazing bunch. I can say with certainty that whether or not my M recovers, I am glad I'm here, I'm grateful for what I have learned thus far and what I continue to learn. I hope you'll keep reading, and learning, and posting here.