Pop quiz;

This line is a _______ _______ ?

so you would say DJ and really it was a joke. We had a fun, pleasant conversation. Nothing with ill intent.

You can, however, badger him with disrespect and demands until he caves in and gives you what you want. It happens in marriages all the time. I believe it has happened in yours

Glad to hear that's not what you're planning Respect is definitely the way to go, and you're on the right track.

Grace,

Have you considered Mirena IUD? I've had mine for 3 years now, love it, it's the best thing since buttered toast. I don't cycle, I'm human 365 days a year, and our sex life is great.

It's the *most* sure method of BC out there - more sure than a vasectomy or a tubal.

Steph

Look into 5-HTP, it is herbal supplement for Seritonin. I'm trying to wean myself off effexor and this was sugested. If you google it the websites will tell you why we are short on it these days and how it works in the body. I would much rather be taking supplements than chemical drugs.

Grace, you don't have to follow the Policy of Joint Agreement. There is no compulsion here and nobody is going to come out and force you to do it. It's completely your decision.

But if you try to pressure your husband to do something that he is not enthusiastic about, you are being thoughtless of his feelings, and this will cause him to feel resentful, which is going to be damaging to your marriage and to your children. Ultimately it is going to affect your security and happiness and your children's security and happiness.

I know that Hilltopper has likely pressured you before and caused you to feel the same kind of resentment. You may feel as if he owes this to you because of all the things you have done that you were not enthusiastic about. But pressuring your husband will not help repair this situation. The solution is to start pursuing win-win solutions that do not harm either one of you, that are respectful of the feelings of both of you. The solutions are not apparent to you unless you approach the whole process in a respectful manner as Dr. Harley suggests. And many times they are not apparent to outside observers, either, because we are not privy to both of your perspectives, and because simply pronouncing that a particular solution is "best" ignores the issue of the two of you working this out in a manner that is respectful of each other.

I hope you have seen some benefit to your life from Hilltopper being here and working this program. I think that benefit could really be magnified if Dr. Harley got a little bit of input from you as to how Hilltopper is and is not being a good husband to you. Up until now all he's had is Hilltopper's perspective.

Please stop assuming I'm going to pressure my H. I'm not.

I get what your saying .. but before I had it done .. I didnt want to either ... reasons were trivial in my wifes mind. My wife pushed the subject and I did it reluctantly. HOwever ... even tho I was reluctant to do it .. and scared and nervous as heck. I did it because it was FAIR. Why was it fair? Because my wife gave birth to 2 beautiful children and endured pain I can not imagine, and for me to whine over a silly snip to save her of that pain again when we no longer want any more children is the LEAST i can do.

AFter it was done ... I realized just how much of a good choice that it was, but i couldn't see that until after it was done. I didnt resent my wife for pushing it after the fact .. yes before it happened i felt resentment, scared, nervous and a bit grouchy towards my wife for having to do it as the date approached. But in all fairness, it didnt even compare to child birth. Not to mention all the benefits that come along with having it done.

I understand that Hills reasons and feelings on the matter are legit .. and he is entitled to those fears and feelings. But the procedure is so simple .. and (from my experience) the benefits of it being done far outweigh the cons.

Now I am not saying that Grace uses demands ... disrespect or angry outbursts to persuade Hill ... but if hill would listen to respectful reasoning from his wifes point of view and be persuaded by it, he would find that in the end it was SOOOOO worth it.

MNG

Grace, I'm not assuming anything. I didn't say you are going to pressure your husband. I am simply warning you about the danger of doing so. If you are not pressuring him, then there's not a problem, right? You don't gain anything from persuading me, one way or the other, what you are or are not doing.

That was a rather long post on my part with a rather short response from you. I spent a lot of my own personal time thinking about what I was going to say and hope I was able to offer some helpful advice and perspective, and I hope you were able to benefit from it and didn't just quickly reply without reading the whole thing. Sometimes we are very quick to speak and very slow to listen.

It seems to me that if it is important to you not to pressure your husband you will make that fact come across to him in a positive and caring way and will welcome the chance to reaffirm this to him.

There are other ways to prevent pregnancy beside sterilization and birth control pills. Diaphragm. Cervical cap. Essure. IUD. Also there are new pills out (called "mini-pill") that may not have the same side effects. You should definitely discuss your options with your gyno.

I'm not trying to argue against the vasectomy. It's just that the way you expressed yourself makes it sound like you may not be aware of the breadth of options.

If you really tell your MIL that you won't be accepting her offer to babysit -- after you shared with her your dissatisfaction that she doesn't babysit -- I predict she will be very frustrated with you and not at all inclined to work on your communication problems.

And to be honest, I'm not sure I understand why you don't want her to babysit even though the two of you are having issues. Is it that she does things with/for/in the vicinity of the kids that you have asked her not to do (or vice versa)? If her behavior makes her an unacceptable caregiver, then why unload on her about her unwillingness to babysit in the first place?

I agree. Re Taking Charge of My Fertility, I was not referring to charting. Just knowing your primary signs of fertility and avoiding SF during that time is helpful and like curious points out, there are many barrier methods (spermidical foam is another one, IDK if that was mentioned) that you can use for the rest of the month to be safe.

And grace, my H also agreed to a vasectomy and backed out of it. He has done this with other things and what I have come to learn is that when he does this he is trying to make me happy and not really enthusiastic in the first place.

None of this is Marriage Builders, MrNiceGuy.

I've given birth to SIX children, 5 NATURALLY and 1 very painful C-SECTION. If anybody knows the pain of childbirth, it is me. Yet, it would STILL be wrong for me to pressure my husband into a reluctant agreement. You are not giving Marriage Builders advice. It goes against everything Marriage Builders teaches.

You are encouraging Grace to think disrespectfully of Hilltopper because, afterall, it's just a silly snip. It may be a simple procedure, but the resentment that will come because of going through it reluctantly, and the problems that resentment will cause, will be far more painful than childbirth.

And no, what your wife pushed you into was not "fair." "Fair" is coming to an agreement that BOTH are happy about BEFORE going through with anything.

Yes that was a short response on my end in effort for me not to DJ you.

Thanks, I am aware of all my options out there and I will research them.

In my opinion H is still working on being honest and trying to express them.

I have no intention of declining her offer and will utilize her as a babysitter. My issue is I don't want to force her to do this. She has made it clear she does not want to be a babysitter and has made the offer only upon discovering our marital issues. Mil only wants one kid at a time, so can she handle all three including an infant. I don't know, I have to talk to her. I know she wants to help now and we will be using her in the near future.

If I remember right, the discussion part of this only went for about two or three weeks. It took awhile for us to start discussing.

Curious

Prior to my discussion with Mil, H decided on his own to call up his mom and vent about our marriage and me. About one month ago I wanted to call his parents for help to benefit both of us. We didn't POJA for it and the forum discouraged it, so we didn't. H has since apologized for the call. My point is - this doesn't make me enthusiastic about dumping off the kids to (1) someone who doesn't want to babysit (2) feel good that his mom knows about our problems with whatever info he volunteered.
I could have volunteered some nasty things H has said over the last couple of months, but I didn't.

I still know she wants the best for both of us, but it is initially awkward. Sorry if I'm not jumping over the chance to get out without the kids, but the revolving circumstances seemed too weird at the moment.

tgrace1328,
I sympathize that it feels weird. I'm just trying to point out the possibility that your MIL is receiving very mixed messages from you. When you talk to her, it might be helpful to acknowledge the mixed message (rather than explain it away), and apologize to her if you've confused her.

One thing to think about: If you're not comfortable to have your MIL babysit your kids (whatever the reason), why did you complain to her that she doesn't babysit? What outcome were you looking for? Because, if I'm reading your post right, it sounds like you were NOT looking for her to change her position on the babysitting. So what WAS your desired outcome? (For her to go back in time to that day she said she wasn't interested in babysitting and NOT say it? LOL. "Re-writing the past" is a very common desired outcome. Unfortunately, it's a desire that has never been fulfilled.)

I'm not trying to put you on the defensive. You don't owe me any explanations. I'm suggesting that if you think about this a little more, you might be better equipped to address your issues with your MIL.