Hello everyone, today was a good day and a sad day as well. This morning i had to take son back as W and the family returned from the reunion. It is also SS birthday. When i dropped of S, SS was asking for his gift. I told him i would drop it by later. Work is going good, lots of things being done.

I decided to call W concerning dropping of SS Gift, to make sure i was not interrupting a party or anything. Talked about the trip a little and the coversation was going good . She said they werent having anything really and asked what i had got him. I said an Ipad, and she said very nicely, you didnt have to do that, that was so nice. I said i know, but i like doing things like that.
Then i asked about SS cell phones, i asked if he was on his 4th cell phone. She didnt say anything for a few minutes. Then she hit the roof, what does that got to do with anything. I said i was concerned that mom and dad were buying things for SS without asking you, and i didnt feel that was good for SS or S it be brought up with a sense of entitlement. She started yelling and said DO NOT BRING THAT GIFT over for SS, he does not want it. Do you have anything you would like to talk about the baby. I said yes i do but i do not understand why you are angry. She yelled im not what is your question.
I said I know you were against it at first, but how do you feel about letting me spend more time with S, i was thinking 50/50. She lost it, absolutely not! Yelling, i dont know what you are doing, you were fine with 60/40. I said no i was never happy with that. She said that isnt whats best for the baby. I said i am sorry you feel that way but i have to be obedient to God and will have to pursue other avenues.
How dare you threaten me, do not bring that gift over for SS, you are trying to buy his love, the damage has been done, Leave him alone.

I am sorry you are angry and am sorry you feel this way, please dont make SS suffer for this. He deserves more.

Do you have any other questions about the baby?

I said is it still ok to pick him up wednesday morning i took the day off?

Oh you are such a good father!!!!what if i have plans already you cant have him til 4pm.

I said wednesday is my day is what we agreed on.

What are you doing with him, i am suppose to know where he is at all times.
I am spending time with him like i have been for the last 3 weeks.
Oh you are such a good father. Please do not contact SS anymore, he doesnt want to talk to you.
So this all happened in less then 10 minutes. From sweet to yelling.

I really feel sad for her. I understand why she is feeling this way. I will continue to pray for her and for her heart to heal. I really feel sorry for SS as well because he is suffering for her anger.

I am not giving up, i will continue to be obedient to my God. He will take care of everything.

So, you bought him a $400 gift and then criticized her for him accepting expensive gifts? I would have told you the same thing she did. Nice touch, adding the threat about pursuing other avenues, too (NOT).

What are you doing?

Had you already bought SS's gift? Why didn't you bring it with you?

I am really confused. Please show me how i was criticizing. I am really confused if that was criticizing. I was concerned that he has had 4 cellphones in 4 months.

I asked her feelings about getting more time time with my son. she said no. Was i just supposed to head to the courts without telling her? i would think that would be inconsiderate and manipulative.

Yes already bought the gift a month ago. This conversation was over the phone. I didnt drop it off this morning because i had my son and all my laptop etc and could carry it all.

I am not being sarcastic here, i really want to do what is right, and really need to know how to do it if i am really messing up that bad.

You didn't come right out an say it, but the implication of what you inquired about and your resulting advice read to me as: "You are turning that child into a spoiled brat and need me to tell you how to raise children. Oh, and your family is a bunch of meddling fools, too."

Her reaction makes me think that's what she heard, too. If your goal is to get back together, you might do better by biting your tongue about what other people do for a kid who isn't yours. If your concern is really for that kid (and not for how bad you can make your wife feel), your ONLY chance of being an influence in his life is to be with his mother. And you're not going to get that if you make her feel bad. Who cares if he had ten cell phones??? Is raising up about that going to bring your wife home? No.

CWMI, thank you for your response. I agree with you that is probably what she did hear. My goal is to get back together. I really do care for my stepson as well as my own son. I have raised him since he was 5 and he turned 14 yesterday. I have no intentions of trying to make her feel bad. So now what do i really need to work on and what is the best way to go about it?

Sorry I've not been replying to you Ruikee, I've got some things I've been busy with myself actually. Perception is reality right? However your wife took situation is all that matters you know?

Yes i know, Well today i asked her if she needed any help with school supplies and she said Nope, i got it. I said Good to hear, have a great day.

I also went down to the court house to ask for more time with my son. I really feel at peace with it so i know it was the right thing to do.

Any advice on how to bring someone out of withdrawal mode?

Stick with Plan A as best you can for now. It will take consistency and time. Be patient and work on yourself to be the best darn husband on the planet.

Thanks Toughlove, is that posted anywhere on here?

Hey Ruikee

Yes, Plan A is posted on here somewhere, I think in the when to call it quit page.

Basically, you have to show unconditional love during this time in order to get them to relax and hopefully come back out of withdrawal.

Let me help. As a women, I heard from your conversation, I think your stupid and not adequate as a mother. (hence, she accepts stupid gifts from parents and why you want more time with son) *NOT saying that is true but what she hears in her heart*

SO plan A is: HAVE NO OPINION of your own. Just ask her about her day, her plans and ideas even if you think she is crazy. Use the power of words on her
"Wow, I am glad you are so happy with that"
For now in plan A just be her yes man. Gentleness... lots and lots of gentleness. AND go on and on about what a wonderful mother she is, it helps you to know that, that she is so smart and capable. I think these are the areas she needs to hear affirmation about.
If I was her, that is what it would take for me to come out. No more talk of you, just gentleness and no arguing about anything.
Don't talk about what you want to do with the divorce. Let the lawyers handle that but out of your mouth comes...
gentle words.

I would honestly go buy her a massage and pedicure or something like that. Never knew a lady yet who would hate a massage!
Buy a card,put the gift certificate for massage in a blank card and wrap the gift to SS but with no tag-have it delivered or mailed to your W. Then write something like this:

Dear (W)
I want to apologize for my words the other day on the phone. I bought you this gift to help you relax sometime if you would like as a gesture of my remorse.
I have dropped off SS Ipad in order for you to decide what to do with it. You can keep it, throw it away, use it yourself, give it to SS and even say it is from you. Whatever you want, I know you are wise enough to know what is needed.

I am very thankful and blessed that you are such a wonderful mother to SS and S and wanted you to know that.

I pray for Gods blessings on you always no matter what,
Ruikee.

Then NEVER and I mean never bring it up. If you do then it isn't really a gift anymore and she will take it as you only gave it to her to get something in return. Make sense!

If she brings it up, whatever she did with it... AGREE with her 100 percent on whatever she decided.

"i threw the massage gift away" YOU: That is fine W, I trust you know if you would want it or not. *Then drop it*

"I gave Ipad to SS but told him it was from Santa"
YOU: That is great W, I believe you know what SS needs right now and that was a unique idea. *Then drop it*

(I am throwing a strange answer in as who knows what she will do but just to get my point across- see... building her self esteem without saying YOU agree but finding something positive)

I know its tough... Even on the visitation stuff.

I was still going to pick S up this Wed. Her: nope, has to be after 4. YOU: "well, you are a great mom and if you think that is what S needs right now then I will go with what you think. See you at 4 then."

REMEMBER: try to win wife back and S comes with her. IF and a big IF you do get a D-then you can fight over the time with him.

Even if she says, you have been a horrible man, just say "your right, I am sorry for that." It is all her perception anyways and this makes it impossible for her to fight with you, make you a bad guy anymore and will be depositing huge love units.

I hope this can make sense to you.
Blessings and praying for you

Pepperband has written a wonderful thread on The Carrot and The Stick of Plan A. You can find it here.

Sunshine, I am glad you joined in to give me the womans perspective. It all makes absolute sense. Sometimes when she says hurtful things out of anger, we men get clouded minds. I think it is very respectful. I really appreciate your input and prayers. Is there anything i can pray for you specifically? I am gonna get cuaght up on your thread if yo uhave one.

Thanks again.

Plan A isnt just for infidelity is it? I will look it up. Thanks again for your input.

Hi Ruikee,
Thanks for the offer of prayer!
I admit that the reason I gave you those examples is it is what my XH did to me.
Now, he was a total horrible abusive man to me (we are talking hospital visits and all) and it took me 4 years to get my divorce finalized from him.
After around 3 years of almost no talking, HE started doing this to me.(The plan A I described) Esp on the child visitation. It totally softened my heart and made me realize that I was taking out what he had done to me on his time with the kids and I ended up giving him more visitation time because of how he started acting and what he was saying.

It made me feel like he had at least changed some as that was proof in my mind as the old him would never had said that. He went on and on about my ability as a mother and didn't argue on the phone or text and is what finally helped us come to agreements on the divorce.
*Now, I did get divorced but you don't have the kind of relationship that I was in*

You have hope... :-) Just keep the plan A up for now!

My thread is Love Busters. Trying to get through to husband now on what his actions!

You CAN Do this!

Thank you Sunshne for the response. I am very sorry that you had to go through that. i grew up seeing my mother go through it and would never want anyone else to experience that. Why did it take 4 years?

Is there anything else i can do in the mean time. I try to build conversation as much as i can. I noticed when she started responding, she resorts back to wanting to text because she says t is very confusing. Why would she leave someone that is what she has been praying for.

I have been calling each night to say goodnight to my son, but she has not answered the calls. I leave messages saying, Hello, just wanted to talk to S . I hope you all had a great day! talk to you soon. No response.

Good Morning Sunshine,
I did exactly what you said. Yesterday my son had speech therapy. It is at my apartment. W called me yesterday morning saying S was crying i want dada, after he found my SS wallet. i guess it reminded him of me. I heard him still in the background crying for me. It really choked me up. I had to go for a walk. I called her back and she said he was fine now. She asked if she could bring S over for speech and participate(she hasnt since we seperated.) she said she felt she needed to. I asked her if i could pray about it as it was an emotional day for me. She said ok. I took another walk and prayed. I texted her saying "good morning, i will be at the apt at 330, you are more than welcome to come, thank you for sharing your feelings, enjoy this beautiful day."
She arrived and i asked about her day, the family, work, nothing about me. then she left after therapy, which went well.

I dropped my son off this morning but W wasnt there.

This concerns me again as our son is being raised by the grandparents and not us.

So can you explain to me how what i did fills her lovebank tremendously? What can i do next to accomplish the same thing as i know this is what i am suppose to do.....

Just keep doing what you are doing. Talk about her. You said conversation is her number one EN so just keep talking about what she wants to talk about. That fills her tank!

I still think you should send her that note with the ipad. :-)

And remember... you never know if wife just left for a minute and came right back. I know it concerns you but talk to the Lord about it and not her. Not yet! She needs to hear that she is a good mother therefore does what the kids needs and you are thankful for that. At some point I would say words almost exactly like that too her in a text or something.
She did reach out to you with the speech thing.

Blessings

Thanks Sunshine, I did send the note with the Ipad, sorry if i didnt communicate that well enough. I also included the gift card for a massage and pedicure. Exactly what you suggested. Please continue to feed me. I really feel you may be a key for me to make this marriage work. Thank you again. and i will continue to pray for you. If there is anything specific, please let me know....

Blessings and Love,

Hi! I am having a night where I can't sleep... much has happened this last week!

Hurray for the note and stuff.... trust me, she is thinking about it (you) and when she goes to the massage, she will think about you, anytime she see's or uses the Ipad and you get to have some of that good feeling by association thing going on. :-)

AS for you, I have been praying and thinking. What did you do when you were dating to pursue her?

Does she like flowers? Candy? Chocolate?
A favorite restaurant?
A nice card that says sweet things?
Books she likes to read?
A cool wall hanging that states how awesome mothers are? :-)

Think romantic things that you can do even from afar... act like you ARE dating long distance... what would you do?

Can you tell me so I can help:
What are her interests? Like: sewing, swimming, gaming?

START asking her out on dates via text to her favorite eating place, or coffee etc- even if she says no, she still feels the pursuit. :-)
*AS long as it is done very nicely and you never say anything mean back if she turns you down*

When you do have your son, tell her some neat things you are going to do with him(this reaches to her family commitment need) and that she is more than welcome to come with you guys if she would like.
Again, if she says no way, you just smile and say... ok!
Then take a photo of you and him doing it -send it via text- we are having a good time, wish you were here! Then leave it at that.

ALSO: Do you have any past spots that you have special Romantic past with? You could text her, I just drove past the Olive Garden where I first asked you out and it made me think of you. (the end)
I drove past the spot where we had our first kiss-you were and are so beautiful. (the end)
I found a photo of that day we spent in the keys-that was a great day! ;-) (the end)
*These are like little memory drops to her for her need of admiration and if you don't try to get anything from them it feels good.. but only one of these a day... no overwhelming her!!!*

How is it going? What do you think about the ideas?

I am sure she need time to see you aren't going to go back to your old ways. Once abused it is kinda like climbing back uphill. If her first marriage was like mine, then what you were doing to her REALLY love busted her and she is afraid that things will go back to the way they were.

She needs time and all this Plan A from your side, think of it as if she is in Plan B with you! Go read the plan A/plan B (from when to call it quits) from that perspective (she has plan B-you) and you might see more of what you can do for her. :-)

So REALLY do whatever it takes to permanently clean up your side of the street!

Hi! I am having a night where I can't sleep... much has happened this last week!

I am sorry, i will pray you get rest in the upcoming days.
Hurray for the note and stuff.... trust me, she is thinking about it (you) and when she goes to the massage, she will think about you, anytime she see's or uses the Ipad and you get to have some of that good feeling by association thing going on. :-)

I agree, thank you once again for this advice....
AS for you, I have been praying and thinking. What did you do when you were dating to pursue her?

Does she like flowers? Candy? Chocolate?
A favorite restaurant?
A nice card that says sweet things?
Books she likes to read?
A cool wall hanging that states how awesome mothers are? :-)

She likes flowers, i did that recently and she didnt respond. She brought it up later saying she didnt want me to think that i had to send flowers all the time. Not sure what that meant, maybe you can explain what she may have been feeling.

She likes to scrapbook, she likes olive garden. She like Dean Koontz books, i think i spelled that right.
Think romantic things that you can do even from afar... act like you ARE dating long distance... what would you do?

Hmmmm i will have to think, its hard for us men to come up with that kind of thing sometime.
Can you tell me so I can help:
What are her interests? Like: sewing, swimming, gaming?

Scrapbooking, beach, reading, cooking, entertaining.

START asking her out on dates via text to her favorite eating place, or coffee etc- even if she says no, she still feels the pursuit. :-)
*AS long as it is done very nicely and you never say anything mean back if she turns you down*

When you do have your son, tell her some neat things you are going to do with him(this reaches to her family commitment need) and that she is more than welcome to come with you guys if she would like.
Again, if she says no way, you just smile and say... ok!
Then take a photo of you and him doing it -send it via text- we are having a good time, wish you were here! Then leave it at that.

ALSO: Do you have any past spots that you have special Romantic past with? You could text her, I just drove past the Olive Garden where I first asked you out and it made me think of you. (the end)
I drove past the spot where we had our first kiss-you were and are so beautiful. (the end)
I found a photo of that day we spent in the keys-that was a great day! ;-) (the end)
*These are like little memory drops to her for her need of admiration and if you don't try to get anything from them it feels good.. but only one of these a day... no overwhelming her!!!*

These are all awesome. Do you think once a day is too much, maybe when i feel the Lord leading me to? Should i mention anything about my stepson?How is it going? What do you think about the ideas?

I am sure she need time to see you aren't going to go back to your old ways. Once abused it is kinda like climbing back uphill. If her first marriage was like mine, then what you were doing to her REALLY love busted her and she is afraid that things will go back to the way they were.

She needs time and all this Plan A from your side, think of it as if she is in Plan B with you! Go read the plan A/plan B (from when to call it quits) from that perspective (she has plan B-you) and you might see more of what you can do for her. :-)

So REALLY do whatever it takes to permanently clean up your side of the street!

I agree, thank you so much.......