It takes those extra three years for many because they have said here that they knew their recovery was going to be successful after the first two years. But the triggers and memeories of the affair and Dday were still spending a lot of time in there consciiousness.

That it took till five years out for the affair memeories to ever be triggered. When they were they only lasted for a brief momment then would disappear.

Being no longer haunted is what they needed to be healed.

Also for many when Dday happend, the breaks in NC, the trickle truth could of went on for a prolonged time delaying recovery for the additional years.

wulffpack,

I think you will know when it's time to let go of the hope that the marriage can recover to a place that is happy for both of you.......
I think you keep meeting whatever needs you can for your husband and do that with love and excitement.......
Then you leave it up to him to come to you..........
I might even ask the question about the time line and what his thinking is on filing for divorce and if that is what he might be thinking...
Ask him if he sees his life with you or someone else........depending on that answer you can put together a plan after that as to what you will do ........
You have to respect his decisions now and if it simply isn't enough for him then he at least should be honest with you........
I think unless he realizes that you might be gone for good he won't deal with the situation in any positive kind of way........he will sit on that fence as long as you let him.........
I think if it's 2 years, 5 years it doesn't matter, you will know when you have done all you can do ..........you will know when the time comes that YOU will need more that life is offering you right now............
I think right now there is no reason for him to change his life.......he has his children, he has you, and without the work it takes to be emotionally attached and responsible for someone else's happiness.........
He can just justify his actions by what he thinks was your fault.
I say take that away from him and he might actually have to look at his part in this relationship not just what you did wrong........
I know this is a tough situation and I am sure being with him even part time is wonderful for you..........but you deserve more and so does he............you guys love for the moments and then live the rest of your lives sad and wondering......
It doesn't have to be this way, it is his choice, could he really live without you......has he tried..........what does that make him feel like........
Have a conversation with his about the time lines and see where he is at, and what the two of you can plan for the future......together or apart.....decide together.......
You might not get the answer you want right away, but I think once he realizes it may end it might be him to see things differently, right now he doesn't have to think this way............you are always there for him......he knows he has that soft place, that woman that loves him........he knows this or he would be long gone Wulffpack.........he is there because he wants to be there...........
What is the longest period of time that you two have not talked or seen each other?
Does he date other women?
Does he think you two can date if you want while being separated?
Did he find an apartment like he was speaking of doing?
Praying he wakes up soon.
jessi

Hi jessi - I find myself stuck more and more often these days. I realize I don't have the ability to erase the past, but we have to somehow make peace with the past in order to heal. I know I can't speak for a BS, but I think that both parties must be able to do that in order for healing to occur - whether that healing is marital or personal. I also understand that neither one of those is easy - either marital or personal recovery.

I dunno...one of the last things I said to him the last night he stayed over here (last week) - and he may have been asleep when I said it - was "I'm sorry I can't fix it." Stupid of me to have ever thought I had the ability to "fix" anything, certainly not on my own.

Your post had a lot of good points for me to think about, and as far as the questions you asked:


He's been very present for the kids the past few weeks, especially since my dad got a new job (my parents had been picking the girls up after school). I've tried to get him to hang around for dinner the last couple of nights (Monday was the first time I saw him since last Thursday) but he hasn't been interested. He said he needed to get back to the stepmom's, since she was out of town and he didn't want the house to be empty since there have been some breakins in the area...I mentioned that I thought she had an alarm, and he said "That doesn't do any good if no one is there." lol, I have a baseball bat under my bed, that's the alarm system I use...anyway...He's been here the last couple of days when I've come home at lunchtime but has been upstairs working out.

I don't know if he'd answer me if I asked any of the questions you suggested, as far as a timeline, and to tell the truth, after what he said to me the other week I'm actually afraid to say a whole lot to him anymore. I know that's stupid, and selfish, especially since I was the one who hurt him, but that's where I'm at. Before the stuff he said to me then, I was gradually feeling like I had a little more confidence to approach him with R talk...now, I feel like all the stuff I'd wanted to say to him came out in a jumbled, teary mess that day.

wpg, hang in there. this won't go on indefinitely.

You can look at the statement made, as well (paraphrasing); "a marriage better than the Pre-A marriage."

This, in reality, isn't an entirely difficult goal. Simply implementing PoRH and UA is a vast improvement for most marriages.

Two years time is also a good timeline for integrating PoJA into daily life.

All of this, of course, requires a that both spouses still be in the home.

Wulffpack,

Well he doesn't sound like he is making any kind of decisions other than being a father....I guess that's all he really needs right now.........
What if when he sees the kids you aren't as available, be busy, see what happens, see if he comes to you.........see if he misses you when he comes over......or if it's the kids he wants to only see.......
If he says anything just tell him that you are trying to stay out of the way of his time with his children..........tell him you know that's the reason he is there.....
Then go about your business or chores........
I think if he feels a little less attention he might interact more with you on a better level......he has a routine going he will miss it if it stops or changes......It will make him think about what it might be to lose it.......
Don't worry about not saying what you want, open and honesty is what you want to show him.....the realness of who you are and what you feel is what should come out.......
I sure hope he realizes that you won't do this forever and that he may lose you..........
You deserve to have him love you like he should, he needs to forgive you and move towards a future and not be stuck in this place.........
He can't be happy either.......
It could be so much better if he would just let it happen..
still hoping and praying
jessi

Thanks jessi...I tried being busy tonight while he was here (well, he's still here, he slipped off to bed when I went to have a smoke, then had to get DD#2 back in the bed). It's hard not to want to pay attention to him, but he barely acknowledges me.

I think I've accepted that our M is over. I think there will always be a part of me that hopes that he'll come around, but something in me just died when he got so angry with me a couple weeks ago. All I keep hearing in my head is "You're not worth it." I hear it even when we're having SF. I know I could have done better, I could have done more, but to hear that after so long, I just don't know what else I can do to be "worth it" anymore. Forgiveness is a gift, and nothing I've done deserves it. I can't earn it. I don't even get frustrated anymore, the expectations are dead. Now I'm just sad. I know, 2 to 5 years, but that clock starts ticking when a couple is engaged in R. I don't know that Dr. H has ever given a timeline for a "best by" start date for R, and it's ultimately the BS's decision to engage in R, and they have every right to decide their WS is not "worth it."

I got the DNA test kit last week and am sending it in tomorrow. It won't change anything. He's already essentially told me that he'll doubt it as well - when I tried to give him mine and the girls' samples for him to do his and send it in, he said, "I would have liked to see the girls get sampled." And you know, I didn't even think when I did it - I guess that's like everything else - he just said he wanted something so I did it without a second thought. I told him he could ask the girls if he wanted. My family thought I was nuts to do it, but I wanted to try and give him peace of mind about the girls, not for me. And I screwed it up, too.

Anyway, I don't think I really fit in anymore on a MB site. Oh, I've learned, and I try to apply the principles, and I can definitely understand and explain the dynamics of a WS mindset, and what *not* to do in recovery. But I'm the villain in this piece. Not only was I a WW, I was a POSOW. I sort of don't fit for the same reasons I've been reluctant to go to any kind of separation/divorce support groups - I wasn't blindsided by the end of our M, I brought it down with my own two hands.

I suppose if there are any new WW's out there that need some sense smacked into them, I can chip in, but there are others who do that so much better than me. broken and I are just more casualties of the disease of infidelity, one that I willingly let in and allowed to destroy our family. I certainly can't explain what a "healthy" R looks like to anyone.

All I have left now is to be me, WPG. Or maybe at this point, after all this, I'm WPG 2.0. And maybe someday broken will decide that WPG 2.0 is worthy of his love. Maybe not.

If you ever read this, broken, I'm so sorry for everything. "Sorry" sounds so pitifully inadequate for everything that I put you through. For what it's worth, you should know that you made me fall in love with you all over again. You did everything right. It was me that failed you, so many times over.

I could make you happy
Make your dreams come true
Nothing that I wouldn't do
Go to the ends
Of the Earth for you
To make you feel my love

((WPG))

I think you'll always have a place here.

((WPG)) Don't you dare leave girl! Your the best. You know, If you continue to love him, and can forgive him when he loses his temper,(yes that must of hurt), you still have a chance.

I hope you are not going to leave, but if you do for a short while, I understand. I want to say one thing that I hope helps you, quoted from something i once heard somewhere.

"You are NOT your sin"

Don't identify with it WPG, you have changed and are growing, continue

Prayers

I want to thank you so much for writing to all of us in this MB forum your most heart-felt thoughts. It wasn't until I read your thread that I caught an inkling of how my FWH might have felt about his failure to be faithful and his desire to make it right.

After I knew it was safe to do so, I read some of your posts to H, and he was emphatic about how he agreed with what you wrote about your remorse, saying he felt the same way about trying to save our marriage from the damage he did. He felt the same way about the AP, too, knowing he risked everything good in his life for an illusion.

I totally understand with where your BH is, yet I hope he allows himself, over time, the opportunity to be a family with you and your children again. Never say never.

Why did broken stop posting here?

"I got the DNA test kit last week and am sending it in tomorrow. It won't change anything. He's already essentially told me that he'll doubt it as well - when I tried to give him mine and the girls' samples for him to do his and send it in, he said, "I would have liked to see the girls get sampled." And you know, I didn't even think when I did it - I guess that's like everything else "

Unbelieveable, start the test procedures without him present.

Does your BH still read MB?

Amen.

Darn tootin'!

WPG, many of your words resonate with me, and I understand to an extent what you mean when you discuss expectations and hope and remorse.

I am sure I'm not alone in learning from you, nor in valuing your presence here on the forum.

Moreover, I can't think of a group of people better-suited to understanding your situation - and helping you through it, if you let them.

My vote is: don't go.

WPG, if you need, I am available off the boards for emotional support. Just notify the mods, and they can give you my email address.

((WPG))

Aw, WPG...

I get it. Sometimes we all need a break from the "Best Club Nobody Wants to Be In."

Take a breather. Take care of yourself. Clean, smelling good, and beautiful every day.

Look into the mirror, repeat; "I am worth it. For myself, for my children. For my husband should he chose."

Got any projects around the house to work on? Can you get out and get any dirt under your nails?

WPG -

You've ben so helpful to me and many others. Would hate to see you go...

WPG - I stick with you because I know as woman we are both trying to break through our husband's anger and in my case my WH's pride.

Although you and I are on the opposite end of the spectrum, I can see how our husbands hold this hurt and pain close to their hearts.

I spent a long time in Plan A because my WH was deployed at the time and I didn't have MB either. I saw a pattern happen with my WH and because I have been with him for 15.5 years I know him quite well.

Each time he would get very angry with me he would spend days and sometimes weeks not talking to me. Of course his anger is based solely off our Pre-A marriage. After time he would come around because I have some very strong EN's for him. He wanted his cake some more and would drop the anger and be very nice to me.

Keeping patient and fully understanding the pattern my WH uses with me has been key to understanding him as a person. What I am learning is my husband returning will take longer, and as long as I hold out and be patient, make the changes in me, and prepare myself as a better wife -- I know the reward in the end will be something greater than I ever expected.

WPG - what is your husband's pattern? You know him well. In the past was the silent treatment used? In the past was his anger strong and then you noticed over time he came around?

If you can answer yes, then you know he will come around. Today his anger is on steroids, so it will take longer.

We BS's can feel and walk with you on your frustration with time and patience. Somedays I yell at GOD - "What is taking so long, come on already!!!"

GOD simply bumps me on my head and says, "Tough, it is my time, and I have to work with free will. Patience Tough, time and consistency is what you need. It will happen when it happens. I need you to trust me Tough. I am doing what I can to bring him home, but free will still trumps my abilities."

WPG, I haven't posted you, but read your story, also your posts. I admire your courage, your willingness to learn and never give up. You are an asset to this board, so don't you dare leave, sister!:-) Like HHH said, take a breather, if needed. I've found massive house cleaning or anything of physical nature very helpful when stress becomes overwhelming. Is there anyone you can talk to, share things, a good close friend or family member?

Apparently he does.

I hope he reads this thread carefully and sees that a happy, rebuilt marriage with you is highly possible, wpg.

I appreciate the support. I've lurked, can't seem to stay away, but hadn't felt much like posting till earlier today, and Tough, if you read this, please accept my apology for my kinda overly optimistic post to you. I've admired your strength and I just got so excited over your WH showing any kind of interest in MB that, well, suffice to say if I was you I'd have been pulling my Tommy Boy crap again. Dunno if that makes sense. ML and others gave you much more realistic advice. I just want to see somebody have a miracle, you know? I actually was telling my mom about it tonight, and how I feel like I'm just too naiive and trusting to survive in the world sometimes, and she said that I am just an inner optimist. I laughed and said what the heck do I have to be optimistic about? Anyway, I would be an absolutely horrible plan-B'er if my situation was reversed. Not that I'm a good plan-A'er either.

I think one of the big reasons it's been so hard to stay away is that as some of y'all asked about support IRL. I have family and I have GF's, and they are supportive of personal R at this point, but not so much marital R. Not a soul I talk to IRL has a shred of hope for my M anymore, and it tends to make me NOT want to talk about it. It makes me feel very alone. Prisca, I appreciate the offer of support. I just might take you up on that!

Other than that, it's been an interesting week or so, what with the wierd earthquake and Hurricane Irene (thankfully not a big deal around here, too far inland, although we did lose power for a bit). Nothing much new to say, trying to keep busy, sometimes I succeed and sometimes not, but it's a process, right?