Thanks, Ariel.

BB, it is obvious that your H has problems with intimacy.

Intimacy is not sex, but can lead to sex and often does.

You mention at one point that you "had problems but..", you didn;t define them, and that might be nessesary to regain intimacy.

When you care for someone you want them to be involved in your life, and you communicate, honestly, and comepletly, you don't act desparate and sleazy, and expect that to suffice for a need like sex.

He has taken sex out of the picture of a healthy relationship, where two people give to each other, out of desire, and oneness.


Sex is the culmination of mutual care and relationship, and the need is for relationship first, and sex is not the point, its the reward.

Yes it is an emotional need, mostly exhibited by men in certain age groups more desparatly than women, but the woman have needs also, that must be attended to, just as much as his, and just as despartely.

I am hopeful because he talked to Dr H, that you can overcome this aversion, because he seriuosly applied himself. He has a sickness, and the Dr can help, because that is what he does.

May you heal your marrige, with the tools provided, because they work. No matter how sick he has become, there is a way out.

Trust, truth, radical honesty about your needs and his, and the tearing down of false strongholds in the mind, are nessesary here. It might not happen overnight, but the investment is worth it,

God Bless

Dr. Harley's advice was perfectly in-line with the consensus of the scientific community, with the added benefit of having a focus to recover the marital relationship.

The usual advice for this man's problem is 90 days of PMO (Porn, masturbation, orgasm) abstinence to let his sexual associations realign.

The advice here was total PM abstinence, and absolutely no sexual activity or stimulation which does not involve his wife.

Unfortunately, his "sexual perversion" is another thing that is far too common now days with high speed internet and internet pornography, which is why the American Society of Addiction Medicine has rewritten their definition of addiction to include behavior and/or sexual/pornography addiction.

I wish I could say things were better....in some ways they were since the show, but perhaps not surprisingly to others, honesty has still been lacking. I have done a lot of thinking and realized I needed something. I have asked him to take a polygraph test to clear up what has happened since I found out what was going on 2 years ago. I am no closer to being over it since the day I found out.

Well, he has agreed to do it, but not exactly enthusiastic about it. Which is one question, policy of joint agreement, how does that work when you need your spouse to be accountable?

Since figuring out I'm really doing it, he has told me some more things. Like he attempted to do it again, and only stopped b/c he didn't have good lighting and was afraid I'd wake up. I'm not sure when this happened, he says months ago, I don't know. I know he has also been previously banned on the chatroulette site, so whether that involved just him (he says that was the case) or it was another thing with me, I don't know. Of course, I don't know if this is a little bit of truth to get me to not do the test (I'm still doing it) or if he is actually being honest now. He has also confessed that he feels he cannot control himself and he feels very tempted to do all this stuff. He has asked me to lock down the computers which I am doing, but he does still have his phone and there are other devices that do have internet like game consoles and e-readers and endless things. There's no way to effectively shut it all out but he will have to work a lot harder to try and do anything.

I know he is worsened b/c we are effectively in a sexless marriage. It has been about 3 months, and is pretty rare otherwise. I just can't do it though.

And some clarification since the show didn't really stress this. It has been close to 2 years since I thought this all had last happened. Immediately after, he did not sleep in the bedroom, he did not see me naked, I did not take any drugs. We did not have sex for 6 months. It has been slowly returning to the norm as I felt he was honest and sorry and remorseful and would NEVER do it again.

Obviously I am now finding out that this is not the case. I don't exactly know what I am going to do now. I know he needs to get therapy, especially for the sexual deviancy. We are waiting until after the new year due to high deductibles with our insurance. I wish it didn't come down to money but we just don't have the extra to pay that much out twice within a couple of months.

I have just been completely blindsided again, I fell for it all again, I believed him, he lied to Dr. Harley, he lied to me. And as far as my kids go, I still definitely believe he is not interested in harming them and never has and never will, or else I would be gone. However, I take no chances in that realm and definitely believe my kids have always been safe.

I hate having to think about all of this stuff....I know he is not a monster, he wants to be better and he loves me. I know I love him. But it's hard knowing how many precautions we will have to take, probably forever, to prevent stuff like this.

PoJA will become applicable when you reach a point where you believe you are beginning to recover your marital relationship.

Right now, you are still trying to figure out what the heck you are recovering from, so what you need to get the foundation is not subject to PoJA.

Hopefully, he is staying away from the porn and chats... but considering the depth of his compulsion... it's doubtful.

Again, abstinence from porn, masturbation, and orgasm (from his previous sources) needs to be avoided so that he doesn't require hyper-stimulation to become sexually aroused.


How many web accessing devices do you really need in your house?

This doesn't sound like he's very enthusiastic about changing the marriage to an honest relationship.

Yes , how much has he really committed his ENs to this marrige?

Honestly at this point I have to say I don't know. I don't know if he is truly commited. I don't know if he is being honest. I have more doubts than ever before.

As far as all the devices, we have a ton. The Internet is a lot harder to get rid of than another woman it seems.

Ironically he just told me about an almost EA/PA? IN AN EMAIL! I am just so sad, so tired, so over all of this. I am not sure if I want separation or recovery at this point. This (non?)affair happened a few years ago and we lived in another state so I'm finding out way after the fact...I can't handle another thing on my plate.

My husband and I have a lot of history...and coming to a good place finally took a long time. Well, what I thought was a good place. He has a lot of trouble with lying (the stay out of trouble liar) and even when speaking to Dr. Harley, he did so much lying, what was the point?

Anyway....it took a few years, but I was really feeling in love and happy in my marriage, but I guess in the back of my mind, there is always a question when you live with a liar. So, in a light way, I asked him....is there anything else I don't know?

He confessed something! He told me he had met a female friend (friend to both of us) for a drink one night, which I knew about...I had opted not to go bc we had young kids and it was late. But that she had confessed feelings for him and said she had a sexual fantasy to perform a sex act on him, he said he wasn't interested, loved me and said it was best not to see each other anymore.

I was very happy that he told me, he had done the right thing, all was good right? Except....well, I got a little objective advice...and first thing was they said if that had happened to them, they would have told their spouse immediately....and I realized that was true. Anyone would have, there is no reason to hide that. So I pressed. And I snooped. I looked at his Facebook and realized he had erased all communication between them, even though he doesn't erase messages usually. Well, why erase it?

So yah, I asked some more, and also pretty much threatened to call her and ask what happened (which I did later) and slowly, painfully, his story morphed into what is probably the closest I will get to the truth.

First he admitted, it hadn't happened that night, but another night....he later admitted he had texted her and asked her to come to the house. I was on vacation with the kids and he was flying to meet us the next morning at 5 am. In that text convo apparently she said she had the sexual fantasy. He then changed his mind and told her to meet in a grocery store parking lot, this is like 11 pm. I guess they talked, she confessed she has liked him for years (he says he didn't say he liked her, but she says he did) he asked if she was serious about wanting to act out the fantasy she says yes, but they don't act on it. He says he loves his family and can't do it, they hug and part ways and more or less stopped speaking.

Oh and he says he met her bc he was bored, which I don't believe...as he got out of school at 10 pm, met her by 11 pm, and had a flight at 5 am. I believe he was drinking. I think he was hoping to get some from her, I don't know about feelings. He is adament he didn't like her like that....but they have been friends for years, I found out he had been giving her rides home from work without telling me, there were rumors at work something was happening....he denies it and says only that night was anything inappropriate.

Oh and he was also her boss at the beginning, but then after awhile he moved on and then she did so they do not have contact anymore. I made him unfriend her on fb, they both maintain they haven't really talked since. I don't know if that is true. The thing is, this was a year and a half ago, but I just found out.

I would have been ok if he confessed when I asked, but it wasn't until I was going to find out from her two days later what actually happened that this came out. And even then it took all day long for the "real" story. I feel like there is likely more he is covering up, maybe not even this incident, but other stuff....and he will just never be honest with me.

I told him I want to separate. I don't think I want a divorce but I don't know how to fix this. I am in need of objective knowledgable help....what do we do now?

Blackbird, there are so many red flags here one hardly knows where to begin. Your husband has a lifestyle that leads to affairs so it is not hard at all to understand why he had an affair. He has opposite sex friendships, goes to bars with women, takes them home, etc. It sounds like you spend the nights apart which is another invitation to affairs.

The way to fix this is for him to change his lifestyle so this can't happen again. He should affair proof your marriage. And the first step in all of that is for him to end ALL contact with the OW and set up his life so that he is so transparent that he CAN'T lie or cheat.

In your situation, I would start off by insisting he pass a polygraph. Schedule a polygraph for him but a couple of days beforehand, give him a list of all your questions. He needs to answer all your questions truthfully before the test. He must pass the test, though.

The affair should also be exposed. Is this OW married?

I would get the book Surviving an Affair [can be downloaded on kindle for PC's] and read it so you understand what you are dealing with.

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

Also, it is more likely that your husband had a long term affair with this woman and probably did bring her in your home when you were gone. I don't believe they didn't have sex.

I would also verify if she really works at his place of business or not. It is obvious that your husband is not mature enough to supervise women. Only a very loose cannon would have an affair with a female subordinate. Does he still have that job? Does he supervise other females? Someone like your husband needs to be supervised, not the other way around.

I am definitely going to get surviving an affair. I had already personally decided he would need to pass a polygraph before we were back together, but maybe we should do it very soon?

The thing is, this woman's husband died not long before after a fairly long period with cancer. It was not easy for her, and I'm sure she was not in the right state of mind, although that is no excuse....I feel more like he took advantage of her feelings for him in the hope of sexual gratification. There are a few times a year I am gone a night or two and I cannot avoid that. It is possible to look into him being able to come too though.

Do you think we should still send a letter even if the affair died on its own so long ago? As far as I know this is true. I know his passwords, he is not secretive with his phone at all, his time is 100% accounted for almost always....he has been much more interested in the marriage and working on us meeting each other's needs.

I think they became something more than coworkers in 2009 and everything ended in 2012.

It seems just mean to expose to everyone when it is already done and over with.

And, I'm guessing physically separating would make these steps a lot harder, but I'm just so angry. It happened a year and a half ago to him, but yesterday for me. I don't know that he can be in my house, and I have to look at him, and cook his food and do his laundry while I think about him and her and their fun little secret life they had for years without my knowledge.

Bkackbird, this man had sex with you while you were sleeping and broadcast it over the internet, multiple affairs, and who knows what else.
you earlier posted he drives drunk.....is he an active alcoholic?

Did he take a polygraph in 2011?

He would say no, and as far as I know he will go days without having anything to drink, and usually has one or two beers or glasses of wine when he does. But I think he likes to drink excessively at times....he never even told me he was drinking that night, she told me that and he didn't disagree. So I don't know what or how much.

Yes, I would do it now and make his passing a condition of reconciliation. If he flunks then I would reconsider staying with him.


I certainly would not trust him alone for even one night a year. Do you know for a FACT that her husband is dead? Do you know for a FACT that she doesn't work there? Do you know for a FACT that they have ended contact?


But you don't know if the affair is over. His time is not accounted for at all if you are not there. Are you there to see what he does? Do you know each and every word he types on his computer?

Do you have a keylogger on his computer?


It should be exposed regardless. And there is nothing "mean" about exposing an affair. It is therapeutic. It helps everyone involved. The more people who know about your husband, the more people to hold him accountable. And the more people to support you.

I honestly don't see anything here to save now that I have read your previous posts. Your entire marriage has been one long string of heartaches. If this was a good marriage, I could see the point, but trying to save a marriage with a sexual predator, a pathological liar and an adulterer seems like a poor choice to me.

The only way I envision you could ever feel safe with him is by spending 24/7 with him. You can't even leave his side for one night because he will have other women in your home having sex with them. I am certain that is what he did with this employee.

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