The title of this thread makes her "focus on the kids" statement laughable.

My H left me one time, GJM, moved out in the middle of the night while we were all sleeping (we have four children). He told everyone he left me because I was a bad mother.

Guess what he forgot to take with him? The kids! Lolol.

She's a fogged out wayturd, G. Don't pay one bit of attention to what she says right now. Double standard, eh? Did she turn a blind eye while you slept around? Is that what she's talking about?

I wonder how she would react to being offered full custody? It snapped my H's head around, that he wasn't going to be able to flit off to some one bedroom apartment without a care in the world. He was going to be a single parent, a full-time one, if he chose to leave the marriage. Obviously, working on the marriage seemed a better option!

She is still trying to manipulate you into giving her the passwords. She will keep trying because she believes she is in control. You need to just tell her that as long as you are separated and there is no trust, that you have to protect yourself. She left the marriage and as such, has no right to such things.

Ridiculous. As if you arent teaching your daughter better than to end up in that position. Teaching that there are consequences to actions.

I wouldnt get dragged into circular arguments - each wayward specialises in a certain one. Your task is to sound like a broken record.

Which you ARE. You are doing wonderfully well, standing up for your marriage but drawing a line in the sand which is marked 'enough'.

Good boundaries. Its good to see.

Stop talking marriage with her.
Stop talking divorce with her.
Stop discussing passwords or acknowledging she is bringing them up.

Lots of "Hmmm. Uh huh. I sees." only with such topics.

Let her take the marriage down the hill by herself and do not feed the tigers.

Respond legally when needed through attorneys when needed and do not engage in any discussion that decides the marriage is or is not over.

Okay?

I like this!

Agree with Reading. This is standard wayward waffling. What' she is really thinking is that if she ends it with you she will be free to see OM.

Your marriage isn't over yet and you can't let these kinds of dealings with your WW get you down. That is one of the reasons that you don't want to have any talk about your relationship.

You did okay with your convo, and it showed you what it is like to deal with the fogginess of a wayward. Remember DO NOT ENGAGE A WAYWARD.

Thanks for lifting me back up. The future is uncertain and I guess the only thing I can do is move forward. She's been here for about 8 hours and since the first conversation, we haven't talked about the relationship or passwords. We've been watching football and I did a load of laundry. She seems to be in a better mood, but the kids aren't interacting with her much and she said she was upset about that. She also said she knows it's her fault and accepts responsibility for that. She knows that this is their home and she said she just needs to make the apt their home too. I didn't comment about it. I said and one day this could be your home again. She just shook her head.

I doubt they're going to be very happy about staying in an apartment where they have to sleep on couches or something. Look for them to shut her down cold about that place being home.

They don't like going over there. She picks them up tomorrow evening for her week. She just left. I tried to stay in a good mood while she was here. As she left I gave her a hug and told her that I love her. She pulled me back after I let go and said she loves me too. I can't help but feel so saddened because it could take months for her to come back and try to earn my forgiveness if at all. I will continue to pray everyday and let her know that I'm willing to save the marriage if she's willing to put in the work and effort. I'm sure you all know how I feel right now. My tears are flowing as I type. I have to hold on to faith and believe things will get better. I can't stand the fact that I can't wake up next to her or touch her when I want to. We don't have the laughs and talks anymore. My companion and best friend is gone. I miss the old us, but hope for a new us some day. I can't imagine myself with anyone besides her. Not this her of course. I think I might try the love dare. I definitely need to get some books to read. Thanks for listening.

They don't like going over there. She picks them up tomorrow evening for her week. She just left. I tried to stay in a good mood while she was here. As she left I gave her a hug and told her that I love her. She pulled me back after I let go and said she loves me too. I can't help but feel so saddened because it could take months for her to come back and try to earn my forgiveness if at all. I will continue to pray everyday and let her know that I'm willing to save the marriage if she's willing to put in the work and effort. I'm sure you all know how I feel right now. My tears are flowing as I type. I have to hold on to faith and believe things will get better. I can't stand the fact that I can't wake up next to her or touch her when I want to. We don't have the laughs and talks anymore. My companion and best friend is gone. I miss the old us, but hope for a new us some day. I can't imagine myself with anyone besides her. Not this her of course. I think I might try the love dare. I definitely need to get some books to read. Thanks for listening.

GJM-

Just a quick note, and no real advice to add but to tell you to hang in there and keep doing what you're doing. Going through this crap during the holidays can be the worst, but a lot of us have done it and made it through.

What's the status on OM--any news?

OMW texts me daily. She has been tracking him on GPS. His work has been involved with the situation as well. I gave the OMW the list of conditions from the forum to help her make sure he is willing to earn her forgiveness. Any time she loses track of GPS, she calls his cell or work phone. She hasn't had a problem so far. She says he is willing to do the work 200% and will do whatever it takes to earn her trust and forgiveness. She forwards their texts that they have back and forth and I use the tools from this site to help her. She says he is willing to change his life and even go to church. She is relentless with him too. She checks on me every day and says that I'm in her prayers because my WW doesn't recognize a real man and hopes she wakes up soon. Unfortunately for me, my WW isn't trying to come back yet, but I'm being patient and I'm trying to stay busy. I keep being kind yet firm.

That's good that OMW is so involved. By chance does she have spyware on his phone or a keylogger?

I forget, do you have spyware on your wife's phone?

I wasn't able to put spyware on her phone, but put a keylogger on the computer before she took it. I told the OMW which spyware to use, but I'm not sure she ever put it on the phone.

You need to be very careful with the attention you and OMW give each other. You two are both hurting and you are at your GREATEST risk of having an affair now than in any other time in your life. Fun huh?

Do you channel James Bond when you are with her?

Have you already identified her top 5 ENs? Which LBs you were guilty of committing in the past? These are also important things in Plan A.

Keep your chin up, you have done GRAND. It's a long hard road, and there are some times when you are going to want to give in, just remember that it is a roller coaster and keep posting here. We are all standing behind you.

I have no desire to be with any other women. I exercise self control. I value marriage and know how to separate myself from any type of EA/PA. My WW would never rank her EN, but I would say they are domestic support, admiration, financial support, family commitment and attractiveness of spouse. I have been guilty of all LB in the past except dishonesty. I can admit that. I would say in the past two year I've limited them to selfish demands. It's my taker. My giver also comes out too, but I know some times being selfish can be easy to do.

Openess and Honesty
and
Conversation

are probably higher on her list than physical attractiveness and domestic support.

Still implement domestic support (though women don't want to do all the work, this need being met isn't an alluring one for women) and attractiveness (women like handsome men for sure), but, know that most likely the other two are higher. Just show the willingness to hit those bases.

OM was not meeting those needs you listed, GJM, except maybe admiration and attractiveness. So you know what that means, right? Those can't be her top needs, or she wouldn't go trying to get them met elsewhere. Conversation, affection, recreational companionship, SF...those are probably the needs he was meeting.

That you should meet.

Wait. As we post about emotional needs.....
OM is not meeting all her needs, just ones GJM wasn't meeting for a while. Probably conversation and affection (kids get in the way of these).

Women do not tend to have as a top five.... SF (yes, we are sexual but we tend to want the affection that comes with it), and tend to not need recreational companionship but do it any way cause it IS fun.

Women are very much alike and want in their very most important top 5 needs:
Affection
Conversation
Open/Honesty
Family Commitment
Financial Support

They do want the other things SF (it is fun), Admiration, Domestic Support (don't want to be the only one doing that work), Physical Attractiveness (if he meets other needs, he tends to look hotter in her eyes though) etc.

The top 5 are the critically important ones that the other emotional needs are connected to in some way but aim for the top 5.

Open/Honesty is one of the toughest when your spouse is cheating on you. You don't want them to know you are snooping but in all other ways you can be fairly honest. "I stand for our marriage. I stand of monogamy. I stand for a true partnership."