And at the same time, not all women are the same. My WW said I never looked at her the same after her first affair. Also, she has never had a high need for affection. She was willing to give it because that's one of my important needs. Remember, her issues run deeper than just being unhappy out of the blue. The OM said nice things to her and made her feel good. She said I wouldn't even look at her when we talked. It will be nearly impossible to meet her EN without seeing her. If there was a way to win her back, I'd be on it, but at this point I just have to wait and hope she sees that the grass isn't as green as she thought.

Reading is correct, you DON'T practice radical honesty when you are separated and your wife is in an affair.

As far as any other needs, it is unlikely she will ALLOW you to meet any of her needs. Plan A means you express a WILLINGNESS to meet her needs in the future, if she ends her affair. Try to meet her needs if you can, but focus on the 2 top intimate emotional needs for women, which are conversation and affection.

And the reason you never felt the same after her last affair is because she never earned your forgiveness. She never gave you just compensation. That is why she had another affair. This is why it is so important that you not accept her back unless she meets your conditions to earn your forgiveness.

The deeper issue is that she has inappropriate boundaries around men. That is why she has had 2 affairs. All the need meetin' in the world will not overcome her poor boundaries. She allows other men to meet her needs, and as long as that is the case, more affairs will be your future. She is a serial cheater and unless she makes radical changes in her behavior, she will remain a serial cheater.

Don't get distracted by looking at "deeper issues".

Aside from her poor boundaries around men, she has never given up her independent behavior & secret second life from what I can tell by going back to your first post:


So please don't listen to her fogbabble about why she was unhappy in the M, GJM. Having independent behavior & dishonesty leads to lack of intimacy in a M, even without the affairs.

PS ~ did you ever uncover an affair from 2009?

I did uncover it and exposed it to everyone. I just failed to make her earn my forgiveness and meet my conditions. I was unaware how to do that at the time. I have drawn the line in the sand and have my foot down. All I can do now is wait.

I guess I am confused because I have seen reference to her having had two affairs but really there were three, 2001, 2009 and 2011? Is that right?

In 2001 we separated, but I had no evidence of an affair. It's quite possible. We separated for a month and I said I was done and she came back.

I am sorry to tell you that I am about 99% sure there was an affair in 2001. So she is now on her third affair.

Just FYI that you will need to require a poly and get the FULL truth about her secret second life in order to recover.

I'm taking this discussion back to the cooperation you and OMW have established. According to your post, "She says he is willing to do the work 200% and will do whatever it takes to earn her trust and forgiveness....She says he is willing to change his life and even go to church."

So this leads to two questions that may provide you a very powerful tool to be employed at the right time.

• Has he put any of this new "devotion" to his BW in writing?
• Would she share copies of that with you?

Eventually, I can see this "standoff" with your WW wearing on her, and only be supported by the "dream" of her and POSOM somehow getting back together. Having those documents, written by POSOM to his BW, typically explaining that his AP (your WW) meant nothing to him except an easy piece of tail, would be wonderfully powerful in blowing up any lingering ties she would have to her fantasy-man.

I've urged you before to start fighting dirty, my friend. This is the kind of thing I meant.

If I could even fathom getting to the point of her even wanting to work on the marriage, that would be great. We barely even talk as of last Friday. Time is going by so slow in that regard. This is only the 18th day of her moving out so I'm sure it's going to take a while. I was optimistic at first, but that turned into hopeful. Our time spent together is getting less and less and the distance is growing further. I can only hope she comes out of the fog and sees the truth about what kind of man I am and what a marriage really means. I know that's not an easy thing and there are no guarantees.

Most likely, when she realizes that the OM is not going to leave his BW for her and the reality of D settles in, she will try to negotiate coming back home, GJM.

I mean, unless she gets involved in another affair, chances are very high she will want to come back like she did the other two times.

Just want to have your eyes wide open and be ready to set the bar SO HIGH that there is almost no chance for another false recovery. Have those requirements written down (add poly!) and be ready to stand your ground.

Hang in there, you are doing great

I appreciate that. I hope you're right. If anything changes, I'll definitely be posting here to make sure I get it right this time. In the mean time, I wish the tears would stop and I could find something I enjoy. I spend my time with my kids and read the bible and pray.

Self care, IMO, is so very helpful at this point. How are you sleeping? How are you eating? Are you exercising? Exercise will help you sleep better and also it basically acts as an AD.

Doing things like getting a haircut, getting some new clothes, finding a new hobby and getting out with some friends/support system will help too.

I'm able to sleep, but I have a low appetite. I cut my hair once a week because I'm a Marine. I still take care of myself, but I do need to exercise more and try to eat more.

Just dropped of DS 8&11 to WW. DD13 is having a sleepover at a friends house. I am now in an empty house with no one to talk to. The pain starts over each day and I hate it so much. So many 'what if' questions. It hurts to see the pain on my kids faces when I feel it too. We only have each other and now they have to deal with being in a 1br apt. I feel at peace knowing that they are with her each night and know that they occupy her time and not some OM, at least not for those moments. The aches I feel just won't go away. My soul is on fire and I can't breathe. I need peace within. I can't find it. I

I encourage you to get your kids with you, and they only see her on weekends or a couple times/week.

Perhaps some of your Marine buddies come over for an evening of cards, darts, movies, etc. Sometimes it's important to be surrounded by people that care about us.

That's true. I gave up a lot of my friends after being a Drill Instructor because I didn't have time to hang out. I'll have to make more I guess. Luckily I had a friend come and pick me up this evening. I was feeling pretty down and was starting to text my WW to tell her how much I missed her. I'm glad he got me out of the house. I didn't send the text. It would have been a major set back.

I haven't posted to you, but I've been following your thread.

Getting out of the house with a buddy is a great idea. Distractions are so helpful while your WW is on the fence. It's really healthy to get your mind off the problem as much as possible.

Are you on ADs, by any chance? (Sorry if I missed this) They might really help you during this difficult time. There are some out there that have no sexual side effects and are generic and start helping in a couple of weeks.

Good for you for not sending that text. Let her wonder what you're up to.