Agree with this completely. This behavior just smacks of someone that is intentionally being hardheaded and stubborn, but is still clinging to what truly means the most to her. She doesn't want to back down and admit that she is wrong (even though she knows she is), but she doesn't want to lose your companionship either. She is literally stuck between the proverbial rock and a hard place.

Lol...yes, That's my perception too, but why?

I guess the only way for her to make a decision is for me to either keep Plan A or go Plan B. So essentially I'm stuck either way.

No G, you are not stuck. You have more control than you realize right now. I hope MM, and others, pop in soon to advise you on this better, but I'm going to give it my best shot right now.

If I (and I do mean I) were you, it would be preparing for Plan B. Right now, you are supplying the bulk of her true emotional needs, but there is no one else out there to supply her with whatever she thinks she's lacking. Or maybe there is. Who knows...right?

I can sense that you are the biggest fuel for her emotional furnace. It's there. I think that she just has to be stripped of that fuel to realize just how valuable a commodity it is and feel the consequences of that deprivation.

I know this isn't what you want to do. I understand that. I'm just worried that as long as she's being fed by you on the big ENs, and getting the minor ENs met elsewhere, then where does that leave you long term?

Right...I think she would be stubborn enough to ride it out to the point where I'm not in the picture. I don't think Plan B would bring her back. She would probably accept it and move on. She would probably say at least she tried. Probably blame me and say I gave up. I feel like she needs me to be strong and persistent. Then again I'm not really sure these days.

I know how you feel. I have similar thoughts about plan B with my wife. I imagine that she would take it as a sign that I don't care anymore and just get her ENs filled elsewhere. At least now you are still tossing those stones in the river.

By the way, if it makes you feel any better, I am jealous of your situation. My WW is still consumed by her A.

Like you said, I'm not really sure what to do these days either. Nothing feels like it is doing any good.

You may not be able to see it from your perspective, but you are making great progress.

Okay, first, STOP TRYING TO FIGURE OUT A WAYWARD. You have spent too much time and energy on this already. Why is she ignoring you? Because she is a wayward and she is selfish. She hangs out with you because it makes her feel good, so she ignores you to feel less good about being with you. BUT, being around you makes her feel good, this is what your Plan A is doing.

Second, MOST BSs believe that their WS will LOVE PLan B and use it as a way to blame the BS, and move on. Well, that doesn't happen. Especially after an AMAZING Plan A which you are pulling off right now. Read people's threads who have gone into Plan B, you will see that I am not wrong. Even BSs who thought their WS wouldn't give a dern get a much different reaction from their WS. BUT that's not why they enter Plan B. I agree that you can PLan A much longer, so keep it up.


What Plan A things are you going to do today?

GJM

I'm going to copy a part of the "Lighthouse" passage I posted last week. It truly explains what she's doing..

Their actions are actions that they themselves do not like in themselves right now....though the need to go back again and again and attempt to prove themselves wrong or right is strong...they do not like what they are doing...

Their actions towards you, the children, the OP and themselves keep them from engaging in any kind of real interactions with real depth and truth.

All they offer are misguided attempts to fill the void that has appeared in their life...yet the filling is way to fleeting to sustain them and the truth is with them each night he or she lays down regardless of whom is next to them....

They are the living cliche of no matter where you go to hide, there YOU are...

He or she is lost to themselves..

And you stand at that point of being the lighthouse home...even though they create the waves that block their vision from seeing that...

She's acting this way because she has to prove to herself that she's right.

Listen, My W is the queen of the town of Stubbornville so I know where you're coming from. It will take some time and even if you give it that time, there's no guarantees. But if you can detach yourself from the drama and continue the Plan A stuff, it can have an affect. And I think you're seeing that happen.

Remember when I told you about the pull backs? They're GOOD. Show's what you're doing is working. She's conflicted. And conflicted is good.

I understand your concern about going to Plan B. Steve Harley told me that there is a risk with Plan B so if you can continue to handle Plan A without losing your love for your W, then keep on Plan A'ing.

I know it's hard to see progress when you're so close to the situation, but it seems to me, you are making progress. And if you can keep it up, then do so.

When you find that your feelings are becoming hardened towards your W, that's when Plan B should be implemented.

Hope this helps.

H4U

Listen to H4U,

this is exactly what is happening with your wife, conflict within herself, my husband was exactly this way, there with me and then pull back......but there with me......
It made no sense to me either, especially when he was saying he wasn't in love with me and had feelings for another woman yet there he was spending time with me, in his home, with his children.........eating with me, there with me.........If she wanted to be gone she would be already, she is choosing this, your plan A is happening very nicely........one day she will realize that her life is where you are.
patience is the key......being someone she needs is what you want to be......

Gunny, a lot of good info you are getting. Scotland actually said it the most succinctly...although all of the posts are right on!

Remember that battle plan we talked about? Arent you in Plan A?

Okay, since you are in Plan A, what are you worried about Plan B for right now. You arent even close to Plan B yet...so why are you worried about that?

I will give you a quick clue on your view of Plan B, and then we will get off of it because you need to be concentrating your efforts on Plan A!!

Here is your clue: YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOUR WIFE WILL DO IN PLAN B! I wish I had time, because I would go back to my threads when I was going to Plan B. I said the same stuff...and guess what? I was WRONG! The odds are in your favor that uf you do a good Plan A and then a good Plan B, that she will return. Notice I said ODDS? Thats because there is no guarantee!! Which is why you Plan A your butt off so that you move the odds a few more percentage points in your favor before your wife has to find out what that rock and a hard place truly feels like.

Okay? Got it?

Now, back to the plan.

Your wife is cake eating BIG TIME right now. She is getting needs met all over the place. And what she doesnt want is anyone to stop meeting those needs. Including YOU!! That is the rock and hard place that Scotland is talking about. She is in a no win situation because no matter what she does, she will be in pain if she doesnt maintain this balance between everything.

This is what Plan A is for. It is for you to get as much dependency of her on the needs you can meet for her. And, if that isnt enough for her to pull back...then you pull EVERY ONE of them away from her all at once in Plan B.

Instant pain! At first, the pain will be horrible. And she will lash out. How dare you cause her pain? So, she will lash out. And when she sees you are dark, she will eventually go "fine, I dont need you." And she will try to fill those needs some other way.

But she cant. She will fail miserably. Added to this, because she is miserable, she is going to love bust like crazy with the other person or people she is involved in who are meeting needs. "Why cant you make this all better? Why cant you meet my needs?" She will become cranky and demanding. Not very endearing for the other people involved. Most often, they will pull back from that...because they didnt sign up to meet all of those needs.

And then where does that leave your wife? She has none of the needs you have met being met. She cant get anyone else to do it. And to top it off, the OM is pulling back because she has truly turned into a cranky, crazy person.

You see? This is your plan. And many dont like it, or think their spouse is different. Blah, blah, blah!

I told you in one of my first posts to you that neither you nor your wife are unique in this. Just another run of the mill affair. Liek we have seen countless times. Sure, it is not unique to you because you are in it.

But trust me...this is the same old story.

So, the odds are in your favor. Not hers.
You have a plan. She doesnt.
And you are now in control. And she is about to lose total control.

Now, tell me how things are not going your way right now???

GJM, exactly which part of the convoluted phrase "no expectations" are you having difficulty retaining?

You are NOT Plan A'ing for her. You are Plan A'ing for GJM, or at least the GJM of some time in the future, when, if things do not work out with WW, and you ask yourself the enevitable "Did I do everything I could....?" question, your answer can be a robustly truthful, "Yes".

As a corollary, the Plan A you are performing now will also serve to answer any questions from your children years hence, about your efforts to recover.

And he is correct here! Remember, even though Plan A does do certain things as I outlined...in order for you not to fail, no matter what she does...then this has to be about YOU! You have to earn your way out, if that is what is going to happen.

Thanks for your post. Some times I don't see the progress. I often feel like pulling back myself, but I know I can't.

Of course you do, Gunny. Perfectly natural!

Good question. My wife went home early today because she's not feeling well. She stopped by for a few minutes and I offered to bring her food or meds. I'll be making dinner later and will invite her like I do every night. Conversation is all I can offer right now.

Thanks for your post jessitaylor,
That first statement is powerful. I've been patient with her, but in my own mind, my taker is complaining.

MM,

I'm so glad I have you posting on my thread. I agree with your thinking. I know my situation isn't unique. That's one of the first things I figured out after posting here for a week. Reading the "things waywards say" thread also helped open my eyes. I also appreciate all of the insight I get from other posters. The collective perspectives we all receive is a great help. I CAN do this.

NG,
I forgot that Plan A is for me. Thanks.

Very good! This is what you should be concentrating on!!

I remember when my wife and I were first separated. She was working as a nurse extern. Not much money, as she was trying to finish her nursing degree. She was getting nothing from me, and living in a one room apartment over some small church.

One time, after the kids had spent the night, one of the commented on the fact that there was very little food in the house. So, the night before she was supposed to have the kids again, I went to the store WITH the kids. We bought groceries for their mom. Then while she was working at the hospital, we pulled into the hospital parking lot and all the kids jumped out and helped me load them into her car. And then we left. I never told her. She just came out and found them. Why did I do this? Well, Plan A for one. It began softening her up after that because I did this without asking and didnt even let her know. I just did it. The second reason was that my kids saw this. So, in this mess, they could still see how much Dad valued Mom. You see?

The second time was when she was extremely ill. She called and said she could not have the kids because she was ill. I inquired on how she felt. She said she had been in bed for two days, missed one day of work...and she couldnt even get up to feed herself. I asked "what do you need?" She said dont worry about it...she would take care of herself.

Know what I did? I got my mom to take my kids for a couple of days, I called in sick to work. I then went to CVS, spent like $300 on a humidifier, a bunch of cold medicine and everything else under the sun.

I then showed up at her door with bags in hand. She opened it looking like death warmed over. She feebly asked why I was there and that I shouldnt have come. I ignored her, walked right past her and began setting things up. She flopped onto the couch.

I stayed there in the same set of clothes for three days (I did shower there, folks). I fed her, kept the medicine in her. And laid on the couch holding her head for hours upon hours.

She has never forgotten those three days. The POSOM didnt even bother to come take care of her...he was too busy. And here I was...didnt ask for anything. Didnt want to talk about coming home or anything else. I just took care of her.

In their fog, they can see that. Feel it.

So, what you are doing is spot on. Charlie Mike.

That reminds me of the day my son found the affair phone (Dec 10th). That night she was having side pain. She called me multiple times and asked me to come over. I went over there and cared for her. I tried to leave at midnight and she asked me to stay. I spent the whole night laying with her. She thanked me over and over and said I was the only one that was ever there for her.

After she was feeling better, she cut that day out of her memory. It hurt at first, but that's what waywards do I came to find out.