ES,

You've kind of mucked things up by being a serial cheater, honestly all Plan B would serve as is a slap in the face to the man you have betrayed... 3 times? More?

Follow Pep's advice here. Also, you might start with something simple;

"Dear H, my repeated cheating was my own fault, my own cruelty. You have no blame in the decisions I made that hurt you, our marriage, our family."

It was his suggestion I stay here till graduation.

and HoldHerHand, it was twice.

I have written and called with all of that and more.

Plan B was something I chose not to do after I got some constructive help by Pepperband and especially Optimistic. But, thank you.

twice, then you were with a man after you were divorced and you were honest about it and if I didn't give you credit for that, I do so now. It would have been very easy to lie about that but it would have been very bad in the long run to do so. I believe you turned a bit of a corner with that decision and began to take responsibility for yourself.

As for the move. As you learn more about MB concepts (in time as there are many and they are not always easy), you'll come to understand that couples who are successful use very different negotiation tactics. It's no longer "my husband suggested this, so this is what I'm doing" or "I convinced my husband that I should do this, so this is what I'm doing" - instead, a husband and wife make decisions jointly after presenting both sides of their perspective and come up with an even better solution than either of them could have in the first place alone. I know it sounds confusing, but it's true and it works. I've been implementing it in my relationship with my GF and we're not even married yet but it makes our feelings for each other so much stronger because we feel like a real team.

So, I think as you put other things in place, in your own personal life, and then in your relationship with your ex, you may get to the point where you feel strong enough to reNEGOTIATE this plan to stay in Tx for the year. Everyone has encouraged you to do that including me. Personally, I don't see the same urgency however as I feel the time spent in the interim could be used to not only finish your degree but also to earn some credits in the MB school so that when you get back you are able to present to your ex and your daughter a more grown up, responsible ES who has some fantastic skills in relationships.

We all want you to succeed because you are here and part of our family now. We'll encourage you to work hard and think of things differently. It may be confusing at time but if you take one step at a time and be patient you can do it.

~opt

Once while you were dating, once while you were married... and once while the divorce was in process, correct? As in he came down to be there for the court date to finalize, and you admitted to another dalliance? You were still married, dear.

That's 3.

Neither here nor there...


Now, here is some food for thought - you state that you are staying until you graduation at your ex's suggestion... but here is something to think about; that's just more of what you have been doing the entire time! The entire time you have been putting yourself in front of your husband, in front of your marriage, in front of your child.

Think about this; what kind of message would it send if you dropped it all, RIGHT NOW, just to be closer to your ex husband and your child?

What message do you think that would send your husband, if you quit dilly-dallying and went to them NOW?

You weren't worried about wrecking your finances while having affairs, were you?

Debts are payable, credit is repairable. You have a SHORT window of opportunity, why waste it?

Thank you both for taking time to write here for me.

And you're right. The number is "neither here nor there"--what matters is the "turn" I made, and the commitment and decision to stay celibate and COMMITTED. THAT is what matters right now.

I like the idea of renegotiating. I have constantly brought up me moving to CA before the year is up, before finishing this degree, and he consistantly says "Stay, finish what you start" I am a little confused as to how my sacrifices to salvage some kind of relationship with our child's father by asking for his suggestions, relinquishing control on many things, and putting their needs before mine and my wants/desires is "putting [myself] in front of him, and my child.

One thing: Doesn't it take TWO to have a "marriage"? I'm committed to him. That doesn't mean there is a "marriage" right now, considering he's in a totally different world.

Lastly: He has to be "present" in his heart before we can start calling him my "husband". Just..."food for thought"

I'm sorry if I misunderstood the hx of infidelity. In MB parlance we would recommend you employ what we call extraordinary precautions to make sure you don't put yourself in the situation to do whatever it is you're trying to avoid. In this case I believe you want to put your energies into "commitment" or "faithfulness" to your ex in the event that he once again accepts you first as a dating partner, and then maybe see where it goes from there.

So there's another concept for you to become familiar with - EP's. in addition to understanding LB's and how they affect your relationships. In addition to learning all about EN's and how to identify them and meet them for your PROSPECTIVE partner. In addition to learning the friends and enemies of good conversation. Not to mention the concept I alluded to above: POJA.

I think you have plenty of things to keep you busy for now. All these things will help you present to your child a better mother (when the opportunities arise), and to your ex a better potential re-marriage candidate, whenever you feel ready to move back closer to them (that may be nextweek as has been suggested, or it may be closer to your orinal time table).

opt

I'm suggesting that you go to CA. Not with the sole purpose in mind of hooking back up with your ex, but to establish some sort of relationship with your child and to let your ex see you 'walking the walk'. I'm not saying that's going to achieve your goal of reconciling with him, but I think that's your best action toward that goal. Worst case scenario: no reconciliation with your ex, but you will have a relationship with your child.

Sure, it takes two. But the two of you are not married. So you are correct, the fact that you are committed to the idea of reconciling does not mean you have a marriage. But: you're not married. He's not your husband. He is a free agent. This point is moot.

I agree that her time can be well spent working on herself and her schooling. The big problem though is that she is a mother to a very young child and these formative years are crucial to their (mother/child) relationship. As you pointed out she may never again be his 'wife' but she will ALWAYS be that baby's mother.

I am with the PP who suggested checking into transferring credits and planning the move for July. That is only a few months and it will take that much time to plan everything.

I do like Opts suggestions to work on your domestic skills (I agree that is probably a big EN need for him) and casually let him know that is what you are doing.

Marital Bliss, thanks--I know I am not married and do not have a husband--that was in response to HoldHerHand's statements that I had both a marriage and a husband.

I must say, after getting advice to basically drop everything and move to CA immediately (am I the only one who got that impression from HoldHerHand?) and that it was wrong for me to stay and finish school this December (again, only my impression?) instead of moving to CA and transferring my credits (which I have done twice in my ccollege history; so when I say it will set me back a couple of years, I know what I am talking about) with no job lined up, because I need to be with my daughter (do people not understand that I--more than ANYone--realize what I have been MISSING out on?!?) made me a bit panicky and very troubled, because that is EXACTLY what I would do in a heart-beat, if not for prudence and planning, and if it wasn't for the fact that I have changed these last few years to not do anything out of impulsivity, or before consulting with my ex.

Very troubled here. Didn't get much sleep last night.

I appreciate everyon's advice.

Recap/the following is important:

1) I have committed myself to my ex, regardless of his feelings for me (or lack of them). I will continue to be faithful (committed and faithful until he marries someone else, if that be what happens). I already told him a while ago, that I am not looking, not dating, not interested in anone else. Okay--that's said. (again)

2)I will continue excersing two things--my Domestic Skills, and my body

3)I will continue to improve on myself spiritually, and in eliminating "LB's", promoting good conversation, and promoting and practicing skills in "MB".

4) Let it be clear: I PLAN TO MOVE TO CA (there seems to be some confusion on whether I am or not. Again I say: I have already planned on ,moving to CA asap. And, no, it's not going to be willy-nilly/immediately/before I have secured for a move that will be beneficial to my baby in the long run.

Sorry for all the spelling errors (I'm sure you all have picked them out already); I really do know how to spell.

It's obvious you are trying to paint me as some kind of enemy, so I'll no longer waste my time posting to you.

Good luck.

Thank you HoldHerHand--no hard feelings.

I'm still reeling from the advice to drop everything. I've been troubled over it all day too.

But, I was able to talk with my baby and ex today on Skype, and I did bring up the advice I was given yesterday to drop everything now and move, and he felt the same way, that I should complete things this year, and then move out to CA. We laughed and smiled when I said how excited I was about moving out there soon. it was a good conversation. I am expectant and hopeful of my continued improvements, and of the new life I will make out there with my baby.

You mentioned at some point that you were making sacrifices. I couldn't find it but I'm pretty sure it's above somewhere. I wanted to get back to that and point out that this would be an example of something that Dr. Harley does not recommend in marriage (how it would be applied to a relationship between divorced parents like in your situation....I suppose is up for some interpretation). What he DOES recommend is the Policy of Joint Agreement -- you can look it up. --just something I felt noteworthy to point out for when you are doing your research. As in the above conversation, you would both present your feelings on a subject (finishing school vs. moving to CA) and hopefully come up with something between the 2 of you that is even better than what you could envision on your own. This concept also requires negotiation skills -- another concept you can look up here in addition to the friends of good conversation.
By the way...........how was your conversation? It sounds like maybe more balanced. Usually you feel good about a conversation like that, and you are obviously encouraged.

Don't forget to check your library for Dr. Harley's books, or get them on the internet if you can swing it. Lovebusters would be a good place to start (after checking the basic concepts on this site).

opt

Oh, and you would benefit from listening to the radio show broadcasts. They are very helpful to anyone. Hearing Dr. Harley talk somehow puts what you will be reading into a new and stronger perspective in my opinion. I wish I had started listening to the show many months ago.

opt

Uh-huh. What grade do you think she'll be in when you get there? What high school sports will she be playing? What college will she pick? Or will she even go??

You're wasting time. Seriously. And you're thinking of yourself. NOT your child.

What does ASAP mean to you?

Maritalbliss, I politely request that you not lace your advice with intense sarcasm, as this tends to distract me from your original intention to help; thank you. P.S. Maybe I am misunderstanding; please help me to understand why I am out for myself--I am here for help.

Optimism, I am kind of teary, because I am very encouraged in your suggestions on how to make things move forward with my ex,my family, and in myself. Yes, the conversation went well, and as I was walking home from my exam tonight (can't afford to drive my car at this time), I was putting some thought into having a deeper discussion with my ex about what I would like to do in the near future (moving).

I plan to write and call him on that. Oh, and I am starting to listen on Dr. Harley's programs, and read this material (even put some into practice today)

I would HIGHLY suggest not reprimanding or criticizing members of this board that are doing nothing but giving their own free time to help YOU. They don't have to be here. Just listen (well, read actually), take notes, and don't dictate how you will receive the best information you'll ever be privy to. You can be ignored as easily as accepted. Remember that.

Thank you TigerWes.


Edit: I will sift through sarcasm silently (it is very distracting and hurtful), but will not be too quiet, as I may have questions and also feedback on my progress also.

Again, I am here for help, and am definitely appreciative of it (as I have shown in my responses)

Thank you to those who have helped me out, because it have really been a guiding light

You're welcome. Now get your [censored] back to Cali ASAP and get to work!