Fog babble...just be prepared in case she does file. She may not tell you anything and I'm sure OM will want her to file at some point.

Ok, very stupid question here. Can I forward her a joke that I received at work? In the old days I would at the drop of a hat. But now?

And the clincher is, it's from her cousin (but I can remove that).

I'm not sure about that. I used to send my wife jokes on a daily basis. I haven't sent one in months. You could always see what her reaction would be, but don't expect a response.

GJM, it's just wrong for a person to put someone else under such stress. Here we are holding down a household, taking care of the kids, getting them to school, cooking meals, grocery shopping, school lunch money, cleaning the house, doing the laundry, taking care of the pets, making the house payment, making the home equity payment, making the electric/gas/water payment, fixing things around the house, school projects, homework, etc.

Her responsibilities? Rent, breakfast the single time DD stays over each week, what to wear over to the OM's house.

Amazing how they are getting off with NO responsibilities. Hard to believe a grown adult can do this to another (but I cannot cast any stones here), let alone their kids. Don't get me started on the kids. How she can leave our home and kids is beyond me.

I could never do that in a million years. No other person is worth my family. And I know, I've been in the WH frame of mind 19 years ago (for about 2 months). So I can truly understand her fog, but that was pre-kids for me. As a matter of fact, I was already comparing my W to the OW (she was single) and realizing things I was missing about my wife. So I was beginning to de-fog somewhat. Then she called me one day and said she was pregnant (with DS). I immediately went over to OW's place, explained that it could not continue, that I had a family that I needed to take care of. Never looked back, never called her again, cut it off cold turkey. I was ashamed, humiliated, etc. So my wife never really asked me any details, maybe a few here and there throughout the years.

I learned my lesson and never did, nor would I ever, ever do something so friggin' stupid and selfish again to my wife (and kids).

Sorry, just a little venting.

The wife you once knew is no longer there. I should say the wives we once knew are no longer there. They are consumed about their fantasy life. They use any and every excuse to find a valid reason to do what they are doing. Read walls and doors by Mortarman. It's on my thread and Pepperband made a separate post. Also read about the lighthouse which has also been posted on my thread. It will help you understand the mind of a wayward. It's up to us to guide them back to reality. They don't know it, but they need for us to lead them home.

You're absolutely correct. I read somewhere, I think it was on a MB thread, that spouses are responsible for getting each other into heaven. Wish I could remember where that was at, it's a beautiful way to put it.

Back this past Fall, I had an epiphany one day out of nowhere. I think it was fostered by a conversation with one of my BILs. I suddenly realized, what if God is testing me? What if God is testing my wife? My wife 'saved' me 19 years ago by allowing me to come home and forgiving me (I think). My wife has always had a somewhat self-centered attitude about things, which she has now taken to the extreme. What if God is testing her? To see if she can grow and mature beyond this selfish stage? To learn how to love unconditionally. At the same time I'm being patient, waiting for her to 'pass this test' and be there for her.

By being there for her and by her passing her test (hopefully), I can help her get into heaven. If she chooses not to, well then I tried, but what more can you do?

I read '31 Reasons to Stop An Affair'. Very good and professionally written. Google for the PDF if you haven't seen, it. I gave it to my wife, I don't know if she read it. If your wife has not read this, get it in her hands.

One snippet that I particularly like from that PDF is:

"In fact, the love generated in an affair is not love at all, although it may feel like it. It is an illusion. It is built around how that person makes you feel, not about how you truly feel about them. It consists of the belief that another holds the answer to your felt needs. True love, on the other hand, is the love you receive after your mate learns of your betrayal and chooses to love you anyway."

As good as the PDF file may be, getting a WS to buy into it is nearly impossible. Especially if it's a shot at them. I'll read it though, but I advise you to use the tools here.

There are two noticeable things that set my WW off: 1) me interacting with her family, 2) the kids ignoring her. On the second thing, I�ve seen this affect her within the past 2 weeks, but yet it�s not enough to turn her around. I think it took WW a good 3-4 weeks [after she moved out] to realize how dead set the kids were against what she�s doing. So I don�t want to say this is no longer having an effect on her, but who knows how she reacts when I don�t see her.

My question is: will the low-level of activity between her and the kids eventually have a dramatic effect on her? Remember, I�ve heard that she claims the kids will eventually come around (I�m sure her divorced friends are telling her this, because remember, misery loves company).

Eventually come around? This could happen....maybe. In the mean time, she is missing time that she cannot get back. Your kids only grow up once. My son still doesn't talk to my W. Now that he's 12, he says he wants to let her know that he wants to live with me.

My son said she is ruining his senior year and even said she's emotionally damaging him. I'm with the kids every day and I ask myself how she can miss out on this because you're right, these times will be gone forever.

She may claim that she knows what she's doing, that she's woken up ( I heard that one), well if that was the case it would imply that she's making rational decisions. I would think a rational decision would have been to D months ago so she could begin her new life and begin the 'healing' process (if you can call it that) for the kids.

It's clear to me that she's not thinking this way and that she's still deep in the fog. How else can you explain ruining your son's senior year and jeopardizing the emotional health of your kids. I can't. From the excellent mother she used to be, the only explanation can be she's in the delusional, fantasy world of the A fog.

I guess that's what keeps me going in Plan A. That there is a possibility that she could one day come out of the fog and return to our family.

Have you read this?

Lighthouse

Yes, I've read that. It's very good. After reading it, I made my own interpretation of it and saved it off:

<wife> is a ship in a bad storm and I�m the lighthouse on shore. I�m not on that ship and I cannot help her navigate. I can only be the light on the shore showing her the safe route through the rocks. She has to navigate the stormy seas herself. I cannot get to her to help her. She has to do this by herself.

The other man is the pilot on her ship. She let him on board and he hijacked her ship. By piloting her ship, he steered them into stormy seas. Affairs will almost always sail into stormy waters and the ship will do one of three things: 1) her ship will regain control, casting the pilot overboard and steer towards my lighthouse, 2) the ship will perish in the stormy seas as you watch helplessly on shore, 3) the ship will sail to clear waters.

Sorry, I just need to vent.

As I walk around here at work and see women I know that are married and have kids, how can any OM destroy that? I mean if any one of them was having a rough time in their marriage and was looking to cheat, I could never do that knowing that it would devastate the husband and his kids. I instead would tell them to work on the marriage.

I still cannot wrap my mind around how POSOM can justify what he's doing to my wife and family. How a person can take that upon themselves that they are destroying a family. The dude must be a serial cheater. I can't explain it any other way.

You never, ever mess around with another man's wife and family!!! That's just written in the man book!

Because he's not a man. He's a coward.

Thanks TW, that helps.

Well, I've read that a WS almost always affairs down.

I guess I can take solace in the fact that I'm a better man than POSOM, and WW is definitely affairing down.

I must keep telling myself this!

Well, I tested the water by sending a text to WW asking how her day was, that I was busy for a Friday, and that I joined a Super Bowl pool.

I'll be curious if she even replies back.

She just got back to me. She said "Had a good day...doing anything for superbowl?"

Ok, I need help on this! I don't have anything planned for the superbowl (would have been a different story had the Packers won!), and I don't want her to think I'm just going to be sitting around.

I highly, highly doubt that she's asking to get together to watch the superbowl with me, in fact, I'd be willing to bet she'll say she has plans with her 'friends'.

Wasn't expecting to hear back, let alone ask what I was doing.

How do I Plan A effectively? Would love if she came over to watch the game. I'm thinking I should just reply back and ask if she'd like to come over and watch the game with me and the kids. We could have our own SB party. Neither one of us are fans of the teams playing.

SW, you just asked and answered your own question

I would say, I'm kicking around a few ideas, but if you'd like to come over to watch it with me and the kids, that would be better. Then come up with some ideas to prepare the snacks together.

Let's see what she replies. I sent off what you suggested GJM - it sounded perfect.