Folks, this thread is going nowhere. Here's the deal: Right, wrong, or indifferent, MM does not believe that his actions were, or were close to, infidelity. He is not asking us for advice on this matter. His spouse is not asking for help on this. The "old family friend" is not looking for guidance.

I have stayed away from this exchange for a while as I'm torn between somewhat aligning with the majority, but siding with MM on his rejection to being force-fed a solution where he sees no problem. The debate, with its elevating level of rancour, intentional and/or perceived, is to no legitimate end!

Shall we just end it?

NG, I appreciate many of your posts. Telling me when to give up on something isn't your right though. If I see something which I think I can help with, I'm going to speak up. If you don't agree with it, you can notify a mod, or argue the point.

MM, while I agree with NG that you didn't come out and ask for help with this Lady and your sitch about this specifically, there was a glaring omission on your part about your sitch which people have jumped in on to try to help you have a better marriage. Most of the posters here just look out for posters best interests and sometimes that means that we need to challenge their actions.

Do you believe that all people are hard wired to have an affair? Do you believe that anyone, under the right circumstances, EN's being met outside of marriage, is capable of having an affair? This is the crux of DrH's teaching.

EPs and boundaries are not just for the WS, they are also important for the BS. And a BS is actually at their highest risk of having an affair after their WS has had one than any other time in their life.

I don't believe that you are being honest about what was happening with this Lady. Does it really matter to me, personally, if you fess up that you were on the edge of the cliff, about to jump off? No. Am I asking to make you a monster? No. What I am doing is trying to help YOU. I am trying to show YOU haw there is a risk in what you are doing. I am challenging you, and you are reacting by personal attacks. Do YOUR work, and if you see a time when you can help someone else with theirs, HELP.

Shall we just end it?

Telling me when to give up on something isn't your right though.

Telling you? Do you want to rethink your response, Scotty?

I'll take that your answer to my QUESTION was "NO!!!"

Thank you, NG. I really appreciate it when somebody at least makes the attempt to understand another posters POV. I came back to this thread to answer some of the other posters questions and promptly began to take heat about my female friend, which I tried diligently to explain, but nobody wants to listen, or only listen to what agrees with their pre-conceived notions. My relationship with this friend, is built on a long history of shared experiences. SHe too suffered from the actions of an unfaithful spouse, and having intimate knowledge of my wife and I, she has been one of our marriage's biggest supporters, so the mere idea of she and I having an affair is ludicrous.

Scot, You call me a liar, and wonder why I react? Who are you to question my honesty? I agree with NG, this thread has served it's purpose. I will not be talked down to,or have my integrity questioned by anybody. So lets end it.

Excuse me, MM, you planned a getaway with another woman and believe a lot of things about that that are from the set of beliefs that lead to bad marriages, and around here our job is to help people correct those. That won't end.

Exactly, Markos. Bad behavior gets no pass here.

*as a sidenote- when I got a glimpse into what my spouse was doing, and questioned him- his first defensive move was to take great umbrage at me "questioning his integrity". When it all came out, and I was speaking with another friend who had a wayward spouse- that was her spouse's favorite phrase when he was doing wrong and she was suspicious, too.

MM-

I love ya. You got the chance to mangle your wife's guy and I envy that to no end. You also took the heat off some the attention I received from some posts I made recently. Thanks for that, too.

But, you making plans with someone you used to be with romantically for a weekend away and then the tidbit about she's been cheated on as well? C'mon!!

You've been a bastion of inspiration for me as I followed your progress but this stinks to high heaven.

Im not sure if someone I was dating in the past came around immediately after my dday if Id be able to turn down revenge nookie. It takes a strong dude and you were the strong dude to avoid it. OMW intimated something early on to me and even though Im not attracted to her in the slightest it was "out there". I (we) have the moral high ground and to give it up for that wasnt going to happen.

PS. I managed to inflame nearly every poster on the board throughout my time. Some never seem to chime in on my thread at all so I must have really turned them off to me. No matter how much our recovery has gone to plan a BS still gets these feelings and when we come here to release, we need have thick skin to how the brilliant, well intentioned long time posters will react to it. Even if we think out moves and thoughts are for the best. They detect malarkey and hooey from a mile away. And, they wont let you get away with it. Nor do you want them to.

Stay strong and dont dissappear from these boards.

And, you managed to turn long time posters against each other. Not an easy thing.

Markos, any time you or any other poster feel that I'm doing something wrong, I welcome that criticism, but when I have repeatedly and at length stated what is actually happening and posters like Scot question my honesty, that is a far different thing. I have taken a LOT of criticism here and am not offended by it, but Indie and Scotland attacked me ,personally, and that I won't tolerate.

I agree. I know that whenever I have gotten 2x4s on my thread it has shook me up at the time, but later I was thankful people didnt give up on me.



I think we can all agree with this. I remember thinking that MMs efforts in running off the OM would impress any WW. Hell it impressed me! If only my H had fought so hard for me.

MM, it is this feeling of inspiration that makes us care about your recovery plan. If you dont want to take the advice of peers on this forum, call Dr H on his radio show and get his advice on the matter.

But dont just wing it based on your own opinion, I beg you.

Mikey, I have no intention of leaving , although there are probably some posters who wish I would. LOL Seriously though, I understand that many of the posters here are former BS and WS and have in all probability been lied to a lot, so that they can't relate to somebody like me who is a more independent thinker, and says what he means.

I LOVe how some people enjoy mincing words. Your post gave off the vibe of trying to get us posters who were pushing MM stop with this line of posting. C'mon NG, you and I both know that was the intent of your post.

MirrorMirror, lying by omission is still lying. Have you read the material about honesty?

Things get heated around here but it's never good to see someone leave. No one would want to see you go.

INdie, I'm glad you posted. I do value your opinion, but in this instance it is wrong. I will Never have an affair with this Lady......period! I can see that if given the right set of circumstances I'm as vulnerable to affair as the next person, but not in this particular case. I agree with DR. Harley that we are hard-wired to cheat , in the right set of conditions, just not this Lady .

My advice was not to take my opinion, but to seek the opinion of Dr H.

Scotland, you still continue to call me a liar, so until I get an apology and you are man enough to admit you are wrong, I won't answer any of your posts, understand that?

I agree with Dr. Harley and what is more, I agree with you, too, just not in this case. I KNOW what I'm talking about.

Its one phone call.

Actually, Indie and Mike, when I look back on it, I probably injured him far more than I intended. I MEANT to hurt him but got a little carried away. But hey, the little Bugger is in the pen now, so he has a whole new set of problems.