Hi rainy,

I would move forward with D. No spouse or marriage is worth all costs. I know it is hard but your life will improve even if you can't see it now. You need out of this toxic situation. Prayers and hugs to you.

This makes me so very sad reading this, rainy, because I see now that your feelings led you astray. It was not good for you at all as evidenced by the result. All it did was prop up the affair for a while longer while tearing you down emotionally and physically more and more. IT did nothing to help you personally or your marriage.

You speak alot about being led by your "feelings" ["this didn't feel right" "this marriage program felt right to me.."] and this is why you are so paralyzed. Feelings have no intelligence and you can see they have led you to a terrible place.

Once again, I fear your feelings are leading you to avoid the inevitable - divorce - even more. I think your husband knows you won't do anything to stop him, so this gives him the reassurance he needs to go out and pursue his affair for another day.

Please set aside your feelings and follow a sane path out of this nightmare. There is absolutely no reason to live like this and even less cause to wait to file for divorce. There is nothing to hope for in this situation.

You have allowed yourself to be sucked under with him. I hope you realize that.

Rainysweet - You are NOT responsible for your WH's behavior. You can NOT save him. He has to do it himself. Please STOP blaming yourself.

Take care of yourself, so you will be able to focus on what is important, yourself and the kids.

Be well!

I am sorry but I don't believe this. You posted last July about the fact that he had ended the A but refused to give up pictures of the OW and other "trinkets" from the affair. We all told you this was unacceptable and you agreed, saying that you knew that but needed validation. You later posted about exposure and being in Plan C because you seemed to acknowledge that he was still wayward.

I am sorry to be harsh but not facing reality is not going to help you.

It is possible to become addicted to the drama the waywards and the A create...or so entrenched in it that it is hard to break away. I think that's where you are. And your emotional health and your children's are suffering because of it and it's only going to get worse if you don't start move into Plan B.

I am hoping to see posts from you talking about who you will be using as an IM and your PB letter, etc, not more posts about your WH and the OW and the A. Because the A isn't the problem anymore, you have no control over that ~ it is the lack of action to protect yourself and your children at this point...

AMEN! Please read this again, rainy. Susie is right. Your H is not the problem. It is YOU. You have been following your feelings and that has precluded the use of logic and reason. Feelings have no intelligence, feelings are not truth.

Rainy, now that you have tried it your way, why not give MB a real chance?

Get into Plan B. Even if you decide that you want to Plan D, I would Plan B at the same time. You don't need to be anywhere near him.

Your WH has been gaslighting you and you are heading for a nervous breakdown if you do not remove yourself from the drama.

Post haste (as fast as possible).

Please keep posting here and craft a plan and stick to it.

just adding another voice here. rainy, you MUST go into plan b. you MUST. you need to make a plan and act on it. you have got to get into a place where you can push feelings aside. stop hanging on to that false recovery! gf, you deserve so much better than this. you *have* done your part. it is now time to cut him off and heal yourself. you don't have to file for D yet (though you can and then drag it out), but you need to start taking positive steps for you and your children. you are fortunate that your kids are old enough to see right through him - let them be support for you. but to do so, you have to support them. it must be very hard to be trying to help you when they don't know when the abuser is coming back or not.

now get going on your to-do list.
see a lawyer
get yourself protected financially and child-wise
organise your IM
write your plan b letter
figure out the holes where he can contact you and close them
inform your children of your plan and ask for their support
tell your family and friends of your plan and ask for their support

then come back and tell us where you are at w/the plan. don't forget to post your plan b letter so we can help you w/it. you want to do this right, right? goodness knows you've tried everything else thus far, and none of it has worked. chin up, girl!

Okay. I get it:) Thanks for the tough love. I will work on a Plan B letter and getting my own life in order.

Okay, I'm going to ask an unpopular question. I agree that my situation is probably to the Plan B point.

But in general, this bothers me. This is supposed to be a "Marriage Builders" website, but it seems like almost all advice I read moves people toward divorce. There seem to be far more divorces on here than successful reconciliations. Yes, you have to take care of yourself and your children, I get that.

But does Plan B really help to rebuild marriages? Or just help dissolve them?

i'm no expert here. PB is about YOU. healing you from the pain you have experienced, and also protecting your LB should you H finally get his head out of his you-know.

in my case, PB gave, as i said on someone else's thread, my H electro-shock therapy. once he realised i was DEAD SERIOUS about our M, he know he had to pull finger and put our M first and foremost. this includes, of course, putting the BS first and foremost. being strong about your position as W, and putting the bar high for your M, forces your WS to poop or get off the pot (sorry for the crudeness). yes, sometimes they choose poop. but you can't do anything about that. you can only take care of you.

i don't think we see a number of Ds. if you're only browsing the SAA board, you may see some, because the posters here are either in the first stages of shock, or in the middle of the A and still struggling. but yes, sometimes a D is necessary or you will be in PC forever. that sounds like hell to me.

Marriage Builders does save marriages, but it is not a marriage at all costs program. Marriage Builders does not "dissolve" marriages, rainy. Your husband has done that by leaving the marriage for his OW. He is gone.

Your marriage cannot be saved alone obviously. You cannot force your husband to come back into your marriage. There is no program on earth - not even GOD - will force your husband to end his affair and come back against his will.

Divorce would be the definition of success in your case.

In these cases, the best solution for you is to accept the reality that your marriage has ended. Plan B does not "save marriages." And no one ever suggested any such thing. Plan B only serves to protect you from your husbands abuse.

rainy, do you believe your marriage can be saved against your husbands will?

How would that work exactly?

p.s. your own lack of action has served to prop up the affair for a very long time. I don't know if he would have ever come back, but by coddling him all these years, you removed any possible motivation he might have had for ending his affair. He would have been crazy to give up having 2 women meet his needs.

And by pursuing him all this time, you have made yourself look more unattractive to him. Like Harley has said over and over again, men do not react well to being pursued and it rarely works. But you have learned that the hard way.

I say this out of compassion, rainy. I am not trying to be mean, but it is important that you face the reality of your situation.

I have not been around in awhile due to my recent D, but this is not true. However, there is a point where D becomes the best decision unless you want to stay on the crazy train with Plan Hope indefinetely.

I am sorry but this doesn't make any sense.

There is a large section of this website dedicated to recovering the M if the WS gets on board. If you have seen advice contrary to this, please point it out.

Plan B is for the BS whose WS won't commit to a plan of recovery or end the A.

Are looking for a "plan" to rebuild the M if the WS is still continuing the affair?

rainysweet,

There are some cultures/religions that require you to stay married to your husband no matter how badly he abuses you or your children. MB is not part of that. Right now, you seem to be of the mind that if you keep up with this, he will eventually change his mind and come back to reality. There comes a point where you need to recognize that this IS his reality, that he is not the man you married, that he is an abusive jerk and truthfully, your children are suffering. Please do not be the kind of woman that puts the hope(lessness) of a man changing ahead of providing a safe loving home for her children.

Rainy,

Keep in mind that you are on the Surviving an Affair board. The MB concepts are all encompassing concepts that create love in a marriage. There are other boards that are general marriage building boards based on the concepts where you will probably see less dramatic/traumatic situations and a much lower divorce rate.

However, when there is an affair present, which has an extreme affect on a marriage (as if I need to tell you that), there is a specific plan implemented to rebuild the marriage, and/or PROTECT THE BS from further harm. As Melody Lane said, it is not 'marriage at all cost.' I don't think anyone would be here supporting a program like that.

Thanks, everyone.