Hi, Phoenix. Wow, great step!!!

I have a question: was that you on Marriage Builders radio yesterday? There was a couple on the show, and the husband had been in counseling for sex addiction, and had used pornography and had emotional affairs on the internet.

If it was you, let us know; we can help support you in following the advice Dr. Harley gave.

If not, you might benefit greatly from listening to the show:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3880
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3881
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3882
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3883

Does your wife approve of the treatment plan you are in? Is she involved in it?

Dr. Harley's position is that for any addiction or other treatment plans, the spouse needs to enthusiastically approve of the way the treatment is going and, if possible, be involved in the treatment. i.e., if a man needs to go through anger management, he should make sure that his wife feels that the program he is going through is effective; if a man plans to attend an Alcoholics Anonymous group, he should make sure that the group he attends is acceptable to his wife, etc.

My wife has never really wanted to be involved in my treatment plan. I have asked her a number of times if she did but she just wants to be able to "trust" me. I am not sure how I can get her involved. Obviously what I deal with is a little akward for many people and I wonder if she just wants to pretend like its not an issue.

She is well aware that I have been going to some meetings for additional support and that my program starts in June. (I tried just doing it on my own in January-Feb thinking that 2 months of work would "fix" me...but in May I slipped) This treatment program is led by my counselor who specializes in sex addiction treatments. It will be a group of 11 other guys going through material specifically designed to deal with my issues. I am doing the treatment for me because I don't want to deal with this stuff every again. I want my wife to see that I am making this a priority so she doesn't get hurt again. Its going to be about an hour of work in a workbook each day and 1 weekly 90 min group session. I feel like I've said too many things to her that I wasn't able to back up so my words are worthless.

I think at this point my wife wants me to get help but really doesn't care what I do. Like I said she is done and checked out. She has told most of her friends that she has no other option but divorce and they support her in it. I don't blame them because a person should only get hurt so many times. At some point the emotional hurt is abusive...and thats the place where she is at now that she feels emotionally abused. Obviously my treatment has to come first because success is the only option. I'd love to hear some suggestions on what I can do to help my wife see I really love her and I am not going to hurt her again.

BTW it was not me...lol But thanks for the links!!!!

I am still praying that my wife will find it in her heart to forgive me and want to stay married. Right now she says she can't forgive me of some of the things I have done. I don't blame her but its hard looking at her in pain everyday. The addict inside me has hurt her and made it look like I don't love her and just want to walk all over her. My issues stem from guilt and inner pain and don't show my true heart.

I have said this 100 times... I know I am not "Marriage" material until I get the help I need. I am trying to encourage her to go to counseling but she insists that she doesn't need it.

You only see part of her pain.


I certainly HOPE you have not said these things to your BW.

Addicts are lazy and immature. All of them. No exceptions.
Addicts, all of them, want what they want when they want it - and they use the minimum effort possible.
Your addiction has numbed you to the needs of others.

Your "true heart" is that you want what you want (your marriage rescued from the jaws of divorce) when you want it (now) - and you are not accustomed to doing the hard work it will take to win back the TRUST and the RESPECT of those you have betrayed.


In your situation, this "encouragement" may very well be a gigantic smelly love buster ! It is most certainly not a love unit deposit. That's for damn certain, skippy.

Your immature thinking is that if only your BW knew how much YOU WANT TO BE MARRIED TO HER - that would magically cause her to stop the divorce.
You could not be more incorrect.

You really need to put your focus towards earning her RESPECT.
If she cannot RESPECT you, she will never consider a reconciliation.

This is right. Listen closely, PHoenix! Thinking that you just need to "get your message across" to your wife is wrong thinking.

You can start becoming marriage material today by reading and doing the things that are on this site. You do not need counseling or therapy or years of expensive and distracting navel gazing to accomplish that.

Nor do you need her to forgive you or commit to you or go to counseling with you to accomplish that.

You could start RIGHT NOW. The things you are posting are about your excuses for why you don't.

Do you have the book Surviving an Affair? It details four rules for marriage recovery that you need to follow. You can start following them RIGHT NOW.

Would your wife be willing to come here and talk with us?

She really needs to be on board with your recovery. You'll need her help and support. Is she willing to help?

She is such a private person she doesn't want to get on message boards and "spill" her business. I do want to let everyone know that I am almost 3 weeks into my recovery book with my counselor that has about an hour of work a day. I am working on being kind and doing things like leaving my cell phone out and being honest.

Pepperband---thanks for your post. Honestly it gave me chills. I've been 100% honest on here and hand't considered how I sounded. You are right I want it fixed now...and it can't be fixed now.

I really need to hear from some of the experts on what my best steps are. Currently I am in my recovery program and have a long way to go. I get that part of it. Best possible outcome down the road is to be a 100% faithful and loving husband to her and have the family together. She feels that she has no other choice but to have me buy a house in 2 months and move into it because she says she can't file for divorce. She wants to do it together. Her parents are pushing her to work through it but it just makes her more angry. I have shown that I am not trustworthy. She has all my passwords and email account information. She doesn't want to look at it because she doesn't want to live feeling like she has to look over my back.

Option 1: She wants me to buy a house and be apart in the next 2 months (She says she can't file for divorce because no one will let her).

Option 2: I stay at the house and be kind and respectful and work on me and treat her with respect.

Option 3: I come home from work each day to hang out with the kids and at bedtime I stay at my mom's house a few nights a week. To try to balance giving her some space and seeing the kids.

Option 4: We go to a mediator/life coach who helps us decide on how to seperate for the time being.

The current "other" issue is she is pouring her pain and misery out to a guy on facebook and he is strongly encouring her to get divorced because she can find way better guys out there that will love her. (he is single with a 6 year old). It hasn't gotten flirty yet but this is how her other EA started. (I don't have anything to stand on to tell her it isn't right...but I know it won't help the situation). Suggestions:

Yikes...wife just called and has set up an appointment with a mediator tommorow at noon.

Will she let you take her out on date to discuss your progress?
Listen to this.
Another excellent radio clip on Dr. Harley explaining forgiveness compared to just compensation.

Radio Clip explaining Just Compensation

She is compltetely against talking to me about my progress because she believes I'll never change and she doesn't really care if I get better or not.

Is seperation ever the best solution to keep a family together to allow one person to heal?

BTW for everyone's benefit we worked through some stuff in the winter and she drew a line in the sand saying if it ever happened again I was out. I failed to live up to that end of the deal.

It sounds like your BW had a firm boundary and you failed that test and now she is holding you to it.
It doesn't mean you should stop working on yourself and maybe one day she could see the changes.

You should really try to send her here. Maybe email some links?
I think you need to respect your BW's wishes. Did you listen to the radio clip? Dr. H talks about if the BS wants a divorce from the betrayal then the WS should honor that.

Did you listen to this clip?

I choose Option 2 and it was not a difficult test. Do you want a divorce Phoenix? If so then give her a divorce. If not then let her go through the process. You're not "controlling" if you don't cooperate with her devious plan to destroy your family, thats the ridiculous notion that most WS's try to lay on us.
She's cheating now, so there won't be much talking to her; she has found someone who is telling her all the things she wants to hear - even if they are lies and statements based on pure conjecture and mistruths. She's licking the honey of the forbidden fruit.
That doesn't change the fact that you are working to develop habits and behaviors that are respectable and more in line with who you want to be as a person/father/husband.

Separation is never more effective in keeping a marriage together than staying in the home together. Plan B is a last resort which is necessary for the Betrayed's sanity and to keep the LB from going into the red. but it's not advocted simply to appease the wayward Spouse and win their favor, or to save a marriage in it's own merit. No.

opt

I just listend to the podcast. Very helpful information. One of the things that struck a cord with me is "reasons" for infidelity...(there are no excuses). Going back to the root of the problem and where all my issues stem from. There have been a number of people (including her family) that have told me she treated me like crap throughout our entire marriage and walked all over me. I want everyone to know I OWN my mistakes. Regardless of how she acted or treated me I could have made different choices and I OWN the fact that I didn't and that hurt her. The root of my issues...I am a sinner first and formost who couldn't control his communciations online...but I've felt like a butler/cook/laundry person/servant for a long time...And felt no value. I am working on correcting my behaviors but honestly....I think there were many aspects of my marriage on how my wife treated me that were very unhealthy. Please Everyone don't see this as me making excuses for the things I've done and how I have acted. I am trying to figure out the root so things like this don't happen again. My wife is hurting because of me and in ways I can't imagine. I am making a better me and making better choices everday. I am working to be a trustworthy person and not hiding in the shadows anymore. I miss the feeling of God loving me...I miss the feeling of Jesus living inside my heart. I will fight for my marriage because I believe its right...but through the process I need to regain some respect for myself and from her in some way because I don't think I can survive in a marriage where I am de-valued as a person. (I can be more specific on this but didn't want to make this about her).

Pepperband, Markos, Brainhurts...and others (can't click away to list you because I'll lose what I typed) have gave me amazing guidance on learning to be the husband I HAVE TO BE. I am being 100% honest with my feelings here and want to get 100% honest feedback so that I can continue to work on me.

I have a meeting with a mediator today who is a life coach. Should I bring up the fact that she has been "talking" to another guy for the past week pouring herself out? Right now she doesn't know that I have her facebook password. I have been called manipulative everytime I bring up the situation that she is talking to someone else.

I've screwed up alot...whats the best approach to take when you are the screw up and your spouse doesn't want to make it work because she is hurt and has another guy to pour into?

If I stay at home she is only going to want me to be at her beck and call and do everything for her.

BRAINHURTS: You mentioned that if a BS draws a line in the sand the the WS fails it...and the BS asks for a divorce they should honor it.... Is this this best approach? Right now all she feels is like a caged animal by me telling her I want to find a way to make things work. She isn't willing to file for divorce because she doesn't want to look like the one who gave up.