jah, it is normal to be very sad when you start plan b. you are suffering the beginnings of withdrawal from your M and what you thought you had together (despite everything). when i was in plan b, i spent half my time pissed off, feeling i could take on the world because i was working the plan. the other half i spent sobbing my heart out in agony. it is vital you stay dark. any contact you have w/WW, no matter how desired, will only make you end up feeling worse - been there, done that!

you are a smart and thoughtful man. you must be an excellent pediatrician! you can do this. put all thoughts of WW out of your head and focus on you right now. she may come around, she may not. but you need to not consider what she may do at this point.

what are you doing to make yourself feel good today? (maybe you *should* get a pedicure?) :O)

Jah, what you have to challange yourself with when you have thoughts of leaving PB is...

What is the alternative?

Your WW has NO intention of stopping her A. She cannot even commit to #1 on your list of requirements, which is NO CONTACT with her AP. She is telling you she is interested in staying in the M, but in the same breath refusing to end her A or have no contact with her AP, regardless of its impact on you.

And in 3 years, this is not the first time she has shown such selfish disrespect. It is not the second time. It is the THIRD time. That you know of.

She has no intention to stop her selfish adulterous behavior and serial cheating. And she has no reason too, if you leave your PB. She will know she can do WHATEVER SHE WANTS and you will be waiting for her when she decides to come home. (Until she leaves again for the next A).

The alternative to Plan B is a lifetime of living with a serial cheater. Whatever agony you are feeling right now, x every year you are married for every new A you must experience. Living as a doormat for a woman who has no respect for you.

I can tell you do NOT want that kind of life for yourself.

You asked awhile back about 'tough love' vs. being controlling/disrespectful judgments. The difference is that you are not going to tell her what SHE needs to do. You are telling her what YOU will allow in YOUR LIFE. You are giving her YOUR boundaries. "I refuse to be in an M where there are affairs." She can choose to live in any manner she wants to, multiple A's, OC's, you have no control over that. But YOU can choose to not live with those things. See the difference?

Here are the scenarios that can happen here: 1) Leave PB. Continue in status quo. With no reason to, WW continues her A. Maybe recommits for awhile until she meets someone else and starts another one. 5 yrs later you are in the same place you are today, only with more OM's to think about. 2) Stay in PB. WW continues her A. Or she says she wants to recommit but never comes out of the fog or agrees to your EP's. You divorce her. You are happier as a single man who isn't suffering as the BS of a WW, or happy in a relationship with a woman who is able to commit to a REAL marriage. 3) Stay in PB. WW decides that the reality of single life is not for her, and commits to recovery. YOU run the show, set the boundaries, and she commits to them. Eventually, she sees the error in her ways and becomes the wife you deserve. You recover and have a happy M.

Which option will you choose?

jah, I assure you that you will feel MUCH BETTER in a couple of weeks. You will feel better than you have in years. You have gone through holy hell with this bad marriage from the start. You cannot change your wife and you can't control her. All you can do is stop making yourself available to be used and abused.

She either gets on board and makes the necessary radical changes or you get divorced. You win either way.

I HAVE COME TO A REVELATION TODAY:

Thank you for all your advice, but MikeStillSmiling, your advice hit home the hardest!!!

I am leaving plan B.

Correct me if I am wrong, but most betrayed spouses are trapped because they are partially or fully dependent on the wayward spouse. Or there's kids to complicate things.

Well, my situation is NOT this. I am a physician, I am responsible, I am a good husband that has always been loyal, and I have my family here. EVERYTHING in our marriage I paid for. And yet, I am the betrayed spouse.

My cheating wife is a grad student, not finished with her education, no job, no family support, no savings. NOTHING. She is selfish, materialistic, unloving and a serial cheater.

Plan B is for those who are willing to wait for their wayward spouse to come to their senses and come out of the 'fog'. Am I correct???

I AM NO LONGER WILLING TO WAIT FOR MY WIFE TO GET OUT OF THE FOG.

Why should I be the one in pain waiting for her to come to her senses???

I am coming out of plan B and going to my own plan. I'll call it Plan "Jah".

I am going to tell my wife exactly what I think of her. I am going to tell her exactly what a mistake she did for leaving me. I am going to tell her I am going to divorce her right here and now, and that is my final decision, and forget about all those conditions I gave her to work on the marriage. I TAKE THEM BACK. I am not going to wait for her anymore.

And if she leaves with this OM??? FINE. I'm going to just divorce and I'm going to be happy with that. I say this without any remorse anymore.

And if she begs me to reconsider, that she will follow my original conditions, that she wants me back??? FORGET ABOUT IT. I am going to tell her she is still on her own. I am not going to support her one bit. I am going to tell her that for a minimum of SIX MONTHS, I am going to keep her cut off with no support, and SHE has to prove to ME that she can get her life back in order. That she is deserving of me. This is going to be my 'tough love'.

THIS IS GOING TO BE MY NEW PLAN. It is not following the 'marriage builders' advice of plan A or plan B anymore. I don't think my situation fits with either. This is my 'jah' plan. Anybody have any thoughts???

***EDIT***

Sounds like a good plan to me! You are fully within your rights to decide to move on. I honestly think it is the wisest choice because that is where you were headed anyway. Your wife is only married for one reason: to get some financial support. She would have left you anyway, when someone new came along who would support her.

WHAT? You completely contradicted your self, jah! Which is it, you are done or you aren't done? I already gave you a plan where she had to prove herself and you started off by saying you weren't going to do it and then you write you ARE?

Which is it??

Okay, let me know if this makes sense.

Basically, I am not done with this marriage. I am just done waiting for her to come out of her fog. I am done with plan B. I rather divorce than wait for her.

So, I am going to tell her I am divorcing her, and I am going to give her a piece of my mind on why I am divorcing her. And if she leaves, fine. If she comes to her senses and wants to come back, I'm going to keep her cut off financially and give her six months to prove she is ready to be a wife again (which does include going threw MB)

THAT is the plan I gave you, though. The only difference is that you are abandoning Plan B for some reason. So all you are doing is abandoning Plan B but doing EXACTLY what I suggested.

Are you abandoning Plan B because you can't bear to be without her? Because that is what it looks like. This is all about your fear of cutting off contact, isn't it?

Okay, so sorry about all of this. Let me try and say this with a more level head.

I am not willing to go through the pain or time commitment of plan B. I don't think my 'serial cheating' wife deserves my patience in waiting for her to 'come out of the fog'. I rather just get divorced now or get started with marriage rebuilding.

If she cannot commit to MB immediately, I am ready for divorce immediately too. I really am. In this forum, every single person has told me to leave her. Some even said to just run away as fast as I can. But I held out hope, going through plan A, including exposure, and then starting plan B.

But I feel like I don't care anymore about waiting for her to come out of her fog in plan B. Being in pain while she has her fun. I rather just make an ultimatum and have her decide.

I know you will probably say if I make an ultimatum, then I will certainly lose, right? Well, right before sending out the plan B letter and going dark, this is the gist of what she e-mailed me: "I am kinda leaning more towards you, but I still don't know yet. But I can't agree to your conditions because I don't want to hurt the feelings of [OM] While I am sorting out my confusion, can you please promise not to date anyone else? I need time to think for myself."

That sounds like crazy talk, if you ask me. She is so much in the fog that she's gone crazy.

So basically, I feel either I do plan B, waste my time and emotion to wait and see if she does or does not come to her senses.

Or I make an ultimatum and see if she comes to her senses right now. If she doesn't, I'll divorce and I am okay with that. I'm ready to move on.

Does that make sense at all? Do you think I'm just going through the initial shock of plan B initiation?

You will win if you make an ultimatum. You need to file for divorce and cut her off now, my friend. She has been in 3 affairs and is not even remotely interested in recovering your marriage.

I would send her a letter NOW letting her know it is over. Let her know before she flies back to your town.

And she is not in a fog. Cheating is her way of life. This is a way of life for her. And it will become a way of life for you too if you don't get out.

The MB program can help you if your marriage doesn't survive the affair. Please stay with us. We can help you heal either way.

This is the comparison I want to make in my ultimatum. If she is so far in the fog that she can't see her mistake, then I'm going to just divorce.

Let me tell you WHO I AM:
I am a physician, someone people respect and admire because I save people's lives and care for their children.
I am a provider, someone who will make an excellent father someday and who has the income to support a family.
I am a loyal, caring husband who has dedicated his life to his wife, who made it a point that his happiness came from her happiness, and has never hit, betrayed, or done ANYTHING bad to his wife.
I am smart, funny, creative, a musician, a magician, and someone who makes people smile.

THIS IS WHO I AM. THIS IS WHO YOU ARE GIVING UP.

And what about xxx? Who is he? I really don't care. You think you are 'in love' with him, that he could be 'the one'. Right? So your judgement is clouded, all you see is the good in him. Well, this is what I KNOW about him:

Let me tell you who xxx is:
He is a lowlife loser, who sees a drunk married woman and takes advantage of them just to have sex with them.
He is an adulterer, someone who does not care about marriage and does not care if he ruins marriages.
He is a meteorologist. Who cares? You think his job makes ANY DIFFERENCE to ANYBODY? He tells people about the weather. Thanks alot.
You do NOT know what kind of father he is going to be. And do you think he is a provider? He's the same age as me and still stuck in graduate school!!! What kind of future is that?

Yep, jah, she is doing nothing more than using you to finance her despicable way of life and you are allowing it.

Where in this email does she really indicate any concern for YOUR feelings? Nowhere. That little line about "leaning towards you" is nothing more than bait to try and keep your interest enough to continue to finance her selfish indulgences. She is using you and playing you like a violin. And why not? She's been able to do it for three years with absolutely NO repercussions from you so what motivation does she have to stop?

Since she's gone for another couple of days I would pack everything she owns and have it ready for when she returns.

All you've done is talk. Time for a little action. Make it real!

Absolutely your right. If that is your FINAL DECISION, go for it. File NOW. She'll have to deal with the consequences of her actions.

WHOOPS, HANG ON. You just changed your terms. ARE YOU KIDDING ME? SIX MONTHS?? She needs to end this crap RIGHT NOW. TODAY. YESTERDAY. She needs to leave OM NOW.

Your Plan is Plan Marriage Loss. Do you not understand this???

"I am kinda leaning more towards you, but I still don't know yet. But I can't agree to your conditions because I don't want to hurt the feelings of [OM] While I am sorting out my confusion, can you please promise not to date anyone else? I need time to think for myself."


Dear wife, unfortunately, this email does not motivate me to forgive you. It does the exact opposite. It has helped me make the final decision to file for divorce. I gave you the opportunity to earn my forgiveness and even told you under what conditions I could forgive. Since you are not willing to meet those conditions I am not willing to continue in this marriage because those conditions are the only way our marriage can recover from the damage you have caused. No husband should have to tolerate multiple adulteries. I am not willing to do that.

In the meantime, I have taken your name off of our credit cards and bank accounts. I won't be paying you any more money and won't be sharing my home with you again. Please let me know where I should send your belongings and I will make sure they get to you.

I wish you all the best in life, jah

ML, what you said kinda interests me. You said "You will win if you make an ultimatum. You need to file for divorce and cut her off now, my friend. She has been in 3 affairs and is not even remotely interested in recovering your marriage."

So you think an ultimatum is the way to go? That I would win? Yes, I am going to file for divorce now. But I really do think she is interested in recovering our marriage, it's just that I'm an enabler. Plus, I feel that if I can just get her to commit to the program, it will work.

You also said, "And she is not in a fog. Cheating is her way of life. This is a way of life for her. And it will become a way of life for you too if you don't get out."

It might be her way of life, but somehow . . . she comes from a broken family and lived with a physically and emotionally abusive dad, one who had four children from three marriages. This does NOT condone or make excuses for what my wife did, but still . . .

Then, by all means don't bother with Plan B. Go straight to divorce. I don't want you to go through the 'pain' of getting your marriage back.

You need a certain amount of steely resolve and a thick skin to put your marriage back together. You, sir, DO NOT HAVE THAT. Our efforts to help you save your marriage are wasted on you. Why didn't you tell us that you aren't that interested in doing the work to repair your marriage??

Divorce her and move on.