Take away her cell-phone, and deny her all access to means of communication. Make it clear that any further attempt will be her final one.

Proceed all the more rigorously with your suit.

Your future with her is approaching the "You gotta be joking!" point. Prepare to implement the sanctions you lay out for renewed contact. You cannot long-term be her jailer, and that's apparently what it will take to keep her in line.

She's an addict for teenage boy.

Is this why she has had 3 affairs? You told her having affairs was ok as long as she tells you? I would define that as an open marriage.

Why hasn't all her contact information been changed?

My WH was a serial cheat and did most of his contact by cell. Guess what? No more phone. We share a phone. The Harleys share a phone.

Stop the conditions that allowed the affair.

Rinse. Wash. Repeat.

No, honesty about a bad act does not make it good. I am not willing to have an 'open' marriage; that's what I define as crazy. I'm not sure what 'wash, rinse, repeat' means, but I don't think it's the emotional support EN.

I'm just going by the book here (SAA), it says that I should ask my wife, "Did you contact OM today?" And if she admits to it, my first reaction shouldn't be, "That's it, we're divorced." or "How dare you lie to me again!"

It says I am supposed to take a deep breath and calmly say, "Thank you for being honest with me." And then work on the problems that caused it. Believe me, in my head I was doing everything I could from yelling at her, though. I also considered telling her, like NG said, "Okay, one more slip up and that's it!" But thinking about it, if I told her that then for sure she is going to lie, because telling the truth will just lead to divorce.

I'm just going by the book: thank her for her honesty and look for the problems that lead to contact. If anyone feels my situation is special or different from the book, I do want to hear your opinion.

So what am I going to do to prevent more contact? I asked my WW how did she contact the OM. She used the dorm phone. Originally I was going to wait until my meeting with Dr. Harley to discuss a plan (including should she move back to the apartment) but I have decided that I am just going to make it happen. She is going to come back to the apartment today.

The book says that if measures are still inadequate, it might require relocation and leave from work by the BS to get the WS through the withdrawal and to assure no contact.

I AM WILLING TO DO THIS. In fact, I am making arrangements now to take 6 weeks off from work (not easy to find coverage, but I'm demanding it), fly my wife to a whole different island with me, and continue working on the marriage builders program while I am with her 24/7.

We won't leave the island for another 5 days though, because the polygraph test is in 5 days. In the meantime, I am going to have her move back to the apartment. Which means . . . If I am going to continue posting here on the forum; I am going to have to be a little more discreet. I don't want her to know where I get my support from yet; I hope that eventually we will get to the point where I'll have her on the MB forum to get some 2x4's like I do.

I also feel a little weird about this 'hiding my posts on the MB forum' when my wife comes back, because of course, it brings out the problem of not being completely open and honest. But I'm guessing it's okay for now?

You are taking this completely out of context. You are coming out of PLAN B, the situation you are citing in the book is not. Did you forget about the conditions you gave for reconciliation? Did you not mean them?

Your condition for reconcilation after Plan B was that she end all contact FOR LIFE with the OM. You did not mean this?

You need to stick to your conditions and go back into Plan B if she contacts the OM. You are facilitating a false recovery by ENABLING HER ..................AGAIN.

Please read this.

READ MY LIPS. NO CONTACT MEANS NO CONTACT

Jah,

She called the OM LAST NIGHT!

What did your plan B letter say? Can you post that so we can read it again and all become familiar with your conditions?

What were your conditions?

See, when a person is not sincere about meeting your conditions, you don't enable them, YOU GO BACK INTO PLAN B. I had explained this to you before. To not reconcile until SHE DEMONSTRATED FAITHFUL BEHAVIOR.

She has demonstrated unfaithful behavior and has not ended contact.

The idea behind Plan B is that you set conditions for reconciliation by telling her you will not reconcile or even allow her to contact you *UNLESS* she meets your conditions.

Did you forget that part? You didn't say, hey lets reconcile as long as you are "honest" about your ongoing affair. You said she had to end her affair. Remember?

Being honest about an affair is irrelevant. What is relevant is that she END HER AFFAIR. Being honest will not make recovery possible.

jah, you are so strong. time away is a great way to begin recovery. but...i hate to add my voice to this, but you have such a long, hard journey ahead. please do not view her tears as remorse. they are just another tool in her arsenal to manipulate you into thinking she is sorry.

i am so worried about you. you have been so strong, so methodical, and you are taking the right steps (having her back in the home, poly, time away, plan to recover), yet i'm afraid of what is going to happen should all this come to nothing. i wouldn't voice that except that i think it is more probable in your case, and i'm afraid that you will fall apart at the seams if it does. this forum is here for you, to support you whatever happens. don't forget that.

i will be waiting to hear your updates from each step, and hoping, *hoping* that this woman-child will grow up and realise what an incredible husband she has before she ruins your love and trust for anyone in the future. remind me: did you expose to her family?

Originally Posted by jah

So . . . after explaining all that, today I asked her, Did you contact this OM in any way? She paused, then said yes, she called him last night, she missed him and just talked about her day.

'

Condition #1 has already been violated so this is a FALSE RECOVERY. Recovery is impossible unless contact ends. She has not agreed to end contact.

You told her you would not reconcile or speak to her unless she ended contact in Plan B. She knows you don't mean that and can do what she wants.

Yes; I know this. I was not going to come out of plan B unless she meets my conditions. But some conditions like 'no male friends' and 'no nights out apart' cannot be met unless I come out of plan B, correct?

Initially in Plan B, she told my IM that she accepted my conditions, and then wavered on condition #1 (No contact letter and no contact for life). So I did go right back to plan B. Then finally she showed some action: making the polygraph appointment, handing over all her passwords, writing the no contact letter. So THEN I came out of plan B. I understand that no contact for life is essential; please don't mistake my saying, 'thank you for being honest with me' as agreeing with her breaking the 'no contact for life'.

I am confused about this 'you are coming out of plan B, the situation in the book is out of context'. I am reading and re-reading the book; I believe you if you say I took it out of context. I must have re-read it out of order.

I know this whole process is going to be incredibly difficult; I know that even my high expectations of the upcoming difficulties is not nearly high enough.

ML, I mean no disrespect to you, and I know you want to help me stop being an enabler, but since I already have the appointment made I'm going to wait three more days until I am able to do the 'coaching session' with Dr. Harley before going back into plan B.

jah, take that book, throw it away and listen what everyone here is telling you. That book doesn't at all apply to your sitch. Yours actually is unique, and that's a rarity around here.

You are dealing with a serial cheater, not a one time cheater who just happened to let her guard down and accidentally fall in love with another man. She has been actively pursuing OMs your entire marriage, and I would bet the house before you even got married. If you're really going to try and make a go of this, then forget everything you have read in that book and listen solely to what you are told to do here. It's your only chance, and buddy, it's super slim at best I'm sorry to say.

You made a critical error telling her that crap about honesty about contact now and in the future with this POS. You essentially gave her permission to contact him as long as she was honest about it. WTF??? What you should've done is kick her [censored] out right then and there. Period. You laid down some "ironclad" conditions for recovery and then YOU break your own cardinal rule at the first breach of those rules? On day 1 no less!!!!!

BTW, have you called this POS yourself?? If she's serious about this she would have no problem supplying you with his phone number. I'm betting you a six pack of Red Stripe she fights you on it.

The thing I'm having trouble figuring out is just which one of you is the least interested in fixing your relationship

Thats fine and we don't have to waste our time helping someone who was never serious about Plan B. I have a house full of people here and don't have the time to help you look for loopholes to facilitate enabling. I like to spend my time on those who are serious.

But for the sake of others reading here, when one goes into Plan B and tells your spouse that you have conditions for reconciliation, you have to actually ensure those conditions are MET.

In this posters case, his WW did what most WS's do and AGREED to his conditions in word, but not in deed. This is how false recoveries occur.

Reconciliation after Plan B should be contingent upon the WS actually MEETING the conditions, not just saying she will meet them. As you can see, the words of a WS are meaningless. She is rejecting his conditions in truth

She has not ended her affair.

He is ignoring our advice. I explained this all to him previously.

Listen to Mel, she knows what she is talking about.

Mel aided me in pulling my head out.......

Got me straight on the plan.

warning: what's ahead is the unvarnished truth with no editing for polite society.

jah, i have to say, when i came out of plan b, my H had to be on that narrow path from day 1. if there were ANY contact by him, he would be out the door, all belongings on top of him, wondering what happened to the top of his head since his brain was on the ground, stomped flat. and i'd've considered burning down his precious garage with his expensive toys inside!

you have to walk the walk, man! there are CONSEQUENCES for broken EPs. what are yours? honesty is great, but breaking EP #1 is BAD. wow, if my H had broken NC on day 1, id'a said "screw all this NZ 2 year divorce nonsense" and flown to vegas and divorced his @ss lickety split (it helps that we were M in the usa)!

and i have to say, if it happened now, i'd do the same, barring the burning part. wouldn't want to get my own self in trouble over his bs. this IS his second chance. there's only 1. my consequences for broken EPs are all the same: insta-divorce. life's too short. what would it cost me? sure, an 8 week leave of absence. sure, a costly flight. sure, an expensive stay (though i could legally work if i wanted to). and in the end, no more bullspit. none, nada, zippo.

so i ask you again: what are your consequences for broken EPs?

ps: what's given me the inner strength for this is everyone here at MB! before MB, i'd have probably just wallowed. again, life's too short.

I know, I know. Pisses me off to no end. Feels like a waste of time, huh?

jah, when you're actually serious about this, and ready to seriously do what needs to be done, let us know. There's been an awful lot of time spent on you from some of the most caring people I have never met, but you seem hell bent on the pick and choose method of marital recovery from the MB library.

I would definitely encourage you to keep posting when your way fails (and it will, I personally guarantee it). The Plan B'ers will try and help you with that. That's assuming of course that you will actually choose to listen and learn at THAT point.

Jah,
Think as a doctor.
Compare your wife's affairs to an addiction.
If you throw your alcoholic spouse out and require no more visiting the topless bar, and the spouse tells you that he visited te topless bar because he missed the dancer....
Do you invite te spouse to return home and be thankful for the honesty?

The SAA book scenario was When Sue was living at home. Your wife is not.
You are trying to control her and think that taking 6 weeks off of work, and having her move back in will mold her into the loyal wife you want?

In SAA book scenario, Sue was not a serial cheater.

Serial cheaters need even more boundaries, more precautions, more work.

I am sorry but you are putting yourself up to failure if you do not keep your standards super high.

This is a FR, she is still in the A. Back to Plan B until YOU are over withdrawal from her and can see what's going on in a clear way.