Oh, my!

Turn my back for a minute and all HELL breaks out!

Would anyone mind if I ask FB the simplest of questions:

On which topic would you request advice from us?(Pick one)
a)How shall I assess WGF's actions in terms of renewing/extending (r/e) our lives together?
b)If I am at all interested in r/e, what protections and boundaries shall be erected to prevent a repetition?
c)Assuming the same r/e choice, what do I need to do to get past WGF's betrayal of the presumed commitments in our relationship?
d)If r/e is not my choice, how do I extricate myself from the current live-in arrangement?

I like uncomplicated tasks, so bear with me, okay?

Sorry about the long wait, but I've been busy , today. I took time to catch up with the thread, but don't know which issues to address first. Bigdaddybo, thank you for your kindness, and consideration. I would like to thank all of those who have tried to help me. When I first came here, it was because I had heard of Dr. Harley from a friend, and that he had a set of procedures that had helped many marriages get over some really rough times. Make no mistake, I consider my relationship with my GF as a marriage, even if some of you do not. I really didn't know what to expect here (not being a forum person), but the insults and attempts at character assassination by some of the posters caught me by surprise. I came here for help with my own, present day, issues, but some posters seem to want to crucify me for my actions of over a quarter of a century ago. But, Like the Willie Nelson song, "There's nothing I can do about it now". Should I have told my ex-wife about the ONS? Probably. But there were also some issues of my ex-wife's, that made my choice , at the time, seem like the right one. I do apologize,however, for making this more difficult, by not telling you guys about my wife's issues, or the main issues (both of ours)leading up to the divorce, but I won't talk about my ex-wife's very private, personal life, without her say-so. It's her business, not mine. Those of you who seem to despise me, will do so no matter what I say anyway. Perhaps MB isn't where I should be, but what I have already read on this site, has given me some insight into my problem, that I don't think I could have gotten elsewhere. In that respect, it has been helpful.

Neverguessed, ALL of the above!! LOL If I choose to try to reconcile with her, how can I apply Dr. Harley's principles to my situation. If I choose to end it, I can do that myself. I also particularly wanted to hear from anyone who has either been or had to do with swinging, and what the chances are that she can leave that lifestyle. We talked on the phone again, tonight, and she said that she would do anything I asked for a second chance, and would give me any proofs I would require that she has ended all communication with Dallas guy.

Yeah, how apt!

Yes, she can leave that lifestyle.
Swinging is supposed to be about the two of you together while you are doing that. (This is not MB-endorsed advice) If she wishes to include you and let you in on everything (O&H)(being there with her during), that's different from what you described in the posts I've read. Sounds more like cheating than swinging IMHO.

I agree, it was cheating, but I just wanted to get some input as to the mindset of swingers. She told me that she was with him, a total of 4 times since she and I have been together, that when she and her ex used to "play", he was one of her closest "friends", in the "lifestyle". I didn't know swingers even HAD a lifestyle.

Bob,


Her behavior is not cheating. Hello! You aren't married. You consider your relationshop a marriage, but it isn't one. Start by reading "Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders". Your approach to your girlfriend is a buyers one and hers is either freeloader or renter. Huge difference.

AM

Bob.
I you refuse to discuss your marriage on an anonymous marriage Internet forum then how can anyone give you advice?

Your girlfriend is a slut and you want to live in a pretend world where you are married in your mind.

I feel sorry for you. A few years from now you will look back on your life and say, well I never found the right one. You can spend the next 20 years of your life trying to fix this girlfriend.

I will refrain from posting until you are willing to be honest about your own marriage and not the girlfriend

Bob,

Here are some clips where Dr. H talks to a man who let his wife get involved into swinging and now she fell in love with OM.
Radio clip on swinging
Segment #2

Also did you listen to this one?

AM, You're right about us not being married, I just FEEL married, and wanted to know what MB principles apply to my situation, if any. I feel that it was cheating and so does she because she is trying to move heaven and earth to get a second chance. If she felt it was no big deal, why would she do this?

Sorry you feel this way, HDW, but thanks for your opinion, anyway. I am perfectly willing to discus my marriage, but on two conditions: 1. That I don't reveal any of my ex-wife's issues. 2. that any discussion of my marriage be applicable to my present relationship. To tell me to try to reconcile with my wife is meaningless, because she could not , even if I were willing to give it a try.

Brainhurts, I will listen to both, this evening, when I have time to digest them.

Well, swinging is adultery and is devastating to marriage regardless of whether a person agrees or not. People can agree to smoke cigarettes; it doesn't make smoking safe. However, he is not married.

FB, with all due respect, you are not married. Feelings are not truth. You are allowing your feelings to cloud your judgement. There is a huge difference between being married and living together. We don't treat them the same. Dr Harley doesn't treat them the same.

Shack up situations have an 85% divorce rate if they go to marriage. That is in situations where there has not been cheating and dishonesty. That is in the good ones. I give this relationship very low odds and I am an optimist!

Don't let your feelings cloud your judgement, You will come to regret it.

Here's another good clip of Dr. H talking about the difference between marriage and leaving together.
Radio clip

"Leaving together"--I'm going to remember that one. As that's what living together generally leads to. Leaving.

FarmerBoy considers his live-in g/f a marriage, despite the fact they aren't married, and despite the fact he still sees his ex-wife multiple times a week.

My WW considers us to "not be married", despite the fact we legally are, and she decided to move back in under our roof.

Yes, I expected you to start name-calling. Your type of person usually does, when they can't bully somebody into agreeing with them. I wonder if you used the same type of bullying to your wife, pre-affair?

I don't see any name-calling.

Where has there been bullying? I haven't seen any of that either.

You don't seem to realize that your baggage from your previous marriage IS HERE even if you refuse to notice it. Your infidelity carries over here and you are married to someone else yet continue to see your XW multiple times a week.

Instead of saying FarmerBob, he said FarmerBoy. Typical tactics of a bully.