If she says something along these lines just reply: "if something specific I am doing is bothering you, please always feel free to tell me"

She won't have a speccific example because she just wants you to stop being a good husband in general. She wants you walking on eggshells.

So she'll come back with a very general, overall complaint designed to have you too scared to say hello to her.

If she does, just completely ignore it. Reply "OK. Let me know if you can think of something specific I can do" and carry on just as before"

If however she requests something specific, respect her wishes and stop, which is a sneaky way of being affectionate!

So this is a good thing then?



When i spoke to him both before and afterwards he told me that they had not talked about our relationship althought both him and his wife are fully aware of what has happened and gone on. He said she had actually just gone there to calm down and cool off as it were and thats all he told her to do and then he brought her back home (due to our son having an accident and me calling)

So i keep up doing pretty much the things i have been doing then?

I have tried saying this to her and then i just get the "you are putting me under pressure" babble, i even said during yesterday morning something along the lines of "dont you like getting affection etc from your husband" her response to this was that she wasnt used to it and hadnt had it in 13yrs etc babble. Thats when i said about that i had and there had been a lot of good times but at the moment she was only seeing negative things.

You are correct that she doesnt give any specififc examples, and yes the feeling i get is that she doesn want me to stop been a good husband in general. Yes i do feel too scared right now to even speack to her or engage in and she doesnt\wont engage me.

It really felt yesterday like it has got to the point where she has said i dont do x,y and z and that now that i am doing them very willingly she cant handle it, she even said she could see the changes in me. I understand it will take time for her to believe and trust the changes in me are permanant and not going to slip back, and i feel that is what is holding her back so much now and making her scared\frightend. The other big thing i noticed yesterday was that where in the past i would have flown off th handle and had an AO yesterday i didnt and that she had expected me to and becuase i didnt it made her more confused (not sure that is the right term). We had agreed in councilling that if she felt i was getting angry and she felt trapped etc she would scrunch up and throw a pieve of tissue\toilet\kitchen paper on the floor and walk away, yet yesterday that never happened. Niether did she use her safe word we had agreed (we both have one) for when we feel there is too much pressure. The only person she really talks to properly is her dad who knows everything (i do accept that regardless of the situation she is his daughter and will be there for her no matter what) apart from that she seems to not really talk to anyone that i know of.

Don't say stuff like that!!! Its a DJ. Listen intently and affectionately, ask her what you can SPECIFICALLY do for her. When she babbles at you, just say 'OK, let me know when you think of something' - and drop it!!!

- ok and yes i sort of guessed after the fact i shouldn't have said it, what should i be asking her specifically about though?

Is it something i am doing and she doesn't want me to or something she would like me to do that i am not doing. As i have tried asking the latter in the past and i get "i don't want you to do anything" back at me, god i am so confused right now. Like i said it feels like all the things she has complained about i have stopped doing and started doing the things she wasnt and now thats not right either, as the saying going "dammed if you do and dammed if you dont"

Yes exactly. That's why you are listening much too closely when she babbles. Getting yourself all worked up.

If she has a genuine complaint, she will spell it out so you can act on it. Like 'stop with the goodnight texts' but she isn't asking you to do anything specific is she? She therefore doesn't want you to stop doing any specific thing.

Until she spells out something specific its just babble and you should respond kindly and affectionately like to a drunk you are helping get clean.

Just smile and nod and carry on as before.

Oh but specific requests for 'space' and 'privacy' are pleas for you to look the other way while she has a drink.

These specific requests should be met with a firm No.

Yes eaxclty to what?

Correct she has said anything specififc to me just tells other people she feels pressured that every where she turns there are messages\notes from me either email, paper, txt or facebook.

This is hard as whilst she doesnt tell me anything or talk to me, she seems to tell other people eaxclty.

She didnt aske for "space\privacy" it was "space\time" and this wasnt in a physical sense either. She is saying it from a stop trying to smoother her sense with everything i am guessing its almost like ever corner she turns i am there, and that i have effectively been trying to do in a few weeks everything that i should have done of 13years etc. I think 20years hit the nail on the head saying i was making my self way to available, i just need to back off a bit to give her the "space\time" to process her own thoughts\feelings rather than having me continually doing things.

Another think our friend said to me is that i need to back off on electronic communication as well (this was something the counciller said as well) taking a step back i would say that 75% of our communication is via txt\facebook\email etc rather than face to face. The only reason this seems to be the case is that she cant actually verball communicate with me or want to and that electronic right now is the only way of having some dialog. Whter that is me sending night night txt or during the day etc. Also the wierd thing is this morning we get up and its pretty cold atmosphere but i take our son out for breakfast and drop him at the scooter part, when i get back she has gone out but then i get a TEXT from her saying "i passed you as i came into town, am going to see xxx (female half of couple she went to yesterday) and have a drink with her. I am happy to pick xxx (our son) up later. I have got dinner sutff out but ifyou were taking xxx out dont worry". So rather than txt back i called her, and said wasnt going anywhere and dinner would be cool etc.

OK, these people whether they are well intentioned or not are actually interfering in your plan. So we must manage this.

Who are they? Can you list how many different people have passed you this message and tell us who they are?

Wel specifically the couple from yesterday and also the counciller but have heard her on phone talkin te her dad or best friend and saying the same things.

What has the wife from this couple said to you?

What has the counsellor advised you do?

I am assuming her dad and BF arent passing messages.

Have you apologised and explained matters to her father and best friend? Explained your EPs? I am assuming these are people who helped her through the first affair and may not be your most enthusiastic supporters?

How many of these people support your efforts to separate her from OM?

She hasnt spoke to me that much but said she is a friend to us both, but isnt going to get stuck in the middle been a go between which i respect. She said she will listen to either of us and wont just agree with things we say either and tell us the truths about things. She doesnt condone or accept the A and will support that it was an answewr to the underlying issues.

At the moment the counciller is on holiday and has just initially been getting us to the state or their been no AO on my side and that my stops feeling frightened\scared or me and can relax and start to talk as well us agree agreeing the words\signs for when my wife does feel frightened\scared (which she hasnt used)

- correct they really dont talk to me at all.


Yes i have apologised and explained thing to them and yes they helped her through the first affair as well where i was blackened and had to regaind and rebuild their believe and trust in me, that was why i thought they had the right to know this time what had happened when i exposed (which the wife went mad about) and yoru correct they arent my most enthusiastic supporters either, although i do know her dad doesnt want us to split and to work things out but he he a pretty week minded person (alwasy has nbeen as much as i love him) so he wont stand up to her and tell her anything she just steam rollers all over him. He hates problems\confrontation etc and just wants peace and will support his daught which i accept. Everyone i have spoke to about what has gone on and what i am doing supports the things i am doing the biggest problems is those that are mutual friends tend to stick on the fence and refuse to be drawn into the equation

In that case, she is just using them all to create a distraction.

If she told YOU to stop doing x, y, z - then you would! (With some obvious exceptions). That wouldn't be so good for her. That would mean you had listened to her and respected her requests. It would also mean losing out on some valuable attention.

If however she tells OTHERS. Then you feel pressured to listen to others. She sidesteps any opportunity of giving you a chance to listen to her. And if you withdraw your affection she can call you a loser and cheat on you.

But sprinkle your needs meeting instead of slathering it on. Change your tactics frequently, never let her guess what's coming. Don't get stuck in a rut of digital messages. One day it could be a nicely prepared breakfast, served to her in the 'spare room'.

Another day it could be a specially packed champagne picnic (if we get another nice summers day!) - and if she refuses, go without her and send her a pic of the food or the nice location so she can see what she's missing out on.

Keep her on her toes.

Another day it could be flowers. Make it hard for her to pinpoint a complaint about all these things because no two gestures are the same. So instead of being able to tell people you send too many digital messages, make it indescribable.

The next time she tries to vent it should sound like: "I want him to stop being ...attentive!" "I want him to stop...being a nice guy!"

Plan A is never popular with a WS so if you can get her to say the above, you're doing well!

And I do NOT like the male friend passing messages along like that. He shouldn't be engaging her like that or getting in between the two of you. Are you able to ask him to stop, and just send her home in future?

Also don't like that she just drops by, and stays if the wife isn't home. To moan about you, no less. Poor boundaries galore.

Did you ever install VARs or GPS?

ok i am starting to see what she is trying to do then.

- duly noted variety is the spice of life.

This was the first time it has happened, actually the first time she has just gone off from the house.

- yes they are installed and nothing shown up on them re OM

Ok.

How did exposure go this weekend?

take it you meanto son, he got upset cried etc but was ok and he knows we both love him and that I love mum and am fighting for everything and to save our family

Ok. It will be interesting to hear about his reactions going forward. Usually kids all behave the same way following exposure.

Keep us informed of that too, OK?

Good job on being honest with your son. Yes it hurts but he will respect you more for being honest.

Ok Will do, today has been strange wife went to fete this afternoon with friends from yesterday came back and been really nice and semi talkative after yesterday, cooked dinner for us and even gave me bits off her plate she didn't like, even spending time alone with me watching tv, something just seems/feels different more relaxed and I am just enjoying this moment for what it is

Oh she started taking my pants etc up stairs n leaving on our bed again, the surprise was she left her lace thong inside my folded boxers bizarre but a nice surprise like I saying enjoying the moment for what it is right now

Just read through your story; seems things are starting to turn around just a bit now.

Just be careful. It's going to be a rollercoaster of a ride now; I anticipate that your wife is slowly coming out of the withdrawal stage, giving you a window to show her how you've changed. But it will be difficult. There will be times like today that lifts your spirit, then other days when she goes back to withdrawal or is confused or fights what will happen. It will be even more important for you to watch your angry outbursts and disrespectful judgements.

One mine that is sure to come is when she realizes you exposed the situation to your son. You have to explain to her that you did it because he deserves to know the truth and that you want the marriage to be open and honest.

Also, I hope you gave your son an unbiased explanation of what happened, including how you were wrong also. That way, if your wife says you are making her look bad and trying to sway your son in your favor, you can tell her that you told him the whole truth, including your own mistakes. I know it's hard to admit your weaknesses and failures to your son, but he will respect you more for being honest about it.

I'm also afraid that your 'swinging' lifestyle during his early childhood did not go unnoticed, and this is a chance to teach him what you did was wrong so that he does not end up making the same mistakes you did.

Just be aware that by filling up your lovebank, she may simply be buttering you up before her next pouting session.

Waywards use carrot and stick too, but to cake eat instead of to recover.

A wary man is prepared for the rollercoaster.