I would try to get more UA time out of the house doing fun, recreational type stuff. Go on more romantic dates! With the ages of your kids, baby sitting shouldn't be an issue anymore, so take advantage of it. Going shopping, running errands, and taking care of to-do lists is okay, but it doesn't sound very romantic. Are you meeting the 4 intimate EN's while you are doing these activities?

I know this is one of the biggest issues in my M. We just don't get enough quality UA time. The 4 intimate EN's are not being adequately met. For us, baby sitting is the biggest issue. My H and I only get 4-5 hours of UA time out of the house each week and it just isn't enough.

These rec activities are POJA'd. It's win/win. SF isn't desired yet, just willing. Compared to my aversion for many years, my enthusiasm for SF has improved greatly.

I'm enthusiastic about working around the house with him. I love that. Yes, enthusiastic about going to Lowes. Love that place too. Not as enthusiastic about going out to dinner anymore. I eat grain-free, sugar-free....takes most of the fun out of eating. Pretty limited on eateries. But, I gotta eat. I do enjoy his company and conversation.

Have these helped?
How to Overcome Sexual Aversion
How to Meet the Emotional Need for Sexual Fulfillment (Part 1)

Have you ever emailed the Harleys?

Yes, I emailed them and talked to Joyce. We didn't talk about the aversion. We talked about UA time, and DH's long commute.

I did the aversion exercises for weeks and they did help the situation. The second link tells the low-drive spouse to just increase frequency to increase desire. BTDT. Did fake it tell ya make for years. I think it drove me into the aversion. Forcing myself to make love when I didn't want to. I was repulsed and would cry during and after on most occasions.

I'm willing, but honestly I've only been horny maybe 10 times my whole life.

Yes, we hold hands and kiss and hug while we're out, we talk, sometimes that night when we get home we make love.

I might be accused of navel grazing but I think it matters.

I asked myself....What kind of stuff did we do together when we started dating? We knew each for 9 months before we married. The first three months, we lived 300 miles apart and saw each other every two weeks. We usually went out to eat, dancing at the Hall, or played cards with friends. The next three months, he lived with my mom and me. We did the same stuff then too. He wanted to move back to his hometown. I told him, I wasn't following him all over the state of Texas. I didn't want him to move away. He said, "Well, let's get married?" I said, OK. He moved back to his hometown, 300 miles away. We hardly saw each other during that time.

We got married. It was fun. We usually went out to eat, saw movies, did home projects, played cards with friends, go fishing. We went on a couple of vacations. We pretty much did the same things then, that we do now. We've never been the romantic type. Foo-Foo stuff doesn't appeal to either of us.

I asked myself...What did I love about him? Truly, he was very kind and nice to me. He was HOT! 100 lbs lighter. He doesn't resemble the man I loved.

I have prayed for years to be "in love" with him. To desire him. Crave him. We both want that kind of marriage. I can't fall in love with him, if he can't meet my needs. He can't meet my needs if I don't know what they are.

Well, based on this, I would venture to say one of them might be physical attractiveness. And if your H has gained 100 lbs. since you got married, he might better be able to meet that need if he lost some weight.

Perhaps the two of you could exercise together. My H and I love going for long walks. Tonight, we walked to a shopping center about a mile and a half away from where we live, ate a healthy dinner, then walked back home. I know many couples also enjoy working out at the gym together (we don't since we can't afford a gym membership).

Also, have you taken the Recreational Companionship questionnaire? That helped my H and I come up with some new and creative ideas for our dates.

I don't think we did the RCQ. We should.

I KNOW the weight has affected our sex life. He hasn't tried to lose it. I've asked him to walk with me, he declines. He won't change his diet. He knows the weight is an issue, I included it on the ENQ.

Tell us what you think.

Radio Clip

Thanks for the clip, Brain. I have done what the Harley's suggest. DH gets regular checkups, so he isn't inclined to lose weight for his health. All of his numbers are fine.

I haven't come right out and asked him to lose weight. I've mentioned that I would prefer that he was closer to the size he was when we married (200 lbs).

I cook healthy meals. I don't buy junk food. He eats out a lot though. He will buy junk food and bring it home.

Could his LB's and weight gain be why the "in love" feeling haven't returned? Our UA is fun and pleasant. He's just not very fun or pleasant the rest of the time.

Can you clarify what you mean by this? How is he the rest of the time?

During dedicated UA time, we are on "good behavior". We've only had one fight while on UA time. In "real life" he is dry, critical, sarcastic, and loud.....not too pleasant. He has admitted to being this way. I'm not just giving my opinion.

The other night when I told him that "being kind" showed me he loved me, he said it's a challenge for him. I ask him why? He said, he's bitter. He didn't say why.

Is he open to MB?

Can you two start working out together?

Says he's bitter? Do you think he's depressed?

Tenancious,

You don't have a SF aversion. You don't have romantic feelings for your hubby.

He's not meeting your needs and he's LB'ing you most of the time.

He's no longer physically attractive to you. He refuses to do much about it.

He's bitter except when you have dedicated time to "be kind". That does nothing to make you feel attracted to him. He can be a saint for allotted UA time but if he goes back to being bitter, angry, sarcastic afterwards he undoes any good he did during your dedicated time.

I'm not sure you asking him to meet your needs is working. He seems fixed in his ways which means he doesn't see what's in it for him to change. Sounds like a good time to get him involved in this program with a coach who can explain just what it is that is in it for him.

ooooooooooo

Did you ask him why he is "bitter"?
I think it is very important to press him on this issue.
That is not some throw-away comment. That was the tip of some "radical honesty" ice berg .... Tell H you appreciate his honesty about his bitterness. Tell him you need to know what has caused this bitterness.
Ask this question in the middle of a long walk. That way, he cannot physically go to another room to escape.

Find out!

PS ..... Once he explains his bitterness, be sure to say "Thank you for being honest" .... especially if what he tells you is unflattering about you.

Thanks...Brain, MrA and Pep for responding.

He is familiar with MB principles. We did the LBQ and EQN over a year ago. I think I'm out of withdrawal.

Pep, I asked him why he is bitter. He said, he didn't know. But, my heart tells me it's because I haven't met his needs of affection and SF properly; for years, sadly. We don't live in a sexless marriage. But, it's not passionate at all. No one likes mercy sex.

Not long ago, he had a conversation about how we would conduct our single lives, if one of us died. I said, I would stay single, I wouldn't date until the kids were grown. That I would focus my energy on raising them. He said, he would date and wouldn't be celibate. He said, "I won't bring "them" back to the house, but I'm gonna be getting "some". This weekend, our daughter asked why our male cat is getting skinny. I said, He's out tom cattin'. DH says, "Oh man, that must be "the life". I looked at him, and said, "Really, you want to be whoring around?" It hurt. But, it tells me clearly he isn't satisfied.

I MUST fall in love with my husband. But, I don't know what to do.

He worked real hard at avoiding LB's and being kind for a couple of months. Things were better. SF wasn't so bland. I felt warmer toward him. When things got stressful and recovery didn't happen, he gave up.

We need perspective. If we did MB perfectly, how long before the love comes back?

How firm should I be about the weight? About the LB's?

About a month ago, we had a conversation about complaining. He had Lb'd me. Then got mad because I asked him not to do that particular thing anymore. I asked him, "How do you feel when I complain?" He said, "Not sure." I told him, to please tell me when I LB him.

Pep, I will ask about the bitterness.

This is a pretty good example of what not to do when your spouse is RH and says something you don't appreciate. Punishment (sarcasm) for RH will result in less RH.

What kind of wife do you want to be?

What would have been a better response?

Should I be that radically honest about his weight and LB's?

I want to be fun, kind, loving and dependable wife.

I had to learn this myself, so --- please do not feel I am picking on you.
When is sarcasm ever useful for a marriage?
Never. I had a bad habit of sarcasm. Every time I did this, it was a sharp cut to my H.
The purpose of POJA is to negotiate win/win solutions.

I really believe this is something so key to the development of your R. You aren't honest with him about why you don't find him attractive. That if he lost XX pounds and lost his negative behavior you'd be so much more attracted to him he'd have something that would make that cat jealous.


You had a chance to employ Radical Honesty.

I wouldn't fire off a reply right away in that moment. I'd wait until you could set the stage for a serious talk. Tell him you'd like to talk and ask him when would be a good time to have this talk. Follow the rules of good conversation and good negotiation.

�I was hurt when I heard your comment about the cat. But I want you to know I hear you and I get it. It is your way of trying to tell me something. You�re missing something in your life. You probably feel like you�ve never had it. I really wish I could make you happy. I�d love to make you happy. I would love it if you felt you could be open and honest with me in regards to how I�m doing to make you happy.

I�m missing something too and I think we�re stuck in a catch 22. But there is a way around it and it starts with us being radically honest with each other while remaining respectful and cooperative. I�m going to try to do better but I need you to be honest about what you need. �

Tenacious. I don�t know your H but if he�s like most guys if we heard of a way we�d be able to get our #1 EN met in a way we never thought we�d see we�d move mountains to make it happen. But ya know, we know (or think we know) it�s never gonna happen. Because time has proven again and again it won�t. So our poor behavior continues (BTDT).

Someone has to break the cycle. Shake it up. Establish the new bar that is your M. I say it is time to set some goals for your M:
1). Meet your H�s needs. You know his needs but what about the logistics of those ENs? Ask him to be specific about the number of times he needs to you????

Let him know you�re stepping up and then do it. Make it happen.
2). Start being more radically honest about what his actions and lack of action does to your desire to continue doing #1. Help him eliminate his LBs and help him understand your ENs. Be sure he understands these things directly correlate to your ability to continue doing #1. Reward good behavior, communicate respectfully his bad behavior.


There is a better way to help him eliminate his LBs. Instead of telling him what not to do tell him what you would like. And NO demands.

�I don�t like it when you are bitter. Stop it�. Negative and Demanding.
How about:
�I really love it when you make pleasant comments. It reassures me you are a good man, it makes it fun to be around you and it makes me feel attracted to you.� Positive and points him down the path of what you need to be attracted to him.

If you say these kinds of things after you�ve been meeting his ENs he�ll get it. He�ll see the connection and he�ll step up.