This descrives her very well. Her and her mother were controlled by her dad their whole life. When she was kicked out at 18, she was left to fiend for herself. She was very independent when we reconnected, having her own house, going to school, had a job, supported herself and felt she didnt need anybody.

Thanks for the advice. I can and have changed my actions in the past, but I have difficulty maintaining the changes. As she begins to give me what I want, I start taking again, until we are back at square one, or deeper. Hopefully if I can get her to have some faith in me again, I will talk her into this program with me, and toghether we will likely be more successful.

Again, as they say in MB ---work on your own side of the fence. This seems to be where you are tripping up. Dr Harley is opposed to us straightening out our spouses. ie "...I will get her to..." and "...I will talk her into..."

Change these statements to a question to ask yourself. ie "What can I do to show my wife how much I love her?" or "How can I help my wife around the house..." and then follow with actions.

The art of caring for your wife is caring for your wife. Not necessary to pontificate.

Had a good day yesterday. When I got home she started talking to me, and we had a good couple hours of conversation. Let a few things go that I would have normally made a sarcastic comment about. Stayed focused on our conversation instead of the TV, phone, internet, etc.

One day at a time...

One incident at a time. No tolerance rule.

My wife just sent me a message telling me that she plans to move out after we receive our income tax refund, so we can pay down some debt by then and it will be easier to make the jump.

She said she enjoys talking to me but isn't sure she wants out marriage anymore. She feels like our relationship has been over for a while, but that we have been able to talk as friends.

I responded to her that I understand her frustration and lack of faith in us getting things worked out, but hopefully my actions can cause her to fall in love with me again. I admitted that I have not met her emotional needs, I made many expectations and demands that were centered on my needs.

It is frustrating since am all about instant gratification. I want to be rewarded for behavior immediately after a good deed. I need to remember this is a marathon, not a sprint.

Being an optimist, I have until the middle of February to meet her ENs. NO MORE LOVEBUSTERS!!!

1995, I'm really concerned for you and your family. You have several options ahead of you.

You can choose short-term Rental behaviors. You can choose to see this like a reprieve, and go back to taking her for granted until a week or two before your refund check is due. You can even stall the taxes. You can push on her to make changes of her own, and tell yourself you deserve this. These behaviors come naturally to you and are ingrained.

You can choose long-term Buyer behaviors. Like getting outside accountability.

I don't know buddy. This stuff works if you work it. What would make you enthusiastic about making long term changes? What's in it for you? What will make your taker happy? Because if your Taker isn't happy all you're going to do is backslide. Many folks chose Buyer behaviors as soon as they learned them, because more than anything they wanted an intact family. But that doesn't sound like it was doing it for you. Even having a wife who did everything you wanted wasn't enough to inspire you to make changes to ensure long-term happiness. What's different this time?

Best wishes, I'm rooting for you!

Do you have a copy of Love Busters and HNHN? Your wife does not love you anymore. Your relational negligence is like death by 1000 cuts and has to stop. At this point she is likely hypersensitive to even the most minor LB-ing and as Dr Harley says her "taker" is only wanting to protect herself or is in self preservation mode. At least for now you have to sell sell sell HER taker. Long term you must POJA emotional needs without either LB-ing or allowing sacrifice.

I don't think I truly realized how harmful some of my behaviors were to the relationship. She helped point out some things that I didn't notice as well. I think I had some pretty unrelistic expectations, especially considering my behaviors.

I need to do this one day at a time, focusing on what needs to be done. It feels like an addiction, like I am addicted to lovebusters, even though I don't want them.

Well, things seem to have become slightly better after a week off from work. She is no longer talking about leaving, we have spent a lot of time toghether and with the kids doing fun stuff. She has been affectionate toward me again, but that is normal except when we are fighting. Unfortunately, this becomes a problem for me, since I enjoy kissing, cuddling, massaging, etc., but prefer when they lead to sex.

Currently her attitude is that when I get sex, I behave like an [censored], so we cannot have sex. I feel like we are making forward progress, but I feel like my taker gets in the way.

That is her attitude. Are you saying that you agree that is what happens?

What's your plan to replace the old LBs with a new routine after being intimate? Maybe something like snuggling together after?

This is her opinion based on past experiences. Her claim is that I try to be nice until I get what I want, then I resort back to my old behaviors.

There have been points in the past where this is the case. More recently, it seems like she has a preconcieved notion that this is the case, and blames anything I may do wrong for the next day or so on sex.

Short answer, yes she is correct. Doesn't make it any easier though.

Our problem has never been affection or intmiacy. Even now, we cuddle, kiss, massage and all that every day. We shower together on days I don't go to work.

She believes that I am guilty of LBs because I have sex, therefore if we don't do that I will be nice. While this is not the case, I understand why she feels this way. I have tried to stop this cycle, but lately she seems to be extra critical.

Read up on what Dr. Harley says about complaints. (If someone has that article handy that'd be helpful. thx)

Right now it's quite possible your are LBing her so bad and her being extra critical may just be her in conflict mode now willing to complain more to get more stuff she wants changed out in the open.

Listen to her complaints. Repeat them back so she knows you heard her. Don't try to convince her otherwise. Ask her to help you find alternatives to the behavior.

That process is going to 1). Help you eliminate the LB 2) Help build trust that the M is a safer marriage for her (aka she�ll eliminate the association of sex=Mr Rude Droptopz).

I needed to add this part:

Listen to her complaints. Repeat them back so she knows you heard her. Don't try to convince her otherwise. Ask her to help you find alternatives to the behavior.


THANK HER FOR BEING OPEN AND HONEST.

The goal is to get her to give you feedback / complaints in a respectful way. So do what you have to to keep it respectful. She'll follow your lead. It's hard to be angry with someone when they're listening and validating your complaints in a respectful way.

Thanks for the advice. I have been working at not getting angry, and acknowledging her complaint.

However, many times she brushes off my LBs, or kind of just hints to stop, and I ignore it. I need to be more aware of those signs as well. I like the repeat, then thanking her for honesty. Maybe it will help me remember to be aware of my actions.

Being more aware is good ... not just of the signs she provides but also of the things you can logically infer are LBs.

Remember there is a no tolerance rule on LBs. Even if they don't "feel" like there is impact ... there is. Be certain of that. It's where I made some of my mistakes.

It's typical for people to become accustom to the LBs and simply "sorta" tolerate them. But those LBs committed against us program us to react a certain way ... but they still remove love units even if we give the appearance of brushing them off.

Hence the need for the PORH.

drop, i want to commend you on coming here and being RH about your problems and your own actions that have contributed. i also want to reassure you that once you have built up a +LB$, your wife will want to have sex w/you again, because she will be in love with you.

you mentioned it once, and i'll repeat it, because it takes constant active work: marathon, not sprint. your short-term goal is to reignite love in your marriage. this will help you reach a long-term goal, which is SF.

HOWEVER, you have noted that you have trouble maintaining these changes once you reach a minimum threshold of satisfaction on YOUR side, which is your major problem. you should consider the MB online coaching, so that you have a third party to hold you accountable while these changes become habits. this will help you keep those LBs down, and keep your EN meeting up. remember, MB is about win-win to establish and maintain a MUTUALLY beneficial, happy, romantic M. in other words, you want to turn your negative spiral into a positive spiral and KEEP IT GOING.

it's easy to fall off once you've established a romantic relationship, because we are all human and make mistakes. however, if you want your M to last, you've got to learn to maintain your momentum. since you will also benefit from this, you should want to do so once you have reached your +LB$ again, rather than letting it deplete. PORH and UA time will help you with this.

Thanks for the suggestions and support, it is truly appreciated. Unfortunately coaching is not an option for us financially at this time.

The last few days have been very good. I have been more consicious of my LBs, and offered more in the way of her ENs. It is amazing how quickly her attitude changes when I simply pay attention to these. She is still skeptical that these changes are long-term, and for good reason, but there is definetly a difference.