x2 there is a risk even years later. Have you been able to verify there has been no contact? Have the NC gaps been plugged?

Well, there HAS been contact, but only initiated by the Dolly.
Two emails in September (under the guise of work-related) to which Taffy did not respond.
Two phone calls - one on Oct 30, where no message was left. (Taffy figured it could not have been the Dolly as he thought she didn't have his new number.)
And the one Jan. 4, where she did get through, "happy new year". This is the only one where actual contact occurred.
I have verified that Taffy hasn't initiated contact.

We have moved out of the country, and the other side of the continent.

Taffy has put new and more stringent plans on his NC plan.

How did you find out that there has been contact? Did Taffy finally admit it or did you have to figure it out on your own? If this was one of your EPs, "Closed secret email account. Deleted all contact info and blocked all OW from corporate email account," how did Dolly's emails get through to him? Why has he been telling you that Dolly hasn't tried to contact him since her "eff off" email? Why has he been pretending that the Happy New Year phone call is the first time he became aware of gaps in the NC plan?

How did you verify that Taffy hasn't initiated contact? He could have easily contacted her via a prepaid cell phone or a secret email account accessed on a public computer. (I wouldn't take his word for anything related to her.)

Jessica;

Thanks for your concern. As they happened, Taffy told me about all the instances of contact since NC.

Dolly's two emails that got through came on Taffy's business email account, before he put the blocks in. In fact, they were the impetus for him putting the block in place (He naively believed she would never try to contact him again.) He did not answer them. Since then, she either hasn't tried to email, or she has tried and the block worked.

Taffy got new cell phone when he moved to US, which arrived after NC. They had carried on the underground part of their A largely by text, to his old cell. He felt certain the Dolly would not be able to call him on the new phone.

On Oct 30, he received a call from the generic office number where the Dolly works. He didn't answer it, and there was no message left. He said it could have come from a number of people with whom he worked and still had ongoing project connections. He told me about it right away, didn't delete the voicemail. When I listened, I thought I heard a woman sigh, before the hang up.

Anyway, nothing further until the New Years' call. We were in a restaurant (in the buffet line...gotta love America!) Taffy could see the call was from a Toronto number, but didn't have his reading glasses so couldn't make out the entire number. He said hello, the Dolly said she wished him and me a happy new year. He said thanks, then hung up. So, this was the only time when there was an actual interaction. Taffy is blocking the generic office number from his new cel phone now.

So now it is 100% clear that she has his new cel number and that she will/would continue to try to contact him. Hence my exposure to her boss and HR.

UPDATE: received a prompt email from the HR Mgr. She said they will investigate and report back. I also sent her my cel number, which I didn't put in the initial email to her, as I didn't know if it would get in to the Dolly's hands.

Taffy has been good about plugging gaps in the NC plan as they occur, and excellent at reporting attempts at contact. He has been poor at predicting her subsequent actions, though! And I can still find nothing to suggest he has initiated contact.

Jessica:
You are right, he COULD contact the Dolly if he was so inclined. It is more of a chore in our sitch, since:
A) I control all the funds. He could not have a cell phone I don't know about, unless she or someone else paid for it.
B) Taffy works from home now, so is with me all the time, and I can usually overhear his calls.
C) When not at home, we are travelling together.
D) We live in a remote area. He couldn't just nip over to a neighbour's to use their computer. There are no public phones within 10 miles.

Of course, I do understand that he could contact her if he really wanted. And, I am verifying regularly (and irregularly.)

Exposure to Taffy's current boss, son, family and friends means none of them would support him as an accomplice in any way.

I think my main concern is that Taffy is supposed to be your ally against her, but he is making you fights parts of this battle all by yourself. He should be doing whatever it takes to protect you, not expressing concern/sympathy for your attacker.

Jessica

Now there, you are EXACTLY right. And I don't understand it.

Taffy asked me to call the HR woman and "clarify" that the contact attempts were not harassing, just "friendly". He says he is not trying to protect her, just would feel guilty if she lost her job because of him. And she is wacky enough to possibly harm herself.

I got on his case, as I said she would be feeling the consequences of her own actions. SHE initiated the affair, not him. SHE continued contact without encouragement from him, after both he and I had requested her not to.

I told him I am sorry if he is upset. But that if he really wanted to protect her, he should have done more to ENSURE she could not contact him or me ever again. Instead he assumed she wouldn't try. He assumed she didn't have his new number. He assumed it wasn't her that called on Oct 30.

So not only did he end up not "protecting" her, he certainly wasn't doing enough to protect me and our marriage.

(SIGH)

He needs to understand that his behavior is analogous to defending your rapist, if you were raped. If you were raped would he be as worried about the rapist facing the consequences of his rape? Or would he be concerned about you, the rape victim?

ML;

Says he just doesn't want to hurt anyone...

SH will help him see where his focus should be. I am trying to refrain from "educating" him, which is my tendency, and an LB to Taffy.

And he just sent me a big apology.

catwhit, you can tell him *I* said this!! Just sit there and read my post. I will be the bad guy!

Thanks, ML. Maybe you could send a meaner-looking icon?


Just got a call from HR director at the Dolly's company. She interviewed me, and they are investigating. Next, she needs to interview Taffy. Should be interesting.

Catwhit,

When my H finally "got it" and we really started recovery, he had stopped making the kind of comments Taffy is making. Your H is hurting YOU with his defense of OW. Still foggy.

Good job about the investigation, especially if they can show a misuse of company assets/equipment.

AM

Oh man. Is he going to defend that skank???

ArmyMama;

Thanks... Was there anything in particular that helped your H "get it"? Do you recall a tipping point?
Taffy is still foggy around the edges.

ML;
I will be very I interested to hear how his interview goes. I will be discussing with him beforehand.

I also have to provide HR with documented evidence that the Dolly continued contact after NC request. She said the allegation that the Dolly used company resources to make the calls/emails is of the most interest to them. And the fact that Taffy is a client. Otherwise, they don't pursue "personal issues" like affairs, which "happen all the time." I didn't try to educate her. Didn't think it would help to come off as a shrewish wife at present.

Catwhit,

My H began to "get it" after he contacted OW when I said that IF he wanted to remain married to me that we would attend an MB weekend (next to last one in jan 2010) and work the program 100%. Things really started to click for him at the weekend and after the first phone call by the coach. There were a couple of issues since then, but none involving OW. He started taking responsibility for his own actions. He is now profoundly remorseful and embarassed about his actions during and after the affair.

AM

Thanks, ArmyMama. Good info.
Taffy IS embarrassed, I think. And quite remorseful. Not "profoundly" yet, unless he is really burying it...
We do plan on doing the online program, which Steve suggests we get through the "healing" phase a bit more, and then it will be more effective.

Maybe I should stop comparing his actions to some of the really expressively remorseful WS's on this site. Could be a DJ?

No, I think that is a good idea because it keeps you connected to what a good recovery looks like. That is the bar you should set for Taffy. Let the other WS's set the bar for a great recovery and hold Taffy to it. Hold him accountable.

You live with a guy whose mind is in an altered state of reality. He will be that way for a while until the fog wears off. In the meantime, you need to look at others to stay grounded. Remember how foggy you were when you arrived?

Who, me??? Foggy?? Of course that was just because my situation was so DIFFERENT!! Unique, even!!

So today is the Dolly's birthday. (Interesting that Taffy can remember HER birthday...)
Perfect day for her to find out I dropped the pin on her to employer, don'tcha think? Happy birthday, Dolly...have another piece of cake?