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Originally Posted by 1995droptopz
I had a similar situation when my wife moved into the house I had shared with my xWW. She did not want to live in another woman's house, but for financial reasons, we could not sell it. Her house was simply to small for any more than 2 people, and both of our houses were upside-down. She told me if I repainted and let her decorate it would be acceptable. I didn't want to repaint, but I her happiness was worth it.

We ended up figuring out a way to move since I really didnt like the house my xWW picked out either, and found something we both love.

Financially you are in a great position if the house is paid off. You may lose money compared to what you paid, but all of the other houses in the area took a similar hit. So you may still be able to pay cash for an equivalent different house, or maybe spend a little more and get a bigger one. Maybe sho him some comparible listings as well as some ideas of what you may like. Some people (me included) need to see the numbers on paper to make a decision.


As far as the photos go, I think this is something that should be POJAed. I think it is important to let the children remember their mother, so maybe the children can be allowed to have photos of mom in their rooms, and maybe a nice framed picture of the kids with mom somewhere in the house as a tribute. My wife allows my daughter to have a photo of mom in her room, even though my daughter never took us up on the offer.

As for this advice, Dr Harley states that step parents should have no parental authority over step children. So the step mom shouldn't be "allowing" the step daughter to do anything. Dr Harley recommends they just try to be friends

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Even if the step children's mother had died?

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Sorry-I didn't see this post til after your last one. I am going to work on an email this evening to the radio show based on yours and MelodyLane's advice.

In my husband's defense I haven't had him read about MB yet. I have only mentioned it to him.

We had a ROUGH evening last night.

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Originally Posted by sasha1
We had a ROUGH evening last night.
Please tell us about it.

sasha, how did you come to marry this man? From the description of how he is behaving about his late wife towards you, he is not being loving towards you. He is not in the honeymoon phase that most of us go through in early marriage, where, as Dr Harley describes, our givers are in overdrive and we find it easy to give our spouse everything they want.

Now in fact, it is not a good thing for our givers to direct our actions. It feels good doing so until we start to feel that we are missing out on getting our own needs met...but that's not my point. My point is that most of us do this naturally when we are madly in love, but your H is doing the opposite with you.

Did you feel that he was madly in love with you when he asked you to marry him? Do you feel that now? I think that it is quite alarming that he gets impatient and dismissive of you when you ask him to help you with this issue. He is showing signs that his late wife is his great love still, and that he feels you need to accept that, which is no way to treat a wife.

So I'm wondering how he was different when you were dating, to the point where you were happy to marry him. I 'm not asking why you didn't sort this out before you got married; hindsight is a great thing butt no use to us now. I'm wondering whether he really loved you when he asked you to marry him, and whether he does now.


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My stepmom (who is a widow) married a guy, C, who is a widower. He ended up selling his house (where his kids had grown up) and bought a new house that was neither of theirs. They have some pictures of the families/spouses up but as a general part of other family pictures. They also feel like they can talk about the other spouses. Me and my brothers are cool with him beause he is a nice guy and we are happy that she has been able to move on with her life after a lengthy mourning period. His daughters are having more of an issue because his life is not centered around tehm anymore.

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The thing is, the original post was not about the children needing to celebrate and remember their mother's life, or about how they relate to their new step mother. It wasn't about the children at all.

It was about sasha's H's treatment of her and his dismissal of her unhappiness in relation to his late wife's presence in her marriage. It was about her relationship with her husband, and his apparent lack of extraordinary care and concern for her, which normally characterises a new marriage.

I don't understand why the children's needs with regard to their mother keep being brought into the responses here.

Also, wannabopim, that was your stepmother, who was not your mother. I fail to see the relevance.


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I'm with Sugar cane on this. Several things do not make sense to me at all.. First of all, they have only been married 6 months, and her dissatisfaction is enormous..... Alarming.

Sasha, did you discuss what you would do with the house before you got married???? To me, I can't understand why she moved in there in the first place. If it really bothered her then when they were engaged, did she say so? If so, what did they decide. If he was dismissive then, why did she marry him? I wouldn't have gotten married until he had bought a new house..

I also wondered about their courtship... Were they madly in love? Did he pursue her? Or did they have a comfortable relationship and he was looking for someone to help him out with domestic chores and parenting because he felt overwhelmed and he was never madly in love with her..

Those are the questions i have...especially wondering what conversations took place before the marriage about the living arrangements or did she just assume and they never really talked about it.


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Originally Posted by 1995droptopz
As far as the photos go, I think this is something that should be POJAed. I think it is important to let the children remember their mother, so maybe the children can be allowed to have photos of mom in their rooms, and maybe a nice framed picture of the kids with mom somewhere in the house as a tribute. My wife allows my daughter to have a photo of mom in her room, even though my daughter never took us up on the offer.

This!

I was thinking the same thing. The children should be able to keep mementos and perhaps one in a common area of the home to remind them of their mother.

Gotta use the POJA and get the ideas out there. Sounds like it might be a good idea to write it out so there is no confusion, no going back and saying I didn't know...

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Originally Posted by sasha1
We had a ROUGH evening last night.
The night before last he pulled me aside to ask what is going on with me. I have been pretty withdrawn lately so I understood his questioning.

On Sunday my stepson and I stayed home while husband and stepdaughter went to church. They went b/c they had previous obligations to serve. We had gotten in super late from out of town the night before.

He called me around 12 to let me know church was almost over and he would begin the work he was doing for church(digging holes to post signs) and would call me when done-to come home, get lunch, etc.

It was getting a little later than I had expected to hear from him so I decided to go ahead and shower, etc for the day and be ready to go when he called in case we were meeting out for lunch, etc.

Around 2, I heard the door open and he was home. He walked in holding an Arby's cup. I said, "What happened to the phone call?" He went on to explain it was late, figured you and R had already had lunch. I asked him why in the world would he think that when he told me he would call me? Also why would you think that when I NEVER do anything without letting you know first?

The argument Sunday went from there. "You never think of me first". "You have done this before" I left to get myself something to eat. I was gone for 2 1/2 hours. He said he was sorry.

This incident was a trigger for me that brought up all of the same emotions. He won't do anything for ME. My feelings aren't considered before decisions are made(I do express them. I am never 1st.

We went on to pretty much have the SAME conversations we have had in the past. The house. I found out Sunday he made a 3 year commitment to church to serve on a trustee board without telling me. He said 1 month ago the commitment was for 1 year. I expressed to him then I didn't like that considering I want us to find another church. He was agitated and stated "Fine I guess I will have to tell them I can't serve now" (but he didn't do that)

He told me he thought my reaction about Sunday was extreme. He told me I am fragile. He told me I need to find happiness within myself first. This is to name a few. I cannot remember the others. I had some insecure feelings on Saturday night as well that I voiced and he told me I had mental issues.

I was not good either. He said to me that I made the decision to live there with him when we married. I told him that was my mistake and I wish I didn't. He then told me I am a mean woman. I have told him in the past that yes I did make that decision. Had I have known that I was going to have to clean out her things to make room for mine that my decision would have been different. I wasn't aware of that beforehand.

He went on to say that he has contacted realtors for a cost analysis on the house. I asked him why. Is it to look at selling or just to bring to me to show me how much you will lose on the house if we sell? And why didn't he tell me? He said he didn't want me to have expectations. He said he spoke to the children about other homes as well.

He asked the children their opinions. I suggested it would have been best to tell them we will be making some changes together as a new family starting with looking at a new home. He told me not to tell him the best way to speak to them about it. I then told him that my daughter didn't have a choice so why should his?

He told me he doesn't think I love him. I told him I am desperately trying to save this marriage. He expressed he doesn't believe that.

I'm sure I am leaving something out but this is the summary.




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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
The advice to have a child is dreadful advice
I described a situation similar to Sasha's in which the couple had a child, and I explicitly added that I was not sayng she should have a child; I did this because I didn't want her to interpret it the wrong way. How did you interpret that as I advised her to have a child?

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Originally Posted by SugarCane
I'm wondering whether he really loved you when he asked you to marry him, and whether he does now.
Hi Sasha, after your most recent post, I'm kind of wondering the same as SugarCane.

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Originally Posted by SugarCane
Originally Posted by sasha1

sasha, how did you come to marry this man? From the description of how he is behaving about his late wife towards you, he is not being loving towards you. He is not in the honeymoon phase that most of us go through in early marriage, where, as Dr Harley describes, our givers are in overdrive and we find it easy to give our spouse everything they want.


Did you feel that he was madly in love with you when he asked you to marry him? Do you feel that now? I think that it is quite alarming that he gets impatient and dismissive of you when you ask him to help you with this issue. He is showing signs that his late wife is his great love still, and that he feels you need to accept that, which is no way to treat a wife.

So I'm wondering how he was different when you were dating, to the point where you were happy to marry him. I 'm not asking why you didn't sort this out before you got married; hindsight is a great thing butt no use to us now. I'm wondering whether he really loved you when he asked you to marry him, and whether he does now.

We have had a working relationship for almost 15 years. We began a serious personal relationship almost 1 1/2 ago.

I do not know how to answer if I feel he is madly in love with me. My initial response would be he isn't. I base this on his actions in our relationship, not the words he expresses. He is an emotionally scarred man as well.

I don't believe his late wife is still his great love either. I don't know what it is but I don't necessarily feel he longs for her (other than for his children).

As I have thought about our dating relationship I realize that most of our dates were family dates. Our biggest concern was their interation with each other and us together. We felt we knew each other I guess. A mistake we both realize now.

One reason I married this man, believe it or not, is for the way he treats others!! In our profession I witness his interactions with others and he is the most kind, considerate man. I have expressed this to him as well. Why don't I get that person all the time?

Interestingly I sent him a 3 page list of the reasons I love him yesterday. I did this b/c he expressed he doesn't feel that I love him. Trust me the way I have been the last several days, I get that. He was thankful.



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Originally Posted by tiredwife45
I'm with Sugar cane on this. Several things do not make sense to me at all.. First of all, they have only been married 6 months, and her dissatisfaction is enormous..... Alarming.

Sasha, did you discuss what you would do with the house before you got married???? To me, I can't understand why she moved in there in the first place. If it really bothered her then when they were engaged, did she say so? If so, what did they decide. If he was dismissive then, why did she marry him? I wouldn't have gotten married until he had bought a new house..

I also wondered about their courtship... Were they madly in love? Did he pursue her? Or did they have a comfortable relationship and he was looking for someone to help him out with domestic chores and parenting because he felt overwhelmed and he was never madly in love with her..

Those are the questions i have...especially wondering what conversations took place before the marriage about the living arrangements or did she just assume and they never really talked about it.
We had so many discussions about the house beforehand I cannot even count them. I loved him then and I love him now. I moved in b/c in my mind if I wanted to be with this man I didn't think I had a choice on where we lived. (sounds so pathetic, I know).

The final discussion we had I asked him if after we married and I felt I couldn't make it work in the house would he be open to looking at other homes? He said he would. Now, keep in mind, I didn't know at this time that her clothes, jewelry and bathroom were still filled with her things. I wasn't aware the wedding album was out. I wasn't aware the couple pics were in drawers throughout the house. I wasn't aware the love notes, cards from him and to him were in her closet. I probably should have been but I have never been comfortable enough in that house to explore in that way.

We already had a comfortable relationship. I pray that the things you have listed aren't the reason for our marriage. I believe my husband loves me but I am not getting what I need from him after expressing it over and over again.





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Originally Posted by KeepLearning
Originally Posted by MelodyLane
The advice to have a child is dreadful advice
I described a situation similar to Sasha's in which the couple had a child, and I explicitly added that I was not sayng she should have a child; I did this because I didn't want her to interpret it the wrong way. How did you interpret that as I advised her to have a child?

Of course you presented it as a solution. Why else would you have posted it? Even so, it had nothing to do with Marriage Builders so I don't know why it was posted.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Sasha, he may be in love with you. I don't doubt that. But the issue is that he does not care about your feelings. That is the main issue. And this can't be the only area where you have seen that. Have you seen this reaction in other areas?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Our working relationship has always been respectful. He continues to value my opinions at work. We have similar decision making styles as well. He will listen to suggestions and may follow mine or someone elses or he may not.

On personal matters I believe he feels his way is the only way and he has never had to answer to anyone about his decisions. He wants things to be the way he wants them to be. He will listen but if it isn't something he has considered or feels is important it is discarded.

He does not like to be questioned. His reaction tends to be worse on personal levels vs. professional levels. He can also view simple things as being questioned or feeling he is being pushed into a corner.

I do not know how his relationship on these matters was with his late wife. Also I didn't think to mention I am his 3rd wife. His first wife had an affair and they divorced.


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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Of course you presented it as a solution. Why else would you have posted it? Even so, it had nothing to do with Marriage Builders so I don't know why it was posted.
Thanks, your feedback will help me avoid misinterpretation in the future.

My intention was not to present a solution; it was to offer a real-life example for Sasha to use or not as she sees fit to help her with her problem. One of Dr. Harley's Guidelines for Successful Negotiation is "Brainstorm with abandon." He says that when brainstorming a problem, quantity is often more important than quality, and I think this principle can be applied to problem solving in general.

Sasha has a problem. I'm not advising her, but giving her food for thought to hopefully help her arrive at a solution. Why did I post? Because I want to help her. In the future, I'll try to be more explicit when I'm not trying to offer a solution. Thanks.

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Sounds to me like their relationship started as a working relationship and not a romantic one.. Most of their dates were with the children!!!! Sasha, did you even get 15 hours of UA time while you were dating???

I mean if she is an employee then he does get to call the shots there. Who knows, he may have done IB's with both of his previous wives. I wonder if he has ever been a PAtner with anyone... Not sure since I'm not there.

I would suggest going through the MB online program together. These principals sound like they are completely foreign. He doesn't even understand the basic principals.. Rather than focusing on the house, I think I would get him to agree to going through Marriage Builders... Tell him that neither of you are feeing love and this program will help you to fall in love again ( or for the first time, really).

It sounds to me like this man is used to calling the shots everywhere and he isn't used to being an equal partner with anyone. I doubt he knows how. The counselor will need to teach him.

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I think it's real important when posting to those in need to make certain the solutions - or examples - fall within Marriage Builders parameters. A couple can brainstorm, but if they are fielding ideas that would be detrimental to the marriage, then brainstorming is destructive, rather than therapeutic.

Sasha, did you send Dr Harley an email? He will probably answer your email on the air - or you can call in - and then your husband can listen to Dr Harley's view on the radio clip.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by tiredwife45
Sounds to me like their relationship started as a working relationship and not a romantic one.. Most of their dates were with the children!!!! Sasha, did you even get 15 hours of UA time while you were dating???

I mean if she is an employee then he does get to call the shots there.
He doesn't even understand the basic principals.. Rather than focusing on the house, I think I would get him to agree to going through Marriage Builders... Tell him that neither of you are feeing love and this program will help you to fall in love again ( or for the first time, really).

It sounds to me like this man is used to calling the shots everywhere and he isn't used to being an equal partner with anyone. I doubt he knows how. The counselor will need to teach him.

No we did not have 15 hours of UA when dating....

I need to clarify....he is the primary owner of the business. I am a partner in the business as well. We have 3 other partners.

I agree with everything else you have said. Thanks

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