Hello all:

After months of searching the internet for advice regarding divorce and reconciliation and often ending up here, I figured I'd join in.

My wife of 13 years moved out last June. We went through the motions of a "trial separation" at the suggestion of our preacher, but she made the final decision to divorce me in September. By November, the divorce was final. I was left holding the bag of an $1,100 mortgage on a house that's worth 2/3 of what I owe on it, and also primay custody of our son, who will be 8 in two days. All of this was her choice, not mine.

There were no physical affairs in our marriage, though she admitted to a one-way emotional affair with her boss the night she decided to move out. Drugs/alcohol abuse were not an issue. Physical abuse was not an issue. My wife's main complaint was that I was "too negative and pessimistic" which I eventually realized meant that I had a critical spirit toward her. I also wrestled with an internet pornography problem over the last few years of our marriage. This was exacerbated by the fact that sex was off-limits for the last 1.5 years of our marriage and had been rare ever since our son was born. (I am currently in a support/accountability group for the porn problem and am making good progress.)

My complaint about my ex-wife is that she became cold, distant and uncommitted after our son was born in 2005. She got to where she refused to spend time with me, would not talk to me about anything besides bills or our son, would not have sex with me, etc. She also spent little quality time with our son, leaving me to do most of the bathing, feeding, bed time stories, prayers, etc. Our relationship turned into a vicious cycle where her emotional distance led to my criticism and anger, which pushed her away, of course.

We went through several rounds of marriage counseling. Some counselors were trained professionals, some were not. One counselor lasted about 1.5 years and made real inroads before essentially giving up on us because he felt we had stopped doing the work he wanted us to do. I am still meeting monthly with our last marriage counselor, who is fantastic, but who came too late to the game to save it.

I see my ex-wife about once every two weeks. Usually it's only for a few minutes to get a child support check from her. There have been times when I have managed to get her to go to dinner or a movie with me, both with and without friends and/or our son present but she is usually very guarded and distant. Usually she looks miserable and complains about her work the whole time we are together. She has an incredible emotional wall built up. She talks mostly about "business," usually regarding our son, but sometimes about what she's going through at work or problems with her finances, new house, etc. I try to be accommodating and listen. She almost never asks how I'm doing or expresses any interest in what's going on in my life. I try to do nice things for her when the opportunity arises. I have given her money on a few occasions because she's in bad shape financially (lots of bad decisions on her part since the divorce). She usually rejects the offer because she is afraid of me expecting something in return.

I have tried to display unconditional love to her as much as possible since the divorce. While I am angry that she has abandoned me and our son, I still love her and want her back so bad I can taste it. Nearly a year since she moved out, and nearly 7 months since the divorce, I cannot bear the thought of living the rest of my life like this. I recognize that I did not do a great job as a husband, but I divorce has made no one happier and made all three of us less happy (actually, our son is doing really well and may actually be happier than ever, but it's hard to say). All I know is I'm miserable, and I think she's miserable too, but she won't admit it. She has quit attending church and does not really even speak to her parents much any more. I talk to her parents more than she does. I believe she is depressed and has been for years, but she no longer sees a counselor or talks to anyone in detail about anything in her life, as far as I know.

So what I'm seeking now is a way to lay the foundation for reconciliation. She has repeatedly told me "it's not going to happen," even getting angry with me when I told her I still loved her back in February. I realize she needs space and time to heal, but I also worry that waiting too long will cause her to find contentment without me, causing her stubbornness to become even more impossible to dislodge as time goes on.

I have read several books and articles on reconciliation, but none of them have really addressed how to get through to someone like my ex-wife. She resists all talk about "us." In her mind, the decision is made, and there's absolutely no going back. This is the way she is. She's notorious for making decisions and then refusing to admit the decision was bad even when it's painfully evident to everyone that it was.

I want to get her to read some of the marriage/reconciliation books I have read in the last year, but I don't think she'd do that at this time.

So does anyone here have any relevant experience or advice about how I should proceed from here? Anything constructive is very welcome.

Sorry this post is so long. I figured it was better to give as much info on the front end as possible than to have to answer lots of questions later.

Thanks, and God bless.

Your pastor gave you stupid advice.

She's having an Affair with her boss and left you and her son to pursue the affair

If you want to win her back you should enter plan A

Is there a reason why you posted this on the Affair portion of the forum here?


You are divorced and say she never had an A.


However, your W has been having an A. Most likely with her boss.
To the sound of things, a long-term A. Although it isn't technically an A anymore since you are divorced.

You stand very little chance at all to win her back while she is with her A partner.

As your experience indicates, the majority of marriage counselors are usually just divorce facilitators. They have no idea how to save marriages or restore romantic love.

MB program is the only one I am aware of that actually works.

Why do you want to get back with someone who is the source of so much pain to you?

Thank God you have primary custody of your child and focus on becoming healthy, being a good dad and working on your radar so you don't find yourself involved with another such woman.

Edited to add, I don't see that you've written much positive about your ex-wife.

Do you really love her, or is it you hate that she did what she did to you?

Based on what you wrote, I'd say the latter is more likely.

20Year, it looks like she had an EA.
And I suspect she is still in it.

Wow! Lot's of jumping to conclusions around here.

Firstly, I did not post this under Surviving an Affair, I posted under the Divorce forum. It was moved by a moderator.

As to my preacher's advice, he recommended the separation only as a stop-gap to prevent divorce. My wife wanted a divorce originally, but he convinced her to try a separation first. It did no good, of course.

I do not think my wife had an affair while we were married. I know you're going to tell me I'm in denial, etc. But here's why I don't think so: I have asked her a few times if she was having an affair, both before and after the divorce. In fact, the argument the night she decided to move out was precipitated by me asking if she was having an affair. She admitted to an emotional affair, but adamantly denied a physical one. I quizzed her about the nature of the emotional affair, and I came to the conclusion that it was basically one-sided. She said she did not want to be with any other men and never wanted to get married again. She also has very strong feelings about physical affairs and has nothing but bad things to say about the wife of a mutual friend of ours who cheated on him early in their marriage. She'd be a huge hypocrite if she was guilty of the same thing. She also had very little time to have an affair unless she was doing it at work, which I think is virtually impossible. I realize this is not 100% proof, but I am reasonably convinced that she did not have a physical affair while we were married.

Why do I want to get back with someone who is the source of so much pain? Because at one time she was my best friend and the best thing that ever happened to me. She is also the mother of my son, which is something that will never change and cannot be minimized.

I agree.

Hard to believe she would have left him and the child if it didn't go physical though.

After reading about Plan A, I am not sure how feasible it would be, even if she was having an affair, since we're now divorced. I have nothing to bargain with at this point.

My friend, we are not just jumping to conclusions. We have seen this exact story written hundreds of times on this forum. Accepting the fact that your mate, the one you love has done the worst possible thing anyone could do to someone they married is horribly difficult to accept.

Trust me. I know firsthand.

My FWW lied through her teeth for a year and a half about all kinds of things.

Lying and Adultery go hand in hand. Expect it.

You may be in denial and there is probably at 95%+ chance that your W not only had an EA but it was very physical. Most likely she is still with her adultery partner.

Women will not typically abandon their family as your W did unless the A is physical.

I would be happy to accept that my wife had an affair if she admitted it or if I had proof. I have no proof and neither do you. I cannot proceed as if my wife had an affair unless there is proof.

My wife essentially abandoned me and our son on an emotional level the day he was born. Something changed in her on that day, and I don't know what it was. But she did not meet her boss till about five years after that. I absolutely do think she crossed lines with him she should not have crossed, but I do not think she had opportunity to have a physical affair with him during our marriage. What she's done since the divorce, I cannot begin to speculate.

Okay, so you say she admitted to having an affair the night she decided to move out - so why are you saying she did not have an affair? Which is it? Am I misunderstanding the timeline?

You just posted that she admitted it!

Looks like you still want to do this.

Here is the deal, wanting to go back and re-hash the past isn't a path to restoring romantic love.

Your ex-wife fell out of love with you. Regardless what you think about the affair, the bottom line is most folks don't have affairs when they are in love with their spouse. They don't entertain the idea of separation, let alone divorce.

So if you really want to reconcile, plan A is your only choice. You meet whatever emotional needs she will let you meet and avoid any behaviors that destroy romantic love, called Love Busters.

You mention above wanting to talk and similar. Is that how you fell in love, by talking about your past?

You are fishing. Talking about the past is premature. You have to catch the fish before you can dissect the past relationship.

So what are her top emotional needs and what are the things she complained about in the past that you can stop doing?

If she falls in love with you again, then you can work on the framework of a restored marriage.

But having difficult conversations about what when wrong in the past isn't going to trip her romantic trigger.

She admitted to an emotional affair. She VEHEMENTLY denied a physical one.

You say it like this is a good thing.

I'm not convinced an EA is any less damaging the a PA.

So your making distinctions is grasping at straws.

At some point, you have to make sure any form of affair is exposed, killed and defended against. And it is important to know if she's still actively involved with someone.

But the distinction really isn't that important. What is important is that for what ever reason, she did not love you enough to remain in the marriage.

What is your plan to deal with that fact?

Now this is constructive! And it makes sense. I have been trying to do this lately, though I'm not seeing much in the way of results so far. I will admit I'm impatient. The only thing I don't quite understand is how I can implement Plan A. I read about Plan A, and it was all about separating my wife from her affair partner. Did I misread Plan A?

I think you will hear from folks on this forum that you are jumping to conclusions on the level of her affair. It is the extreme rare exception that the whole truth comes out instantly like you describe.
An axiom we have all seen is a wayward will admit to at least one level below what they actual did(i.e. it was only a kiss, when in fact it was oral)
Another axiom - all waywards lie, lie, lie
Axiom 3 - waywards are the biggest hypocrites (either they dont care, denial, or guilt ridden)

There's no argument from me that she didn't love me enough to stay. She claims she never loved me in the first place. I don't believe that, but she certainly stopped loving me somewhere along the way.

As for finding out whether she's still involved with someone, how do I go about that short of asking her?