So the wife has been home for a week. Still no evidence of an affair. She did have a picture or two of her and the coworker riding a camel together at the Taj, but she insists that is innocent.

Her zeal for fixing things has waned a little. She acknowledges that I'm doing everything I can to meet her needs. That I'm making her happy. She says she just now feels all of this incredible pressure to make me happy. She broke down crying once or twice during the week because she said she can't stop feeling this pressure.

She asked me for just two things to work on... I told her undivided attention/affection and that we should potentially work on sexual fulfillment. I've covered the bases she wants covered.


She doesn't really buy into the undivided attention, I don't think. She started saying she felt guilty not involving the kids in everything that we do. I'm not sure what to really think about that. She feels like she's getting distant again. I talked with her while she got ready to go about her day for the first week and felt a lot closer to her.

Now that she's going back to work, she was irritable the first morning and said she needed her space in the mornings. So, she doesn't really want me to talk to her or be around her in the morning. I just kept back.

This morning she ate her breakfast, got ready, and left before the kids even got up. She was gone for a month and hasn't even been back two weeks, but she can't even wait to tell the kids goodbye or eat breakfast with them. Her excuse is that she needs her space and such. She also needs to get away from the pressure of this thing.

I think that what she is really saying is that this relationship/marriage thing is work. She expected me to do all the changes and things, but that she wouldn't have to do anything at all.

Last night, at least she didn't deliberately fall asleep by 8:30 p.m. That was nice. I didn't have to get all the kids into bed and ready by myself. She also watched a thirty minute TV program in silence, but in the same room with me. I suppose that I should be thankful for that.


I'm a mixed bag of emotions. She also says she doesn't want to talk about our problems and things. She doesn't want anything structured. She just wants us to live our lives and "see what happens naturally"

Maybe she just doesn't get it. Maybe I'm a big enabling chump.

Amibetrayed,

She did have a picture or two of her and the coworker riding a camel together at the Taj, but she insists that is innocent.

At the greatest monument to a man's love for a woman in the world they are on a camel together, that's way too intimate for a pregnant wife. Why would a pregnant wife risk falling off the camel and losing her baby, except that the experience of being with the OM was so thrilling.

She broke down crying once or twice during the week because she said she can't stop feeling this pressure.

Affairs and dishonesty ARE stressful.

she doesn't really want me to talk to her or be around her in the morning. I just kept back.

but she can't even wait to tell the kids goodbye or eat breakfast with them. .

So her intense guilt from the affair is crushing her, particularly when she is on her way to see OM.

I'm a mixed bag of emotions. She also says she doesn't want to talk about our problems and things.

She's hoping the affair dies a natural death and you slowly become a couple again, could take years or decades. And she can't talk about the future when she is in an affair, even she knows that.

God Bless
Gamma

Are you doing all of your investigative work? Have you hired a PI or someone you know and trust (watch out?) that can help you snoop?



I am not a WW, but as a mother I have to say that this felt very odd for me too, when I was in Plan A. Anyway, just saying that this could be legit or not.


Good job, respect her needs. (As long as they are not OM]


Bingo! What I learned from WS is that A's are no work at all. At least that is how he considered it. All of the work that my WS had to do to hide and protect the affair basically falls into the category of effort, work and difficulties added to his life because of "me and the marriage." So, the BS's situation takes another hit when the WS looks at everything as being "someone else's fault."


If you are in Plan A, then yes, be "silently thankful."
amibetrayed - make sure that you are not hovering and watching her every move and constantly waiting for her to throw you a scrap during Plan A. The Fog causes this type of behavior from a BS to be even more annoying that it is when no affair is present.



OK, fine. How long does Dr. H say that BH's should be in Plan A? A month? So keep following your guidelines for Plan A (see MB's notable posts section) for the first month that she is home. All she will have of this month will be pleasant times and pleasant memories with you and the kids, then go to Plan B at the end of the month.


Plan B at the end of her first month home.

I am sure that plenty of marriages need a Plan B even without an affair taking place. But I also believe that your wife is having an affair with "camel riding" guy.

How did I miss this? They were on the same camel? No way. Were there not enough camels to go around at the Taj Mahal? She is definitely having an affair. If it is not a PA it is an EA.

Plan B at the end of the month.

hold up fooled. plan b is not recommended in ami's sitch. men have more endurance and can plan a for up to two years.

not time to think about plan b but it does sound like the affair is still on. riding a camel together? that's way too intimate for co-workers.

you've got to find a way to get the goods.

no more relationship talk. plan a like a rockstar. you want her to relax so she slips up. and of course, don't forget the POLY.

Two years, really??? Oh geez! OK, retract my suggestion on Plan B at the end of the month. (Thats why we have vets on the forum.)

It's way too early for Plan B. Dr. Harley officially says up to 6 months of Plan A for a man, and has helped many men go much longer, frequently urging them to give up to 2 years.

Ok now that she's at home, what snooping techniques do you have in place?

Did you hire a PI?

How's your Plan A going?

I don't have a plan A in place really. I should though. I haven't really confirmed an affair. She still tells me that there is no one else of course.

I looked back at the camera. She was indeed on the camel. She saw it crush me when I saw that picture. I was visibly angry at being ambushed by having to see it.

She asked me why I was upset about it. I told her that it was because the man she knows I am uncomfortable with basically has his genitals resting against her backside. She of course did not take this well.

She said that his camera ran out of memory. She said that she intended to just send him the camel pictures like he'd asked for and delete them. To this day, the camel pictures are on the camera.

You know how when you take pictures on a digital camera they show up on the Camera's memory card as IMG_NUMOFPIC? Well, I noticed that there are several times on that trip where the camera pictures jump from like number 179 to 186 with nothing in between. There are also some clearly out of focus pictures so it isn't like pictures were discarded because they were bad. It is driving me insane wondering if those were her intimate incriminating pictures.

I asked her if she'd sent the pictures of the camel to the coworker yet last night. She said she hadn't. I asked her if she wanted me to send them to her so she could. She said nope. I told her, well I've already put them onto a computer so it won't be too much trouble. She didn't respond at all.


My grandmother died on July 4th. We were at the in-laws. She was not tender, caring, or even interested in me. In fact, when I asked her that night if she could just hold me because I wasn't feeling well she went off into a mini rage.

It has been a rough time, but I don't think I could ever leave her. Maybe she knows deep down that I'll take anything and everything forever. She doesn't really want me to touch her or be near her at all.

She said her feet were hurting so I offered her a foot rub last night. That ended up in a conversation about the last several years. She said that I had to know everything I was doing hurt her. That basically this entire situation is my fault. She doesn't feel the same way she felt about me as 5 years ago. She thinks she can feel that way again, but it could take 5+ years. She's not connected to me anymore. She's not 100% in the marriage, but she's also not 100% out.

That ripped my heart out. She said here I am that I've done this complete 180 this past year. 9 months of solid work becoming who she wants and meeting her needs. The fact that I've done this is putting too much pressure on her.

Before India she was warming up to me again. Now... not so much.

Anything that I do for her that is supportive is now "adding pressure..."

She said I should stop trying to make our lives and marriage perfect. It's putting too much pressure on me and on her. That I need to make something besides the marriage and the kids important in my life. She feels I won't be happy if I just focus on the marriage, the kids, and all of us being happy. I should focus on something else...

It's like she wants me to pull away again.

It's clear to me now that she doesn't really feel romantic feelings for me right now. She is nurturing anything that involves me being a parent or a friend, but NOTHING that involves true intimacy.

I've managed to get the kids to bed early so that we can have at least an hour to sit and watch tv in bed or anything every day. She gets very noticeably uncomfortable and irritable the moment that this time comes up.


I can't afford a PI. I'm doing the same snooping I've always done.


I love her and will continue at this forever. Her position is that everything has been my fault. I did it to us. She thinks she could love me like before again, but doesn't know how long it could take. She expressed that it could be years. It's like all my work has been for nothing.

I can be much more formal with my plan A. She is not interested in a polygraph at the moment. Just keeps telling me that there is no one else.

I go between feeling hopeless to bucking up to put a good face on it so she doesn't see me being crushed inside. She's even gone so far as to start calling anything I say or do for her that is supportive is "corny..." Goes out of her way to tell me (even though I haven't looked for sex since the first or second day she was back) that she enjoys the act of sex, but is just not in the mood. (She doesn't have that connection with me anymore, but might could get it back.) I'm pretty depressed today.

I'm sorry but all I hear in these posts of yours is neediness, clingyness, weakness and fear. All very unattractive to any woman.

I don't think you should even be thinking about marriage recovery now, You need work on yourself to become a confident, strong man.

It takes 2 healthy strong people to have a healthy strong marriage. You are not there yet imho

It has been a very long year for me. I've become more vulnerable and expressive because one of her things she said that made her have feelings for my brother was because I didn't open up, I wasn't vulnerable. I was too strong and hard.

Maybe you are right. I can tell you that I've only become like this since she went to India. I've worked since October of last year just fixing everything. Working on myself. Avoiding fights. Doing the things that need to be done because they need to be done.

Perhaps I just started to get desperate after 9 months of all of this with no results and I still haven't gotten proof of an affair.

Perhaps I need to hear what you are saying about all of this. I haven't been the same since I discovered the first EA.

I didn't let myself feel any of the emotions or hurt from the affair until she was gone to India. I just bottled it up. She left and I started feeling it.

I'll work on being confident, strong, and not really emotional. I've just started feeling desperate after being in this for 9 months.

I guess I just can't let myself fall into that.

He has been doing this Plan A for 9 months. If this post is evidence of his frame of mind, I think he needs to get to Plan B soon.

Reposting my response to fooledme because I somehow put it inside of all the quotes where it can't be read.

I don't think that I can do a Plan B. The plan A type behavior that I was doing the 9 months wasn't all in line with the good Dr.'s advice. I didn't even know about this site or the concepts. I would sometimes get angry and we would fight where we'd both do the classical love busters.

I have also still never confirmed an affair.

What has gotten me is that things were starting to look up, but have taken a large step back.

He is probably right that I'm being too weak and needy. The 28 days apart where I basically was a single parent while she was off with the coworker really got to me. I was clingy and needy for her when she returned. I did not have those needs filled. 28 days without her made me very needy. It may be an understandable response, but it was likely the wrong one.

Here is the thing:

Working on being confident, strong, etc. is really nebulous and vague. Dr. Harley's plan gives you specific actions to work on:

1. Work on learning to meet her most important emotional needs. That will almost certainly include conversation and affection. Here is Dr. Harley's article about the friends and enemies of good conversation. Read and re-read it daily, and try to talk to her every day and include the friends and avoid the enemies:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5056_qa.html

2. Work on learning to eliminate love busters. No matter how emotional you feel, do not say or do anything that she would think is demanding, disrespectful, or angry.

3. Find out what is going on in her life, snoop if you have to, to see if there is an affair or to rule one out.

That's it. That's the specific things you have to do. Don't put any of these three things on hold.

I am pretty sure where my failings have been here. Thank you Markos and JustLooking for the blunt advice.

I am meeting her needs. She is absolutely clear on that. I suspect she is not to the point where she is in love with me yet. All snooping so far has given some mild circumstantial evidence of an affair, but nothing concrete. I keep that up.

I need to work on love busters big time. She was starting to come back to me a little before the trip to India. I was devastated that she went on this Taj Mahal trip and it through me completely out of all of my work and other things. I started to act needy, lacking confidence, and the like. Maybe it was a depression brought on by it.

She agreed she would finally start doing some things too when she came back. She has made this agreement before (back in October). I worked, but she really didn't. I was encouraged by the thawing slightly before the trip with what some believe may have been the pity sex and starting to be more intimate (emotionally).

I took a large step back from what I was upon her return. I personally think I have been a selfish man these last two weeks. I wanted to meet her needs and I did that, but I thought her working would mean that she intended to meet mine. It may just have meant she had ended the affair or that she's finally open to love bank deposits on a larger scale. I'm not sure.

I do know that my disappointment at the lack of any real verifiable effort like she promised caused me to be needy. I never did anything like demands or the like. But, she is clearly not ready to come completely back to me and meet emotional needs. I just have to continue in a type of Plan A and meet hers selflessly, avoid love busters, and hope she falls back in love with me. It will be difficult since she does not want to do as much undivided attention as the good doctor says is needed, but I am not giving up.

ami, are you listening to Marriage Builders Radio? Over time it's a great way to get the education and daily motivation you need to keep it up.

I started listening today. I know I have a second, third, and fourth wind.

I was starting to see results. I can't let this month long absence undo everything I've worked so hard to achieve. I put myself through my own cathartic hell to improve myself. It was working.

I'm not going to let me be destroy it.

Amibetrayed,

She asked me why I was upset about it. I told her that it was because the man she knows I am uncomfortable with basically has his genitals resting against her backside. She of course did not take this well.

This is AN AFFAIR! The only open question is the paternity of the unborn child. When I first read about the camel ride, I thought perhaps they were side saddle.

God Bless
Gamma

I agree with the others to stay in Plan A and do it completely like Dr. Harley would have you do.

What are her top ENs? What are you doing to fulfill those needs?

How are you eliminating your LBs?

Do you think your snooping techniques are solid? You need to really confirm if there's an affair or not.

Have you emailed Dr. Harley?