Now, why would that suddenly be the case? If I am a WW and I want to get out to see the OM, I am going to REWARD you for agreeing to let me go out with my friends. I am also going to leave my phone lying around so you will read my staged text messages to my "girlfriend." That will make you feel safe about letting me go out.

I am just saying that even a 12 year old could figure out how to set this stage, Pius. I do not believe you have good instincts AT ALL. Keep in mind that it took a HUGE effort on the part of others to convince you there was an affair in the first place.


You said on 7-16-13:


I just want to remind you how very, very sneaky your wife is. Sneaky, sneaky, sneaky. I would not trust anything that you can't see or verify with your own eyes. If your wife has any "friends" I am certain they are more like partners in crime than real friends. Your wife wouldn't have anything else. I think she is an experienced pro when it comes to tricking you.

Be on the lookout for an affair phone. The unlocked phone and the texts from friends might just be a front.

I would be sure and go WITH your wife every time she wants to go out with friends. Just let her know your new motto is TRUST BUT VERIFY! Tell her you do not feel safe with her going out without you. She should have no objection unless she has something to hide.

Your wife has had a secret second life for a LONG TIME.

I note that you STILL do not have any spyware on her phone and *NO* spying tools in place despite being advised to do so for 6 months. I have to conclude that you don't WANT to do so.


here

here



here

In short, she is still in an active affair and you would have no way of knowing because you won't spy on her and hold her accountable. She was out catting around in bars until 3am just the other night and you believe this is a good sign. ~~sigh~~

Did you expose the affair to your daughters?

Do you have a GPS & a VAR in her vehicle?

Pius,

Rather disheartening isn�t it? To experience your W in a good mood only to come here and be warned that that could be a bad thing.

Try not to let it get you down. She very well could be bouncing in and out of the R. Just be wary that from withdrawal first comes conflict. Going from withdrawal to happiness is a little suspicious.

Continue to push for an interdependent life. Keep inviting her to sleep in her own bed. So long as she isn�t doing that � I�m leaning towards a continued A.

Keep inviting her out on dates and let her know you're aren't enthusiastic about her going out along especially to bars.

Pius,

Have you ever contacted Dr. Harley? Have you ever been on the radio show?

Unfortunately your right.

Pius, she is exhibiting such a bad pattern, here I don't know where to start.

There is no WAY your wife is too stupid to know you would object to a night of bar hopping. That was the plan all along and she hid that from you.

She DELIBERATELY LIED. She doesn't give a hoot what you think about that either - and you know it.

That in itself is bad enough, but consider the following pattern.

Bad mood (withdrawal) before the outing - good mood after the outing.

That is BAAAAAAAAD as signs and patterns go, with waywards. After she told you a deliberate lie, too.

I'd also be surprised if she didn't have ally friends who support her A.

Someone who has had a SSL for a long time would only want allies for friends.

Why would she have made good, honest friends while hiding a SSL?

And until you start snooping, you'll never know who's who.

Even if the friend is a stand up girl who supports your marriage,its not her job to police your wife. If your wife spent the evening texting OM, it's not her job to be wise to that.

Wow, you guys posted quite a lot since I last looked! About my wife's good mood - that was actually fairly brief. Most of the time she's very down. Monday just happened to be a fairly good day.

I hear what you guys say about snooping. I verify things as best as I can. WW put a passcode back on her phone and I immediately asked for it. She gave it to me without hesitation, along with the password to her computer. I know you guys are busting my chops about not snooping more, but I really can't install any snooping stuff on her phone until they come out with the jailbreak for iOS 7. Supposedly I hear that may happen at the end of the month. But until it does, I'm mostly helpless on that front. And the phone was her main means of communicating when the affair was active. In the mean time, every time she lays the phone down and leaves it alone, I pick it up just to check. Also when she goes out I've tried to drive by POSOM's house just to make sure she isn't there. oI never had the password to her computer before, so once she gave it to me I checked her browser history. I didn't see anything worrisome. But I'm not being naive - still haven't ruled out the possibility that something nefarious is going on. I've looked at GPS's but they aren't cheap at all and we are stretched for cash now. A VAR would be cheaper but I'm not sure of the best place to put it.

As for our house selling, on Monday we have some people coming out to look at it. From what I hear they liked what they saw online so I am keeping my fingers crossed. Wednesday we are scheduled to have all new carpets installed. Then the following week, if we haven't gotten an offer yet, someone is supposed to come out and paint for us.

In the mean time, I'm making sure my wife and I have a date night at least once a week. I also asked her about going to her parents' Hilton Head house on Veteran's Day weekend. She said she would think about it. I had invited her to go back on Columbus Day weekend, and she never responded. I thought it was because she wasn't interested, but my MIL said she had actually asked if we could go down that weekend, but MIL said no because they were going to be there then. So I was encouraged by that.

As far as how we are getting along, WW is never really mean to me anymore, but she still doesn't talk to me as much as I'd like, or make eye contact with me very often. Still, she is praying with me every evening and talking to me a bit more than she did before. So it seems like we are taking baby steps.

So here's a question: should I ask her to come back into the master bedroom with me, or just wait until she decides this on her own (if she ever does)? I think MrAlias was saying I should ask - does everyone else agree?

Alright, so I asked her gently if she would consider coming back into the master bedroom, and she said "nope" very nonchalantly. Whenever I talk to her, also, I can just feel the indifference pouring off of her. Argh, this is so discouraging - I hate this!!!

That's why we are encouraging you to snoop. We want you to be 100% sure there's no OM. Her having her LB$ so closed to you is a very concerning red flag.

Pius, there are millions of ways to spy on a spouse, recorders, camcorders, and I am pretty sure there is an app you can you put on an iPhone to spy. Why not get one that does not require you to jailbreak the phone? I can only conclude that you don't want to snoop after all this time.

Argh - well I put down fifty bucks for the "MobileSpy" thing recommended in the "Operation Investigate" forum, and only after I paid the money for it did I see that it needs a jailbreak to work. So then I followed the link to another site to get the jailbreak, and it advertised that there was one for iOS 7. But then once I paid money for that, I saw there were only links to jailbreak up to iOS 6.1.2. So basically I've spent about $70 total for spyware that is as of now still useless. So I am pretty frustrated with the whole snooping that. I do believe you need a jailbreak though, because regular iOS doesn't allow you record phone calls and run things in the background, and such.

Do you have access to the phone bill? Does she use a laptop at all? PI per chance? You need to become proactive in this. Has a polygraph been done?

What about backing up her phone to iTunes? Won't that give you a complete call history, etc? And what about a VAR for your house in a place where she might be talking to the OM? Do you have a keylogger on her computer?

Get a "Go Ez Tracker"....initial investment is about $200, then is about $25 per month to monitor.

You just plug in this device under the dash of her car, and you get live time tracking of her vehicle.

You can set up "fences" that if she enters them you get an email alert on your cell phone.

This device wil do one of two things.....rebuild trust or allow you to see reality. Combine this device with a free gps on her phone and it will be very difficult for her to move without your knowledge.

I used this system for over a year with my FWW and fortuantly it proved her word as being honest.

A few hundred bucks is pennies for some concrete truth at this time in your life.

A good micro recorder will work too, about $80 at radio shak...this covers what you can't see on phone records. I reviewed cell phone records weekly for nearly a year straight....

This is like a second job, but it will keep you sane and give you the info you need to either move on or end things for good reason.

I personally wouldn't waste money on a PI...YOU need to become versed in these tactics.

Yes if you need someone to ad you in your efforts, elicit the help of a close friend...you will find out who your true ones are...

Don't ever DISCLOSE your tactics unless discovered directly by your WW...if they prove to provide information positive or negative they must remain undisclosed for you benefit...

Kgaa, they live within a 5 minute walk of the OM, btw. His wife just walks over there and the OM is free to come to his house at any time.