"As I was talking, she kept interrupting saying, "I don't want to talk!" I did say a few things that I hope she heard. I said that her withholding affection was abusive behavior. I said that I have a need to receive her affection. "

Forcing your wife to listen to her is abusive and needs to stop. STOP trying to educate your wife. All you do is push her away more when you do that.

Don't cut off her phone. Don't worry about plan b. You are months away from plan b, if at all.

"Last night we had a tiff because she posted something on facebook and I posted along with it. She said I was "turning it to be about me" and I explained that I was trying to be supportive of what she said and didn't intend to shift focus toward me at all. "

This is a very ineffective way of resolving a problem. Your wife told you she doesn't want you to do this. So just stop it. Don't defend it. What matters is it bothered her and you should avoid bothering her.

She said she would listen. When the said, "Stop talking!" I shut up. (Except that I said, "Okay. I love you.")



My point was that she complained about my post, I explained my reasoning, but said, "I'll stop posting on your page. I'm sorry." Then she got mad at me for saying that I wouldn't post on her page anymore.

"IShe said she would listen. When the said, "Stop talking!" I shut up. (Except that I said, "Okay. I love you.") "

Now you are changing your story because you said earlier that:

"As I was talking, she kept interrupting saying, "I don't want to talk!" I did say a few things that I hope she heard. I said that her withholding affection was abusive behavior. I said that I have a need to receive her affection. "

You didn't shut up at all.

Instead of arguing and defending the why (which is really irrelevant) just tell her you will stop. AND THEN STOP. What matters is that a) it bothers her and b) you will stop. She didn't tell you to stop posting on her page, she wanted you to stop doing what you were doing.

The key is that you should not be arguing with her or trying to educate her.

Don't. This is a lovebuster.

Okay, firstly, she has said several times "When I say 'I don't want to talk' I'm still willing to listen." I respected her boundaries. It may not have been obvious to you with my short description, but I respected her boundaries.

Secondly, how should I have responded when she hit me with anger about my post? She has said, "I don't want you to apologize!" So, I can't say, "Oh, I'm sorry." I thought saying, "That wasn't my intention, I was trying to support you." Was not defensive or a "love buster".

If I say nothing, then it sounds like I'm ignoring or discounting her.

So what should I say when she attacks me and complains about something?

Her: I'm pissed off that you did X!
Me: *silence*

Her (later to her friends): He doesn't listen to me! He ignores me!


Her: I'm pissed off that you did X!
Me: Okay.

Her (later to her friends): He discounted what I said!


Her: I'm pissed off that you did X!
Me: I'm sorry.
Her: I don't want to hear your apologies!


Actual conversation:
Her: I'm pissed off that you posted on my facebook page and made it all about you!
Me: That wasn't my intention. I was trying to support you by agreeing with your post. I'll stop posting on your page.
Her: I didn't say not to post on my page! I hate that attitude!
Me: *Silence*


I'm castigated whether I answer or not. I'm castigated whether I agree to stop posting on her page (which she asked me) or not (which she claimed she didn't ask me).

Should I just stop talking to her and interacting with her at all?

I no longer call her during the day from work - because she complained that I was interrupting her day.

I no longer text her unless she texts me first because she either ignores the texts (she has a reputation for responding to everyone's texts immediately, btw) or she complains that I interrupt her day.

I no longer email her because she never responds and complains that I make her email notification go off and interrupts her day.

I no longer like her facebook and runkeeper posts because she complains that I make her notifications go off and interrupts her day.

She has filled our evenings with so many activities that we seldom have more than 30 minutes to spend time together - and the kids are always there, so it's not one-on-one at all.

What should I do?

Your whole post is focused on figuring out the right response to her. But even having these back and forths destroys marriages. There is no right response. It's like nuclear war. The only correct strategy is to not play.

For now, she will rant and rave and castigate you no matter what. However, if you follow the plan here, you stand a good chance of saving your marriage, and eventually turning this around. The plan is going to involve not having these back and forths and debates. She will be upset, but that does not mean you are following a wrong strategy.

I suggest sticking to the first step of the plan here. Don't get hung up on your WW's reaction to it.

Okay. So....

The plan.

I'm gathering my support, gathering contact information, reading the book, preparing to expose.

Then what?

When she tells you to stop, you need to stop. I don't see that you respected her request at all and just like to argue. When someone argues and nitpicks like you have here, they usually do the same at home. It is a waste of my time and it is wrecking your marriage.

Just stop it.

Then sit back and wait for the affair for crumble. You can bide your time at that point.

p.s. as soon as you finish Survivng an Affair, I would strongly recommend you jump to Lovebusters. I suspect you are doing a lot of things that you may not even realize are causing major problems for you.

I have been looking at articles on the site and decided to root out what caused my wife to be open to the affair and this is the start of my thinking process. I'm posting this because I'm open to commentary (or else I'd keep it to myself...)

Causes of the affair:
� Too much time devoted to other activities (2nd job, hobbies)
� Emotional abandonment (too much time invested elsewhere)
� Lack of affection / sex (no energy/time to devote)
� Not involved enough with the kids (too much time invested elsewhere)
I was gone 3-4 weekends a month, leaving her with the kids alone. I was working extra hours during the week to pay for half days off on Friday to make it to my weekend work.
When home in the evenings, I ignored her and her needs for affection and sex.
I was tired while driving home and pushed her away instead of taking her calls. I often ignored or ended her calls quickly while working and didn�t call her in the evenings when I was away.

She felt lonely, abandoned, left to tend the house and kids alone and in desperate need for friendship, companionship, love and affection.

You got it! But you need to add this at the top of that list:

Wife has inappropriate boundaries with people outside of the marriage. If she had not allowed someone outside of the marriage to meet her EN's she would not have had an affair.

If Item #1 is not changed, it won't matter what you do, because she will have more affairs. All the need meeting in the world cannot overcome that.

My wife has a friend who knows that I've complained about the relationship she has with the other woman - and has said to her, "I'll always support you, no matter what evidence he shows me." She thinks she's "being a good friend" to my wife - but is significantly enabling the affair.

Should I directly address this supporting friend when I expose? ("You may think you're being a "good friend" by encouraging her association with the other woman, but you're only enabling this extra-marital affair to continue to wreak havoc on our family.")

Should they receive the exposure message?

Does this so-called "friend" have a husband?

Actually, I would send that "friend" an exposure letter asking for her help. To friends and family, you will want to send something like this:


I would even shorten that up if you can. Whatever you do, when you send out exposure letters, keep them short and sweet. Writing long letters is never a good idea. In fact, writing long letters or posts is almost always a bad idea because most people won't read them. All you do is lose your audience when people have to pick through endless superfluous words.

The friend purports to support my wife and encourage her. She says she is "strongly against" extra-marital affairs - but she participates in the friendship with the other woman. The other woman is playing a huge sympathy card in that her husband has made threats of violence (deadly violence) against her (and against my wife and me and our children - but they seem to forget about those threats).

The woman is the wife of a politician in our community - and I've considered telling her that if she continues to enable the affair it will eventually come out and harm her husband's political aspirations.

The other woman's influence in this other friend's life seems to be making her more dissatisfied with her husband, as my wife has told me that recently she's started complaining about him.

In my mind, the other woman is a poisonous, infectious wretch who poisons every woman she meets against her husband.

Is she getting into the affair zone? Well, based on my recent reading (this site and Surviving an Affair), quite possibly. Would she become involved with another woman? That's harder to predict. She's staunchly against same-sex relationships. But, if that's just another moral conviction and it's easy to break down the moral barriers to have an affair, why not those barriers, too?

Have you completed your exposure?

I am still gathering information. I'm holding out till after the weekend. There are several key players that I need to communicate with that I can't get their contact info until this coming weekend.

I have modified the suggested letter a little bit. I would like your input:

Dear friends and family,

I am writing you this message because you are an important person in the lives of xxxx and I. As some of you know, xxxxx and I have had some marriage troubles. She has ended counseling and refuses to return, which has saddened my heart. To my shock, I am saddened to have discovered that the reason is because she has been carrying on an affair with a girlfriend � xxxxx xxxxx, who resides in xxxxxx. She is also married and has young children. My wife wants to carry on her affair without my interference and has made accusations against me to garner support and sympathy so that she can continue the affair while you focus your attention on my faults.

She refuses to end the affair. I want our marriage to recover from this affair. If you have any influence on my wife, please do what you can to get her to stop this dangerous affair. I want to stay married, but the affair must end.

Xxxx, the husband of Xxxx, has threatened to kill my wife, to kill me, to kill our children and to kill Xxxx if they continue to communicate � and still my wife insists on maintaining 15+ hours of contact weekly with Xxxx. (I have the proof of my statements if anyone needs to see them.) My wife asked me not to file orders of protection against Xxxx and Xxxx because she didn�t want this affair to come to light. (Xxxx has had a previous relationship with another woman named Xxxx and has admitted that she is bisexual and is in love with my wife.)

As our friends and family, I am asking that you use your influence with xxxx to persuade her to end her affair and try to work on our marriage. Our marriage can be salvaged if she would only end the affair. Please support her in doing the right thing. Please support our marriage. By encouraging her friendship and association with Xxxx, you are enabling the affair � and you bear that guilt before God.
Our marriage can survive and recover from this affair � but first the affair, the friendship and the association with Xxx must end. Only then can our healing begin.

I would so appreciate your support and prayers.

Warmest regards,