I'm not sure that exposure hasn't put a real stress on the A. I'm jaded to her mood swings, enjoying my kids, and understand that "mywifeiLove" is an alien creature. I went through this for 3 months before she moved out last time. As a now recognized serial cheater, I have to weigh the consequenses, and ride along a bit. I'm not feeling horrible, and am also not afraid of the alien within. If someone told me that we could recover and this would happen again in 9 years....I'd take it, then leave, knowing my kids would be adults by then.. But that's not to say that in a few weeks I don't pull the trigger on D. Am I afraid?? Hell yeah. But I wasn't afraid enough last time to let her go....I'm just not to that point yet.

And no, I haven't contacted an attorney yet. She "wants out", but I heard that back in '05. Again, I'm very jaded to this all and refuse R talk now. She won't pull the D stuff on me...she has a lot of bark and no bite....

Could you outline your exposures to date? To whom was this exposed and what was said?

About 15 of her friends (and most of them are friends with OM)7 members of my family, 8 neighbors (of which my wife only interacts occasionally)...I tried to get contact info on OM's Dad, but failed to acquire.

The poisoning as mentioned earlier by ML was a thought, but my symptoms started way back in Sept. of '13. And they have gone away many days at a time....kind of a remit/recur theme....I may have some undiagnosed Autoimmune disorder, but just not sure.

WW's emotiontions are all over the place, a bit more than normal....so something maybe going on in affairville....if I could only have all the knowledge her phone has. Would a modem KL work for smartphones on our wireless network?

You need to expose to OM family and friends.
Post him on Cheaterville.

What about her parents? Your parents? What about the OM's family and friends? Your children?

Have you confronted the OM yourself?

What were these people TOLD exactly? What were your children told?


The poisoning I mentioned is what happens to you mentally and physically when a spouse is having an affair. Like I mentioned, it is devastating to your health and many people don't recover.


i am unclear why you posted this because her emotions are not relevant to the issue. She does admit she is having an affair, right?

No admittance to an affair, only an admittance that she should have told me she was "talking" more with her "friend". Her parents have both died since her last A. My Dad knows, and as I mentioned in my previous posts, and now my mother and sister know. I exposed to her sister but she is in denial also, thinks I'm crazy.
OM's Mom I believe is dead, and I have not been able to find contact of OM's Dad. The reason I bring up WW's emotions is that I "sense" that there is a bit of strife between them. (Like last OM's and WW's interactions....when ther is contact, WW is "happy" and when something is a miss, WW is sad and or short angry at me kids etc.

If the A falls apart, and WW never has to acknowledge A, is recovery possible down the road?? I'm thinking not, and I'm getting reading to see an Attorny soon. I know the way stuff has been "set up" that if I serve D papers, my kids will resent me. I am suffering but not as bad as last post month D day in 2005.

Yes, I sent a text to OM on the Friday night Exposure blitz. Saying "Don't contact my wife anymore." Never heard back from him, but WW said that she talked to him (a week later) and he was going to reply that "we've been friends for 30 years". WW flew off the handle when I asked her how he knew it was me.

Sir, your kids may resent you for filing for divorce just as they may resent a cop that gives them a speeding ticket.

Divorce is a natural consequence of adultery and your kids need to understand that.

The answer to that is "Don't contact her anymore, anyway."

It's like the way I have to talk to my kids half the time: I tell them to do something, they cite something completely irrelevant and meaningless, and I tell them to do it anyway.

Then you sit them down and you explain them boundaries in marriage. It will be a good opportunity for you to teach them about extraordinary care in marriage and that if you are married to someone who strays and refuses to care for you, that divorce becomes a very good option.

I am very concerned that your children haven't been properly exposed to and are learning to disrespect you because of your WW's gaslighting and attitude towards you. The last thing you want is for her waywardism to rub off on them.

Again, I would forget this M and focus on your children, developing your relationship outside of the presence of your WW and focus on getting yourself healthy.

Thank you Suzie....this was an email sent to me by WW yesterday...

"Im sure you are not going to appreciate constructive criticism from me right now but I am going to give it to you anyway because its about the kids.

Your behavior to them has changed. Whether you are talking to them about our issues or just about their lives � they are not used to it. Its wonderful that you are looking to be involved and I suppose that since its beyond difficult between you and I right now that would be what you want to nuture. But I want you to know that they are both awkward and uncomfortable. And feeling guilty knowing that things are tense between us that is not something you are going to hear from them. Unless you ask. If you now want to be asking every time you walk into a room how this is going or that is going, maybe you want to have a conversation with them about how you would like your relationship to change because before this � you were the provider and disciplinarian. You didn�t know about a lot and you didn�t ask. Which is what they were used to.

Georgie told me his feelings made him feel like a bad son. He is particularly fragile and I would really like you to think about that when you talk to him. Sarah is older and more capable � but your relationship with her has always been a bit of a struggle � I know you know that � and now you want to be her best friend."

My kids are uncomfortable when I approach them about this right now.

I suspect that it is she who is feeling guilty and wants you to stop talking to the kids. How better to achieve that than to tell you that you are making them unhappy?

And the substance of her complaint seems to be that you are talking to the kids at all - not just that you are talking about the affair. Her complaint is that you walk into a room and ask them how things are going with them, and you want to become their best friend when before you were the disciplinarian. Is this really grounds for a complaint?

You should not become drawn into a discussion with her about this. If it makes her better to tell you that, although she's having an affair it is your telling the kids that makes them feel bad�you can see she has lost her mind.

Having said that: you seem to be making a terrible mess of this. You have told your kids some half-baked nonsense about their mother "liking another man in California" and "having an inappropriate relationship with him" - what the heck is that? Has she become his financial adviser? That term could mean anything, and all it has served to do is to make your kids unsure and doubtful.

Ignore what she says about their feelings. However, you need to talk to them properly about what your wife is doing and how this will affect your family if she doesn't stop.

She is trying to control the message by manipulating you with the kids. She is a wayward, and waywards lie, and you never believe the word of a wayward!!!

Waywards do slip up and make mistakes all the time, so pay attention and take notes.

You clued into an important behavior queue- she is happy when she is talking with OM and grouchy when she doesnt.

So what most of you are saying is that D is really the best option from here...no hope of recovery, without her acknowledgement of the A. And the only way for her to acknowledge it, is to get more proof?? And then confront her? Would Plan A'ing her, when she lets me, aid in a further down the road recovery? Is she recoverable after 2 A's?

The only reason I didn't use the affair word to the kids is because I really don't know what the extent of the relationship is and WW can easily call me "crazy"...and with my health issues and self absorbtion of trying to find out what is/has been wrong with me, my kids were kind of seeing their Dad as "crazy" for the better part of last year. I was put on some "head meds" in Jan. and didn't sleep for 4 straight days, and trembled and paced during that time...and kids saw some of that and were a quite scared for their Dad.

Yes, that is what we are all saying.

Even with acknowledgement of the A, there is not much hope. The A is not your biggest problem. The problem is that your WW is a very callous serial cheater.

Once you separate from her, you will start to gain emotional distance and see her in a clearer light. You are so fixated on her and saving your M that you are missing the bigger picture.

Please listen: See a lawyer and get prepared for your separation. The focus needs to be on your health and Plan A'ing your children. They need you to be as whole and healthy as possible given that their mother is a serial cheater who is gaslighting them.

Waywards are not good parents! Please start putting your children ahead of your WW.

I am not going to stop hammering you about this. We don't care about your WW. We care about you and your children.

I am afraid if you don't start listening to us and get yourself into a Plan B pronto, your health will really deteriorate and your WW will use this as ammo against you.

I really hope you let go of this crazy idea of Plan A'ing your serial cheating WW back to this M. She's a lost cause and you are risking a lot by pursuing this. I don't know how else to make this more clear to you!

I understand, I was just wondering if there is anyone out there that has survived 2 A's, and recovered for good. The last 8 years have been great! And I don't just lose my W....I lose my best friend....

It's a tough trigger to pull, knowing I obviously have some codependency issues.

You posted about how amazing your M was four months ago and your WW was already in this affair for several months. So I don't think you are seeing things clearly.

I told Dr Harley when I talked to him on the show in 2011 that the last few years had been "the best of our M"....but while yes, we were better at meeting each other's ENs and avoiding LB and spending UA time together, my ex had clung to his SSL and his IB.

Your WW has as well, otherwise this affair wouldn't have happened.

That's a dealbreaker. No, things were not great for the past 8 years...

This is not an option for you at this point. Not even close. Your WW is thickly in the fog and gaslighting you and your children.

Forget WW and saving the M and focus on preserving your health and your children.

If your WW comes to you having ended her affair and 100% committed to saving your M and following MB, come back and talk to us about R. There is nothing to discuss regarding R in your case.

I felt that way at first too but I do not feel that way anymore. Your WW has failed to provide care for you...abused you and hurt you in the worst way possible....TWICE. Those are not the actions of a "friend".


Dr Harley has advised other BHs that can't let go of their WW that they will start to feel better once they separate. You just have to trust this and recalibrate your focus and goal.

We can't help you if you REFUSE to follow the advice. I believe this is a hopeless situation, but you are making it 10x worse by not exposing the affair. I can't imagine why you would play such head games with children. They really are not stupid. Giving them ridiculous and false explanations for the source of tension in the home confuses them and teaches them to be dishonest.

Expose the affair, expose the affair, expose the affair, expose the affair.

CONFRONT THE OM.