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What should I say that won't be construed as arguing? I still don't really feel understood. We understand completely. We just don't agree. This site is to help people implement MB in their own marriages. So if you disagree with Dr. Harley's definitions, we will consider you to be arguing. Also, you are refusing to accept the outside persceptive you requested, which is not productive for you. You are here. Let's clean up your side of the street. Maybe I haven't been expressing myself very well, but I don't disagree with any of Dr. Harley's definitions, nor do I refuse to accept anyone's perspective. Is it arguing to try to better explain my own perspective when I feel like people aren't quite getting it? I reread this whole thread and STILL don't see where I was arguing. And I said that I would do everything suggested. What you did right there, that is arguing. Aargh. I thought you might say that. So if someone tells me I did or thought something that I feel I didn't do or think, how do I express that without arguing? This is a very important question, because the exact same thing happens when I try to discuss things with my husband. I thought people weren't supposed to tell you what you're doing or thinking, because there's no way to respond to that without sounding defensive.
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My husband is reading this too. Do you have advice for him? Yes! Read Lovebusters. Did you get the book? It is a good idea to get 2 copies and each of you read a couple of chapters each day and do the lessons in the back. As you are reading, you should each highlight comments [use different color highlighters] that stand out to you and then exchange the books so you can see each others highlights. Also, it would be helpful if your husband registered under his own name and had his own thread. OK. Already reading lovebusters. I doubt my husband will do that, but I'll ask him.
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[
Aargh. I thought you might say that. So if someone tells me I did or thought something that I feel I didn't do or think, how do I express that without arguing? This is a very important question, because the exact same thing happens when I try to discuss things with my husband. I thought people weren't supposed to tell you what you're doing or thinking, because there's no way to respond to that without sounding defensive. When people ask you to STOP, you should STOP. We don't need you to "express" yourself; we need you to listen. We can't help you if you won't STOP.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Also, we have used these principles to build amazing marriages.
I always get the impression people first come here to get help straightening out there spouse. Then they are shocked when we focus on their behavior first. Here is why: you can only control you. It is useless to try to fix the behavior of the person not here. You should learn to implement MB yourself. If he then refuses to join you in building a great marriage, there is a plan for that as well.
You should not try to educate your husband on MB. If he wants to learn, he can come here.
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[
Aargh. I thought you might say that. So if someone tells me I did or thought something that I feel I didn't do or think, how do I express that without arguing? This is a very important question, because the exact same thing happens when I try to discuss things with my husband. I thought people weren't supposed to tell you what you're doing or thinking, because there's no way to respond to that without sounding defensive. I want to point out that you are the LEAST objective person on this thread when it comes to your behavior. You have had many people describe how you are coming across to them and you need to listen. This is exactly how your husband describes your behavior. You just won't stop. Your marriage is a wreck and I suspect it is because of this very practice. I can tell you are in a habit of arguing and brawling. But we can't help you if do the same thing here. Maybe its time to open your mind and listen to objective observers? Your best thinking has not helped your marriage, after all.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Maybe I haven't been expressing myself very well, but I don't disagree with any of Dr. Harley's definitions, nor do I refuse to accept anyone's perspective. Is it arguing to try to better explain my own perspective when I feel like people aren't quite getting it? I reread this whole thread and STILL don't see where I was arguing.
And I said that I would do everything suggested. What you did right there, that is arguing. [/quote] Aargh. I thought you might say that. So if someone tells me I did or thought something that I feel I didn't do or think, how do I express that without arguing? This is a very important question, because the exact same thing happens when I try to discuss things with my husband. I thought people weren't supposed to tell you what you're doing or thinking, because there's no way to respond to that without sounding defensive. [/quote] When you continue to talk, you show that you believe that if only the other person saw things the "right" way, they would agree with you. You are deny the other person the right to have a differing perspective. You are considering that you are right and they are wrong' rather than that they see the world differently than you.
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[
Maybe I haven't been expressing myself very well, but I don't disagree with any of Dr. Harley's definitions, nor do I refuse to accept anyone's perspective. Is it arguing to try to better explain my own perspective when I feel like people aren't quite getting it? I reread this whole thread and STILL don't see where I was arguing. This is NOT HELPFUL. Instead of arguing about whether you were arguing, your efforts would be better spent focusing on solutions. We aren't here to understand your perspective. We are here to help you understand Marriage Builders. Unless you can stop this, I don't see the point of helping you. OK, I understand you aren't here to understand my perspective, and are trying to help. But if you seem to misunderstand something I said, shouldn't I clarify it? Like, I have no idea where anyone got the idea that I don't agree with Dr. Harley's definitions, and it seems unproductive to give advice based on that assumption. Shouldn't you know how what I actually think in order to give me the most relevant advice? By the way, I'm not asking this to be argumentative! I'm really trying to understand how to communicate better, since the same thing happens when I try to communicate with my husband.
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ar�gue
ˈ�rɡyo͞o/
verb
1.
give reasons or cite evidence in support of an idea, action, or theory, typically with the aim of persuading others to share one's view.
"defense attorneys argue that the police lacked �probable cause� to arrest the driver"
synonyms: contend, assert, maintain, insist, hold, claim, reason, allege; More
2.
exchange or express diverging or opposite views, typically in a heated or angry way.
"don't argue with me"
synonyms: quarrel, disagree, squabble, bicker, fight, wrangle, dispute, feud, have words, cross swords, lock horns, be at each other's throats; informalspat
"the children are always arguing"
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[
Aargh. I thought you might say that. So if someone tells me I did or thought something that I feel I didn't do or think, how do I express that without arguing? This is a very important question, because the exact same thing happens when I try to discuss things with my husband. I thought people weren't supposed to tell you what you're doing or thinking, because there's no way to respond to that without sounding defensive. When people ask you to STOP, you should STOP. We don't need you to "express" yourself; we need you to listen. We can't help you if you won't STOP. Do you mean stop doing love busters? I already said I would.
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The purpose of this forum is to help posters understand the concepts of Marriage Builders. It is not to debate and argue. This thread will be locked if this does not stop immediately.
smallpeace, did you have a question about this program? We will lock this thread if the focus does not get back on the program.
MBDenali@gmail.com
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OK, I understand you aren't here to understand my perspective, and are trying to help. But if you seem to misunderstand something I said, shouldn't I clarify it? Like, I have no idea where anyone got the idea that I don't agree with Dr. Harley's definitions, and it seems unproductive to give advice based on that assumption. Shouldn't you know how what I actually think in order to give me the most relevant advice?
By the way, I'm not asking this to be argumentative! I'm really trying to understand how to communicate better, since the same thing happens when I try to communicate with my husband. You can say all you want that you agree with us. If you then follow it up with an argument about why we are wrong' saying you agree is just lip service.
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Once you have stated your perspective, stop. You dont have to keep pressing the point.
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Also, we have used these principles to build amazing marriages.
I always get the impression people first come here to get help straightening out there spouse. Then they are shocked when we focus on their behavior first. Here is why: you can only control you. It is useless to try to fix the behavior of the person not here. You should learn to implement MB yourself. If he then refuses to join you in building a great marriage, there is a plan for that as well.
You should not try to educate your husband on MB. If he wants to learn, he can come here. Yes, I get all that. But I still feel like I was being attacked, first by my husband, then by most of you. I didn't want anyone to attack my husband. I did hope people would be a little more sympathetic in the way they dispensed advice, though. Like instead of, "you have to STOP!", say something like "it's really hard to deal with being the recipient of angry outbursts, but you can do your part to prevent them by _____". And mostly I just wanted to know what to do when presented with an ultimatum.
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Before this thread gets locked.
Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. When your email question is chosen to be answered on the radio show, you will be notified by email directing you to listen to the rebroadcast. If you would like to consider being a caller, include your telephone number. You will be called by us to explain the procedure to you. Every caller will receive a complementary book by Dr. Harley that addresses their question.
FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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I encourage you to reread this thread, count how many times you re-state the same point.
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Also, we have used these principles to build amazing marriages.
I always get the impression people first come here to get help straightening out there spouse. Then they are shocked when we focus on their behavior first. Here is why: you can only control you. It is useless to try to fix the behavior of the person not here. You should learn to implement MB yourself. If he then refuses to join you in building a great marriage, there is a plan for that as well.
You should not try to educate your husband on MB. If he wants to learn, he can come here. Yes, I get all that. But I still feel like I was being attacked, first by my husband, then by most of you. I didn't want anyone to attack my husband. I did hope people would be a little more sympathetic in the way they dispensed advice, though. Like instead of, "you have to STOP!", say something like "it's really hard to deal with being the recipient of angry outbursts, but you can do your part to prevent them by _____". And mostly I just wanted to know what to do when presented with an ultimatum. Now you're telling posters how to post? Do you see the common denominator??
FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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Stop. Reread the thread. Count restatement. Consider that you can be wrong as well as your H.
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Also, we have used these principles to build amazing marriages.
I always get the impression people first come here to get help straightening out there spouse. Then they are shocked when we focus on their behavior first. Here is why: you can only control you. It is useless to try to fix the behavior of the person not here. You should learn to implement MB yourself. If he then refuses to join you in building a great marriage, there is a plan for that as well.
You should not try to educate your husband on MB. If he wants to learn, he can come here. Yes, I get all that. But I still feel like I was being attacked, first by my husband, then by most of you. I didn't want anyone to attack my husband. I did hope people would be a little more sympathetic in the way they dispensed advice, though. Like instead of, "you have to STOP!", say something like "it's really hard to deal with being the recipient of angry outbursts, but you can do your part to prevent them by _____". And mostly I just wanted to know what to do when presented with an ultimatum. No, you don't get it because you keep telling us what to think.
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Denali, I'm sorry, I thought this forum was for advice about solving marital problems using the MB concepts. Should I be on a different forum? I don't have any more questions about the concepts, but I don't feel like my problem has been resolved yet. Thanks.
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We are locking this thread because this is not productive. If you change your mind and want help with the program, email me and I will consider unlocking it.
MBDenali@gmail.com
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