I couldn't get on the forum earlier because my connection was down, so this is almost identical to what I mailed to some of you.<P>Got a call from my wife. I thought it was <son> calling me back so I answered. She wanted to know if I've taken the steps to take her off the mortgage as per our separation agreement.<P>Me: No, you haven't given me your half of the cost.<P>Her: You haven't told me how much it is.<P>Me: I told you last August that it would cost you at least $500.<P>Her: I've asked you many times when were you going to do it.<P>Me: You haven't given me your half of the cost.<P>Her: If you don't do this we can't have an uncontested divorce and it'll cost us $7500 each for a contested divorce. Is that what you want? Wouldn't you rather spend that money on <son>?<P>Me: You know what I want.<P>Her: I am filing for divorce.<P>Me: I understand, go right ahead. You know that I think there's a better way.<P>Her: If it's contested it'll cost...........<P>I hung up on her.<P>I have prepared the following e-mail, but I haven't sent it yet:<BR>**********************<BR>I apologize for hanging up on you, I feel very hurt when Divorce is discussed. I understand you are not trying to cause me pain, but painful it is. <P>You must not remember that I informed you last August that it would cost you at least $500 to get you off the mortgage. I am prepared to do this and I have had the paperwork since<BR>last August, but I will not incur the cost without your money up front. This is money I'd rather spend on a new house for our family.<P>Please know that the cost may have changed and that I now have debt on the line of credit because you have not paid me for other expenses. All other non-discretionary expenses must be settled first. The line of credit will probably complicate things. <P>You know that I do not want a divorce. I see it as the last option rather than the first.<P>Because you are determined that Divorce is your only solution, I will reluctantly consider a uncontested divorce under terms different from the separation agreement. If we come to a mutual agreement, either on our own or through a mediator, we can avoid substantial legal expenses.<P>You also need to be thinking about how you're going to explain this to <son>. This is solely your doing and responsibility, so please don't expect me to help you erect a facade to help you.<P>I still love you and I know there is a better way.<P>Love Always,<BR>Dave<P>***************************<BR>My intention is to offer to go along with the divorce IF she makes a number of financial concessesions given the fact that she has done nothing to explore reconciliation. I will not include a custody battle in this deal.<P>Simply put, she has to buy the divorce from me. She has refused all counseling and still denies an affair.<P>She seems to be in a HUGE hurry, as if she's got plans already made for other things. I doubt she can afford much of anything, including $7500 for the divorce. I don't know where she got this figure.<P>Thanks,<BR>Dave

I'm sorry for you Dave. I can't really say much more than that. Your situation sucks. I have read each up your updates hoping against hope that you would get some good news from your W for a change. That hasn't happened and it saddens me.<P> WTF do they think? I honestly do not know how you have done it for such a long time. Your posts generally encourage me to keep working on myself. To try a little harder in the hope that my own W will re-commit fully to the marriage.<P> I wanted you to know that I think you are/have handled yourself as I would like to handle my situation. <P> I am sorry.<P> jdmac1<P>

sounds ok dave, but the conversation of the phone was a tad confrontational, the repeat of "you haven't given me... may have worked better if you said stuff you mentioned in email, that you have paperwork and are ready to proceed, is she able to pay her half now...blah blah blah.<P>I know I been a little hard on you dave, and I don't really know how to factor in the death of your other child. I do know from reading about such things, this is a huge marital stress in itself, and often marriages do not recover. But it ain't over till it's over, even after divorce in some cases. I just encourage you to do the best you can about you, and let your wife come or go as she sees fit. I know how hard that is, I hope she eventually chooses you. Good luck.

Dear WAT,<BR>I was not able to keep up on your story while I was gone, last I remember was that bad letter from the lawyer pointing finger.<P>I really feel bad for you, wish she could come out of the fog. You say she won't admit to A, do you have proof anyway? You remember all the talk about custody issues? <P>I remember paying $5000 for my first divorce - and we did not have kids. He kept breaking in storage unit at townhouse, and $$ went to restraining orders, and conferences with lawyers. I paid $50/mo until it was finally paid off - in 1989, separation was in 1985, d in 1986. We only had our jobs and ourself. <P>Is there any way your lawyer can help with counseling issue? Lawyers are definately the pros here. <P>I've been thinking about you, and will pray - I know this is agonizing for you. lv, aftershock

Dave.<P>Sorry.

WAT wanted me to thank everyone for the responses. His Web access is down right now, but he'll be on a bit later to respond.<P>Please say prayers for him.<P>Jo

WAT,<P>Just wanted to let you know I'm sorry. You sent me some wonderful messages one day when I really needed someone to listen. I think the e-mail sounded fine. I wish you all the best.

WAT<P>My heart really goes out to you. The only thing I didn't do was cry when I read your post. Seems you have been trying so hard to make this marriage work, but somehow your W seems determined that she needs out.<P>What really touched me is that you constantly remind her that you love her and that you were willing to take her back. Most men drive away wives who have cheated, and I applaud all your efforts.<P>At least you'll know that you really tried. But now I'm concerned for your son. Please try to be there for him as much as possible for this time that he is about to go through.<P>My thoughts and prayers are with you.<P>Love<P>------------------<BR>CPL

Dave,<P>My D cost me a total of $450.00, and my H spent approx $400.00. Initially, I gave my attorney a $2000.00 retainer. He reimbursed me the credit after all was said and done. <P>It was a slam dunk for us because we had no children and my H didn't want any assets with the exception of personnal belongings. I attribute his generosity to a HUGE guilt factor. My attorney told me to move on it within the first year, because after that the guilt starts to wain and OW could be at the helm.<P>I was still so emotionally attached to my H, I couldn't bring myself to make motions to expedite the D. But as fate would have it, my simple phone call to my attorney one day to check on status got the ball rolling again. If I wouldn't have made that call, we wouldn't be D until Dec this year. <P>The Final papers say "Irretrievably Broken Marriage", I wished it would have said "Irretrievably Stubborn Husband".<P>When I interviewed a few (4 others) attorneys they asked me for approx $6K as a retainer. It was very difficult finding an attorney that would take a smaller retainer. So, perhaps your wife has been quoted the $7,500 by an attorney or attorneys as their retainer. Just a thought.<P>You never know what can happen. Divorce is a very emotionally charged experience for both parties. Just stay focused on being in Plan B, by that I mean take care of yourself and don't let what your wife says make you crazy. I know how tired you are. <P>We're all here when you need to talk.<P>Jo<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited August 21, 2001).]

((((wat))))<P>I don't have any advice, but wanted to make sure you knew I wasn't avoiding you this time. <P>I admire you for being so strong through all this. It's not over yet, and you are handling it great.<P>sending prayers....

Worthatry, I'm sorry to jump in on your thread not knowing your whole story. I am pretty sure that most of us paraphrase the things we have said to our spouse when we post here. So I'm assuming here (uh oh) that you gave us pretty much what was said. The thing that struck me about the conversation you had with your wife was that you both just went round and round.<P>"Me: No, you haven't given me your half of the cost.<BR>Her: You haven't told me how much it is.<BR>Me: I told you last August that it would cost you at least $500.<BR>Her: I've asked you many times when were you going to do it.<BR>Me: You haven't given me your half of the cost."<P>From having these same kinds of conversations with my husband all the time, I have learned that I can only expect a positive (meaning actual) response if I give clear concise information. You said she hadn't given you the money. true. She said you haven't told me how much. Here is where the problem starts for me. You feel you did tell her. She is (unless she justs wants to be a Pita) sure that you haven't given her an actual amount. At least/about/around isn't an amount. What I think she's looking for is that you went and got a (written?) estimate that she can verify. She seems to want a real number and a timeframe. JMHO<P>I think your email is great, and I applaud the efforts you are making to stay civilat all times even though your W if driving you up the tallest tree on the tallest mountain in the world. I wish you the best of luck.<P>------------------<BR>When we walk to the edge of all the light we have, and take that step into the darkness of the unknown, we must believe that one of two things will happen - there will be something there for us to stand on, or God will teach us how to fly.

You sure called this "shot" correctly. Damned if she didn't do exactly as you expected. She is very relentless insofar as wanting a divorce. Sounds as though she'll exhaust every means to get what she's after. You, on the other hand, are adamantly opposed to a divorce. Therefore, stall where,when and if you can. Perhaps the gained time will strain her efforts and the fog.<P>Best of luck to you, Dave! <P>------------------<BR><B>Time heals all wounds as long as you DON'T pick at them!</B>

Thanks all, very, very, much. Special thanks to hurtinginil, Rick37, tootrusting, and SKM for responding via e-mail when my net connection was "waffling." Very, very special thanks to Jo for helping so much.<P>I couldn't get into "see" Steve right away because Laurie and Marian only work till noon in the summer, so I'll try first thing in the morning.<P>I haven't sent any messages to my wife. My attorney hasn't returned my calls. But Taz made some good dinner and I got the grass cut.<P>I do my best thinking when I'm cutting the grass.<P>I plan to concede the divorce if it's on my terms. To do otherwise will just delay the inevitable and I'll likely not gain financially. For obvious reasons, I'll not reveal here any strategy until it's done. <P>It's amazing to me how conflicted the aggressively delusional can become. How can a Mother who lost one child not see the potential damage being done to another? If I was a monster and totally recalcitrant throughout counseling, maybe I could understand. But I'm not and I haven't been.<P>I wonder how many marriages dissolve with no counseling whatsoever? I can only conclude that my wife is terrified of being examined, or is totally and completely devoid of any rational thought. The specter of two destroyed families and complete loss of integrity must cause bizarre contortions in the mind. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.<P>Thanks again for all the support. I am determined to exit this ordeal with class and with my integrity intact. One more time: I want to help my wife overcome her demons and heal. Even if it means the final end of our marriage, I will not abandon her and I will always love her as the Mother of our boys. I made a promise to my deceased son to take care of his brother and his Mommy. I will not disappoint him.<P>Love to all,<BR>Dave<p>[This message has been edited by worthatry (edited August 21, 2001).]

Dave,<P>I felt uneasy reading your post. I understand exactly what you are saying about your son. I think your email is good. I am holding out hope that OM will get sick of the whole deal and bail, leaving your wife to deal with the mess she has helped create.<P>take care,<BR>cleo<P>btw - 7500 is not unheard of for a D. It's crazy isn't it?

cleo - what made you feel uneasy?<P>No way will OM bail. His wife is an obesse underachiever. My wife is a beautiful career woman - this strokes his ego. He has already chucked it all, including his kids. He's WAY beyond the point of no return. I imagine he's calling the shots in LaLaLand. <P>Should I thank him for taking over before this stubborn perfectionist goes thru menopause? Sorry, I know that's childish.<P>Back to the ball game.<P>Dave

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Dave}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}<P>This stuff really sucks rocks, doesn't it?<P>Sorry I can't give you a more 'supportive' response, but I am not feeling particularly positive at the moment. And I'm truly sorry that you are having to deal with this.<BR><P>------------------<BR>terri<BR><B>Courage</B><P>Whatever course you decide upon,<BR>there is always someone to tell you<BR>that you are wrong.<P>There are always difficulties arising<BR>which tempt you to believe that your <BR>critics are right.<P>To map out a course of action <BR>and follow it to an end <BR>requires courage.<P><I>Ralph Waldo Emerson</I>

Sorry Dave! I didn't mean to alarm you. I just felt really bad knowing everything that your family has gone through and her insistence on the D. I really really hope that something gives.<P>BTW - what do you think is worse? menopause or pms? that's a tough call....

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by worthatry:<BR><B>His wife is an obesse underachiever. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Duh..........DAVE??!!!!??! Be nice I don't picture you as being a critical judge of another's assets or lack thereof.<P><P>------------------<BR><B>Time heals all wounds as long as you DON'T pick at them!</B>

Oh, WAT,<P>I have seen yoiu go thru so much with your W. I am so sorry I haven't posted more to you. Let her go, sweetie. She will do as she pleases, and you have done all you can.<P><BR>Again, I am sorry. <P>Khyra<BR> PS you DESERVE BETTER!!!!

Dave,<P>I'm sorry that it has come to this. I don't know what else to say except that you're a terrific guy, and one way or another I'm sure that better days are ahead for you.<P>Steve