Waiting2 --<BR><<<<How does your H view telling everyone now? Does he regret it? Does he have to defend you to his family? Really sad that a grandmother would separate from her grandkids over that.<P>I see this happening in my future too. I won't be around old friends and family anymore. I don't think anyone will reject my kids. >>>>><P>Lex, As far as I can tell H does not regret this and still thinks that he was/is justified in telling everyone (did I mention that he went into the gory details?) <BR>As for the grandmother's relationship with the kids, she won't call the house phone so she won't have to risk talking with me. My H does call the children to his private phone sometimes and also passes along messages to them. They do spend time with his family on vacation, which I didn't go on.. for obvious reasons. (Really couldn't endure the looks and smart remarks for a week. MIL says whatever comes to mind with no regards to other's feelings.)<BR>As far as I know H doesn't defend me to his family, I think that I am just not discussed anymore. Chats are confined to work and the kids, current events, and what the family is doing/has planned. <BR>I do know that his mother believes that staying together for the kids is important... I don't know if she feels that having a solid relationship is even important. <P>As I sit here trying to decide what the rest of my life will be like, thinking about the past 2+ yrs of "recovery", this is one of the 2-3 things that H has done that I feel unrecoverable. I can't imagine staying with a person that I can't have a family relationship with. Separate vacations for the rest of our marriage? Being judged and scorned.. i'm not putting myself in that position. <P>If it were emotional support that he needed, H could have simply said.. "W & I are having marital problems, I need you, as my family, to help me get thru this"... without the blame and details. After 2+ years of this, I've had to make some explanation to only my parents for some things and merely said that we were having some problems. I didn't feel the need to air all the dirty laundery and embarass him for his behavior, choice of priorities, his emotional abuse and threats of physical abuse, or his unfulfilling sexual performance. I left him with all dignity intact. <P>We have given up such good friends and I miss those times together with them. Now we have to start fresh and make all new friends and neither of us are in the mood to do that at this time. <P>He says he wanted and needed their support... it seems more that he really wanted revenge and to cause humiliation. <BR>I guess we can always make new friends.. but we can't exactly get a new family... tough problem.. can't think of a way to get over that.<P>

Hello W2E & Lex, You just helped to make up my mind as to how to "announce" our separation. Although most people will wonder if there is someone else (when my H first told me he was questioning his feelings for me, it was at that time that I became investigative because I knew my real H would have never left our marriage. I searched and didn't let up until I found the cell phone bill six months ago), I will help him. I will tell no one of the A. If they wonder, they wonder. However, I did tell one of my very close friends about the affair when I first found out not because I was thrashing him but because I needed someone to talk to...looking back, was it wrong? I'm not sure. Will if affect our friendships going forward? If they are good friends and our marriage survives, we'll be okay, right?

<<<<However, I did tell one of my very close friends about the affair when I first found out not because I was thrashing him but because I needed someone to talk to...looking back, was it wrong? I'm not sure. Will if affect our friendships going forward? If they are good friends and our marriage survives, we'll be okay, right?>>>><P><BR>What's done is done, if you had to talk with someone other than a counselor or clergy that would hold it private, of course one would turn to their best girl friend. Hopefully she is trustworthy and never tells secrets or spreads rumors. Will it affect your friendship? If she is your best friend, then you will probably remain best friends. If it's a mutual couples friendship thing then it's hard to tell. I've seen "friends" suddenly decide that they don't want their spouse hanging out with the guy or girl that is "having marriage problems" perhaps because they fear it will be like a disease that might creep into their marriage. I've also seen mutual friendships become more polar.. where the guy hangs with the guy, the woman with the woman and they don't do the couple thing anymore.. probably because they feel uncomfortable with the situation and don't know what to say.. it's awkward for friends. Or you might all be able to bury it all and move forward and this will all be water under the bridge in a couple years.<P>Terrified.. you write "if ... our marriage survives..."<BR>If you think there is the slightest chance of this happening.. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE be very selective in what you reveal, if anything, because as you can see, it can be highly damaging.<BR>As i said, there are only 2-3 things that I think are unrecoverable and this is one. <BR>The humiliation of it can literally force H into feeling he has no other choice but to separate and avoid all who know. And being that his OP is the one person on earth that will be a safe haven and understanding, she would be the likely person he would turn to for comfort.<BR>

Dear W2E, Just to let you know, I just called my H and reassured me that my intention is never to destroy him or his reputation. I didn't go out and tell the world what an A**H*** he was a year ago when he told me he wasn't sure of his feelings. I didn't throw him out and tell the world when I found out about his A. Instead, I blamed myself and begged him to stay. Believe me, I so want my marriage back and him.

W2E --<BR>You're also confirming to me what I expect down the road.<BR>Its only been a week, and already his sister is very very different with me.<P>I helped and counseled her through a time when she was having an EA with a friend of her husbands. Now its a whole different story.<P>I also think this is unrecoverable. It was one of the things that has solidified my decision to divorce.<P>GL terrified -- at least you got some forewarning on how a WS may feel about this. I'm sure BS's may give you different advice. I know you need support too.

Isn't this post specifically about Terrified telling her SIL that they (Terrified and H) were seperating. I mean, logistically speaking, people (relatives incl.) are going to find out. How will they not.<P>Won't relatives and friends eventually do things like call the house or come over and ASK .... "Hey, where is Mr. Terrified?"<P>Knowing Harley recommends not telling people about the "AFFAIR", which I understand and advocate, I don't see how telling people that her H is moving out is wrong.<P>I know that the WS decides what is an LB, yet I really feel in this instance it can't be helped.<P><BR>What is she supposed to do, LIE? <P>Jo<p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited September 28, 2001).]

HI All,<BR>Who advocated lying?! Not I.<BR>The initial issue was h was angry that wife told about moving out. If terrified told, then it is done. Point being that there are many ways to handle situations, and this can be an insightful lesson while repairing the marriage. <BR>It was/is a lovebuster. We need to learn the LBs so they are not repeated. <BR>These issues have come up here many times in the past. <BR>And yes, I can see why he was angry. I understand your need for support, and childcare assistance, but perhaps there was a more delicate way to handle things. Harley and other 'cousnelors' do rec not sharing marital difficulties or affair details, and there are good reasons for it a few yrs ddown the line.<BR>K, Chris, Fighter, etc, care to comment?<BR>Aloha, cl<p>[This message has been edited by cl (edited September 28, 2001).]

Okay, I appreciate all of your responses but you have me very worried. I told my SIL that he was moving out because I have a 2-year old who needs stability and support during this very difficult transition. My in-laws care for my daughter two days a week. They are going to need SO MUCH help with this. My SIL, who has a 3-year old and a very SOLID marriage, will be the stabilizing force for them and ultimately, my daughter. My SIL needs to prepare herself so that she can be ready for them. <P>Also, my SIL was planning two family Christmas parties and wanted me to be on the planning committee. It just made me break down and tell her that her brother and I are having problems. <P>My H keeps telling me to DEAL WITH IT...he's leaving...won't people learn that he's gone? Shouldn't people know that he's gone??? <P>I don't want to ruin my chances for recovery at all but most of you are telling me that I'm reducing my chances...I feel like I really screwed up big!<P><BR>

HI terrified,<BR>cannot leave you worrying all night long! <BR>No, don't lose any leep over it, don't get upset. You have enough upset to deal with in your daily life. Take this as a lesson. We have them daily! Use them to your advantage.<BR>Some of us that have been there try to share our own lessons and experiences so others can learn and grow from them.<BR>I tend to be short on words-I state the points and not a lot of fluff. Don't mistake that for being curt. <BR>Others may be able to explain things in a way you can better relate to than me! That is why we are all here-for differnt points of view, for support, to share the learning and healing. Rarely should anything be interpreted as malicious....though lately I have to wonder. <BR>Not to worry. Take the lesson and move forward. <BR>I would suggest you let h take care of the proper notifications to family. Let him shoulder the responsibility. Your counselor did a great job of sharing the reasons with you. When you are tempted to say something to family, take a step back, slow down and try to feel what he would feel. By doing this you are not hiding, you are not being ashamed. You are actually encouraging him to be responsible for his actions. An improtant step in acknowledging and healing. You might consider apologizing to him for the LB.<BR>I understand the others point of view, and respect them. Part of the idea of MB is to support but not blindly. It is good to hear other points of view and open out minds.<BR>Believe me, we all do LBs, we all make lots of mistakes. Hey, it is not like this is something we have done before! Thank goodness.<BR>Now get a good nights rest. Your 2 yr old will be bouncing around bright and early and you need to be ready.<BR>Aloha, cl<P><p>[This message has been edited by cl (edited September 29, 2001).]

Hi cl, I waited for awhile to hear from someone but signed off too early!! Thanks for thinking of me and posting. I will apologize for telling my SIL and I think you're right, I'll leave the rest up to him. I just pray that this is not irreparable.<P>Thanks again and lots of HUGSSS

Hi there,<P>The previous poster suggested you leave the telling to H as far as his family was concerned. My H had been GONE for a month and still hadn't told his parents. And so my son accidentally let it out, and he felt bad, and I felt angry that an 8 year old had to deliver the news.<P>So don't be surprised that when you leave it to your H he doesn't tell anyone ANYWAY!!! My H just left it all to me to do the telling, but I didn't tell any of his friends and family, and when we discuss it, all I say is that I think it's a midlife thing. I HAVE told two CLOSE friends the whole thing though; and these are friends who have been mine from an early age, and if they do hate his guts after this, well, they love me, that's why.<P>Why is he so upset at you? Why doesn't my H tell anyone? The fog..or something, refusal to accept responsibility for actions, etc.

T-<BR>First of all you did right by telling your SIL. You number one concern is for your D, and that should be your H number one concern also. I know I am not up on the Marriage B stuff<BR>My H is just not around (workaholic), But my first H had A for 2 years.<BR>Well your last post about the parties got me thinking, this is where I am the Queen. (first H a high level EXEC) and of course now the DR Wife. I throw the parties!!!! and have a ball at it. Here is my suggestion...GET BUSY, you are going to have alot of time on your hands, move forward (not on, I know you want your marriage). Ask SIL to be on BOTH party planning, YOU ARE and have been part of the family for a VERY long time. Be super and gracious...VERY GRACIOUS.<BR>Smile, dont complain about WS, dont sing your woes to any of them, Trust me my H has 6 sibs and I too have a large family...everyone will know whats up..BUT they will see a kind Gracious hard working lovely mother, and then a Bitter WS,...THEY will start to work on him, they will start to make him SEE what he throwing away (see it will not be coming from you), Make the holidays PERFECT...decorate for Thanksgiving, and Xmas more then you ever have (plus at age 2 your daughter WILL LOVE IT!!!!)..stop thinking about how you will NOT survive when he leaves..start thinking about how you are going to LIVE, make plans (like I stated above), I believe he just needs breathing room, he has convinced himself that this is the best thing, but when he sees you smiling, and being Gracious, and being that perfect mother to that perfect child. He will not be able to divorce NO WAY-- NO HOW. No OW will stand a chance, it does not matter how good the sex is...SEX is over in an hour at best...too bad for OW that there are 24 hours in a day..that is were YOU come in. When the others in the family see how wonderful you are through this (and this party stuff is the perfect way), Your H will not stand a chance either. The right thing will be staring him in the face!!!!

Hi Terrified,<P>Boy, I know how you struggle, believe me. It's the old conflict for the BS of "Boundaries, Support ... or is it an LB?".<P>Example:<BR>In my situation I was faced with having to decide whether or not to file an AHO on the OW for harassment. I knew in my H's eyes this was an LB, but after warning OW several times and her continuing to harass, I was forced (after mos of calls) to set a boundary and file a AHO. <P>Our shrink helped me try and explain to my H what the OW was doing was unacceptable and he shouldn't be upset with me for setting a boundary. He "SAID" he was in full support of me protecting my sanity, however, he still had underlying feelings that poor OW was going to suffer from my legal actions. <P>I do not regret setting that boundary. I did not create the environment in which I was placed where a stranger felt it warranted and justified to verbally attack me, so in order to get the "support" I needed by setting a boundary, I protected myself and in turn gained some self esteem back.<P>I believe that we do our best to NOT LB our WS's, however I tend to think we need to allow ourselves the boundaries and support necessary to keep our dignity and maintain our integrity as human beings.<P>I guess it all comes down to our motives, and how we initiate that "boundary". Whenever you find yourself questioning whether or not your H will perceive somethng you feel you need to do (a boundary) as an LB, perhaps ask yourself what your motives are. That may help you make the decision to go foward or not.<P>I hope I've helped you in some way, Terrified. This is such a tough situation, honey. Unfortunetly, we've all been there and back again.<P>Very Best,<BR>Jo

Morning Terrified,<BR>Agree with Jo, we have to have boudaries, and we need to let the spouse know where they are. Plan a does not mean being a doormat or taking abuse!!! <BR>(Many people here that have been successful at recovery are anything but doormats.)<BR>You will also see that your boudaries will change as the process moves forward. Share the changes. Be aware of how you communicate. cl<P>

Thanks to everyone for posting your thoughts. I need all of you so much this weekend. My H has been busy cleaning his apartment so it's been SO difficult...I've remained upbeat and cheerful However, when he's not at home, I feel very much alone. We are such a busy, active and very social couple. I will miss that because the truth is, it really is a couple's world. All my friendships will change because I'll be the single one with a "kid". <P>How do all of you deal with this?

Terrified..<P>Your hurt, angry and confused right now, all understandable emotions..and yes, you need support, I honestly don't see whats wrong w/ telling your family that your having problems and are seperating..you don't need to give details (unless you want to, it's your life you can share what you want to with them) alot of people here spout total honesty in relationships and I feel you have a relationship w/ your family as well..and Dr. Harley says to be honest as well, but you can be honest w/ out giving details--but you do need support..that way in case you do get divorced it won't come as an absolute shock to everyone and they can be there emotionally for you..<P>If your h gets angry that you tell others your having problems and he moved out..oh well thats not Your fault..he should take responsibility for his actions and admit what he's done..you can't prevent him from being angry...you need to work on yourself to be the best mom and the best you-you can be..get yourself to a counselor so they can help you work through some of these things...

Dear TR, Thanks for your reply...made me think that if he doesn't want ANYONE to know, as Lex suggested, may be a very good thing. His refusal to tell people about separation and his "new place" suggests that maybe he's not certain about the way he will feel once he's there for awhile. <P>Suggests uncertainty on the entire front...if he was so sure, wouldn't he be announcing this to everyone and not want me to pretend everything is OK???

The latest update...H came home last night after cleaning is appt and reminded me that "I better not have told ANYONE about this!!" <P>Sure..no one.

Is he moving today, terrified?<P>Oh, I know what it feels like to live there knowing they will go on a certain date...<P>You will need to come here and be with us.<P>please make sure you do.<P>Love and light and lots of strength going your way,<P>Jacky

Hi NToo, Thanks for your kind words. It's a sad day.