I have to say, there have been many responses that I have read from many different posters, their attitudes and sense of humor, you cannot help but laugh, Pepper, you are one of them.

Bravo Rosie! Excellent points.

still mouldering along huh, ok, another thought has occured to me. The purpose of this site is marriage building, the tool is behaviour modification This implies those who practive MB techniques acknowledge you are how you behave, and behaviour is a choice. (well unless one is a hypocrit, and isn't really buying in, but that doesn't count). Assuming many folks here claim to be Christians, and perforce will exemplify Christian behaviour, it is not only reasonable, but required,they not trash anyone (op included), at least not on purpose (human frailities allowed I suppose, anger etc.). Certainly defending trashing the op as a "good" (or ok) behaviour, makes no sense, that is unless one is "practicing" (behaviour modification) to be an unforgiving, judgemental Christian. Surely a contradiction of sorts.

But maybe I am missing something in this debate. If one is trying to "behave" like a Christian, it counts less when it is easy, the real trick is to "behave" like a Chrtistian when you don't want too. So the argument against gratuitious trashing of op's, is not for the op's benefit, but for the one doing the trashing, same argument re love busting. Behviour modification either works all the time, or none of the time, which is it?

btw this in no way means one cannot take any and all necessary measures to protect themself from predatory op, (or abusive spouses, or anyone who threatens your [or kids] well being).

<small>[ January 15, 2003, 08:22 PM: Message edited by: LurkingAbout ]</small>

By what standard would one NOT trash sordid, despicable behavior? That is not a Marriage Builders standard and most certainly NOT a Christian standard.

Was Jesus Christ being "unChristian," in your opinion, when he trashed people?

Lurkingabout, you said: "The purpose of this site is marriage building "

Yesssss..... and that's what you're doing here.... right?

In the spirit of radical honesty... Pepper <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hi,
Stopping in and need a quick recap.....

Blue is the _WS/BS/OP or other?_.
Blue's current stance is: ______________

Don't have time to read the entire thread, just wanted the current bottom line.

RH.... U R too funny!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Thanks,
L.

Orhid, Blue claims to be BS but has dropped by for the sole purpose of lecturing all we naughty BS' for having the audicity and poor taste to criticize the OP. She is concerned that this practice is making us "look bad." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<small>[ March 04, 2004, 11:31 PM: Message edited by: A whole new me ]</small>

LOL Oh boy! If we were all so perfect, why are we here at all? Christians arent' perfect or saints! They have feelings, and so do all other religious/religions!
At least honesty is saying what you feel! Why lie and pretend here to be something we're not?
If I let out a vent, trash OW or anything that is upsetting, why is it taken as personal by anyone? At least I'm honest enough to say it and not try to make anyone here think I'm something I'm not! Just human!
I think everyone who comes into the site should be allowed to be open and honest about themselves and their feelings. Behavior modification starts with first recognizing where you need it. Perhaps it is needed to get the bitterness, anger and other feelings out to clear the air and then start to reaccess the situation.
I see so many taking this way too seriously instead of just allowing each one to have their say.
Strength? hey, nobody here knows what strengths I have or weaknesses. Many of us have much strength or we wouldn't even be here, or trying to find answers. We'd just chuck in the towel and take the easy way out! Divorce and go on their merry way! That anyone comes here, and vents or offers good advice, is a strength in itself. All are taking the risk of being judged or put down or berated.
The bottom line is no one knows who you really are. So do not allow any opinion of you to cause more suffering. They can say what they wish, but you don't have to believe it! I think most are just here to find answers, and along the way to let off some steam, very much needed by most!
I vent! I also will respond to someone if they're the OW, maybe even OM, and I might tell them off too!
They don't have to read it, they can go on to another post! It's just like writing in a diary or journal and letting all your feelings out. Some good, some bad. I haven't met a saint yet, nor do I expect to on this earth!
Everyone just try to not take it all personally if someone is asking or venting. Extend the privilege to all!
LouLou

not talking about trashing behaviour ( that is ok by me), but about trashing people, that is certainly a Chrtistian topic (and all about bnehavioural choices). Anyways, I am not trying to convince anyone, (that is a lost cause), just pointing out potential doublestandards in the logic being presented.

yes pepper that is why I am here. And like each person here, I need to find my own path, not always easy to do, sometimes confusing, sometimes others have conflicting needs, agendas. Personally I find these kinds of discussions valuable sometimes, even if they seem pointless. It is even more confusing when you start mixing religion in with behaviour it seems.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by My favorite color-BLUE:
<strong>
[b]

Well, not to be critical or judgmental or anything like that but, the point I was trying to get across on this thread is that, IN MY OPINION, when you bad mouth the OW and describe her to be this great big fat disgusting person it makes you look bad.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></strong>

But that is simply your opinion and not necessarily that of others. I suspect that you probably DO worry too much about what others think and are trying to ascribe that immature trait to others here. Just remember, it is a sign of immaturity to be overly concerned with the opinions of others. I think just like Rosie stated, that you are worry way too much about what others think.

I sort of think the folks here aren't as concerned about that as you are, so this is really *YOUR* issue and not theirs. I sort of doubt that any BS on this board is concerned in the least how they look to you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Then I thought "Sourgrapes," it's not that the OW is really that fat and disgusting, well, as far as her physical appearance is concerned but, that you needed to feel better about yourself. Whether it be venting or not IN MY OPINION, it still makes you look bad. Think about it you said your H left you for a great big fat disgusting OW.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Unfortunately, it often is simply a stated FACT, especially the disgusting part. Just remember, we are talking about a woman here who can't get her own man but has to take someone elses. She can't have too much going for her. That is just radical honesty.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
RH
Yes, I know the answers to your questions but, I'm not answering them, why should I???

As far as I'm concerned, you can think whatever you want I'm not here to answer to you or to anyone else for that matter.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Aw, c'mon, prove us all wrong and answer the questions. You're a big girl, you can do it. It won't hurt anything and will only establish some much needed credibility.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is a matter of fact I didn't know that passing a test was a requirement for getting on this board and if it was why then why didn't they give it to me when I registered?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Methinks the lady doth protest too much. Its just a few simple questions to establish your credibility. Surely you want an opportunity to establish your credibility?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is a matter of fact, I think it's silly that everyone has given so much attention to this post when there are other people on this board who really need help.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is that your judgement? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<small>[ January 15, 2003, 09:36 PM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LurkingAbout:
<strong>not talking about trashing behaviour ( that is ok by me), but about trashing people, that is certainly a Chrtistian topic (and all about bnehavioural choices). Anyways, I am not trying to convince anyone, (that is a lost cause), just pointing out potential doublestandards in the logic being presented.

It is even more confusing when you start mixing religion in with behaviour it seems.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">LurkingAbout, then why did you mix religion into it and presume to tell folks how a Christian should act?

And I would ask again, was Jesus acting "unChristian" when he trashed people?

Originally posted by My favorite color-BLUE:
<strong>B: .....RH,

Yes, I know the answers to your questions but, I'm not answering them, why should I???</strong>

L: jmho, because interaction with another may help our viewpoint?

<strong>B:As far as I'm concerned, you can think whatever you want I'm not here to answer to you or to anyone else for that matter.</strong>

L: Ok, so why are you here?

<strong>B: If you think that you can bully me into going away think again, I'm not going anywhere. I have as much right to be here as anyone else and I think it's ridiculous that I should have to pass some test just to prove something to you.</strong>

L: No bullying needed. You stated that you are 'not going anywhere'. So you are happy where you are right now?

<strong>B: Is a matter of fact I didn't know that passing a test was a requirement for getting on this board and if it was why then why didn't they give it to me when I registered?</strong>

L: You missed the EN questionnaire? Sorry, we try to show this to everyone who visits here. Please go up to the concepts section and find it there. It will be very enlightening.

<strong>B: So go ahead, tell whom ever you think you need to tell I'm still going to come here, I'm still going to give my OPINIONS, whether you like them or not, Yes, I said opinions, not criticism, or judgment or anything else just opinions.</strong>

L: We don't need to tell anyone. You already did that. You know Blue, you sound very angry, why is that?

<strong>B:I know that everyone here is going through hard times but, that doesn't mean that everytime someone has a different opinion from theirs they should get so hostile, if that was the case then no one would ever voice their opinions, oh there goes that word again.</strong>

L: A correct statement. Free country, everyone has rights. Differing opinions are always offered here but not always with such hostility.

Is you interaction with others around your life similar to what is happening here?

<strong> B: till don't think that anything I have said here should have caused so much hostility, I just stated my opinion just like everyone who has replied to this post.</strong>

L: Hm..... that's your observation? Well I have been reading your thread off and on along with several other threads..... u don't see the hostility? Ok, what do you consider a hostile comment?

<strong>B: a matter of fact, I think it's silly that everyone has given so much attention to this post when there are other people on this board who really need help.</strong>

L: It could be, except that you are still posting and other are still responding. If you think others can use your help, please step out there and do so. It may be appreciated.

<strong>B: thanks to all for their time.</strong>

L: You are welcome.

Ok now Blue, I responded to your statement towards RH and which he is certainly capable of responding if he chooses. I choose to respond because you brought out some interesting points here yet I fail to see why you are here. Of course it is not right to demand answer so if you choose not to respond, I understand.

Just for the record, this is a marriage building site. Many who visit here have suffered great damages in their marriages and are trying very hard to save it or save themselves and their family's and move on. There is great pain here. Also there have been invasions of the ugliest kind that have tried to hurt many. Knowing this may help you understand why things are said here.

With that piece of info under your belt, I ask again, please state why you are here so we don't waste time on this thread but instead help make it a constructive one.

L.

<small>[ January 15, 2003, 09:35 PM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>

Hi Orchid, actually I was thinking seeking your help when I post my comment to MFCB, this one smell like PBR's type ... I know what a better match than my big sis <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ... I know my questionair will draw you out <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> . I don't post to MFCB no more until she or he put out her story too ... I am helping Jack55. Thanks -rh-

MFCB--
Just because a BS complains about the OP doesn't mean they are not "strong" as you CLAIM to be! That is just plain insulting. I do not truly believe that anyone here is interested in impressing anyone else on the board. I don't worry about "looking bad" to anyone, this is all anonymous! It is the one place, however, I can come where people truly understand my hurt and pain.

My FWH's OW honestly doesn't believe that she did anything wrong--it is all about what feels good and is best for HER. If my H had left me for her and my D had to spend time with her due to custody, of course I would instruct her to not misbehave etc. but I would never expect or obligate my child to respect someone who doesn't deserve it. Act civil, yes, but I want my D to have the values and morals that I have, not those of a woman who didn't mind having a hand in wrecking a M and taking her father away from her.

The people on this site hourly, daily etc. prove that you CAN make a M work, bring it back from the brink and make it happy and a positive in your life. That takes courage from both parties. It seems your H didn't believe that. You accepted the turn of events. Good for you. Self love is indeed important, but just because you don't "bash" the OW doesn't make you "better" or not "fit" some image someone has of a BS. To truly accept things, and actually forgive and let go, you MUST go through the emotions leading to that. The death of a M, or what you thought your M was before the A, is accepting a death and everyone goes through the stages. Looking good on the surface sometimes mean that your emotions go underground and will come out in some other way. Any "bashing" that I have ever seen here, and it has been incredibly minor has been done as a part of the recovery process of the BS--an honest release of emotion. Because someone says bad things about an OW's appearance has more to do with their processing the "whys" of the A than trying to make themselves feel better. And certainly in this process, the last thing anyone should be concerned about is what others think of them!

I am truly amazed at your superior attitude and your innocent act, I don't think you are trying to help anyone at all, just trying to make YOURSELF look better, all because you don't bash your H's OW.

<small>[ March 04, 2004, 11:32 PM: Message edited by: A whole new me ]</small>

Alright then, I have a question for all you wise MB'ers. Can I think the XOW in my case is despicable?

-She deliberatedly tried to break up my engagement to my XWS.
-She stupidly left a complete electronic diary telling her tales of skank-dorama, things like enjoying to lock my XWS outside (this way before I met him), through the night and call up her boyfriend on the side and laugh with him at my XWS outside. She also wrote about how almighty she fell when she would manipulate him to stay, pulling his strings, knowing he was a noble and faithful man. And don't get me started on how she'd make her "clients" or men who took her for dinner at a cheapo restaurant in exchange for sex leave bodily fluids in left over food with the hopes that my XWS would eat out of them and have a laugh out of it, then get incredibly upset that he wouldn't eat it.
-She had the delusion that my XWS was still her friend after 3 years of pleasant NC, did all kind of searching to find him, and made up a very lame excuse for the whole investigation. And she had the nerve to be bewildered and completely shocked that he firmly but politely, told her to "Never ever contact us again".

According to her all she ever did was for my XWS benefit, that she stopped calling so he'd get over her and be happy, when btw, we were MORE than happy to never hear from her and we even changed our home number and address, since the psycho had made a copy of the keys and would come in the house and plant the craziest things, like mutilated Happy Meal Toys, and pictures of herself, as if we wouldn't notice, the goof!!! She'd also make hang up calls all the friggin time, it drove us crazy!

Was I mad at my XWS for putting us in such position? YOU BET! He had and still has to plan A me like crazy for me to stay. I called him every name on the book and wouldn't even stand being near him for the longest time.

The difference though is the many things the OW did and how she stated my XWH was "Too good, too nice, too respectful" to throw her skanky bottom outside the door, and that that was incredibly funny and sooooo amusing. Well guess what? He met me, he grew a spine, he hated her, called her names, and now after closure he's reached the point in which he doesn't give a damn whether a truck runs her over or not, he thinks she is not even human, and I was horrified at first to learn that he wasn't alone on believing that, but that as a matter of fact her own sister, and people that have known her for the longest time detest her deeply too.

Sure some OW may have the fuzzy creamy filling inside, but some others, just as in general people, are rotten to the core, and their OW status just goes to join their degradation in the human status.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by My favorite color-BLUE:
<strong>[QUOTE]

The opinions of others doesn't really matter to me, I know who I am and what I want out of life.
MFC-B</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But your numerous posts tell us otherwise. You have talked about your "concerns" of the opinions of others in every post on this thread. You can't now claim that it doesn't matter to you.

I don't think anyone here is fooled about WHY you won't answer RedHat's easy questions, nor am I surprised. Your refusal to answer them has only underscored RedHat's point, I'm afraid.

Do you know how a thread like this that is out of hand gets stopped?

There are no more postings done on it!!!!!

Dawn <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Dawn,

There is another way ... FilliBuster ... posts anything else under the sun but about the main issue of this thread ... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> like this post <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

-rh-