Jazzy,

You need to realize that the current place of recovery you and your H are at is a coveted spot for many here. In other words, learn to appreciate it because as bad as the A was, it could be much worse for you.

Your H posts here and has made some comments which by views to outsiders, sound good. If it is accurate, this is good. If it is not, then the challenge will be to present a truthful picture and then work on recovery.

Do you and your H have the ability to have phone counseling sessions with a good MC, the Harley's or both? This may be helpful.

The BS goes through stages often posted here as stages of grief. If you find RedHat's sig line, he has a link to that thread from 2 years ago. It was real helpful to me. One of those stages included anger. Knowing those stages, is also helpful to healing.

Are you and your H spending those 15 hours or so per week together?

What is he doing to help make you feel safe? There will be triggers. For me the cell phone, e-mail, his face (he shaved his mustache of 20+ years), his work truck, his work (courier), etc. made trusting him real hard. See in the A, the WS tries real hard to be real sneaky. He might not be real good at it but he sure tried.

Working past those triggers are up to me. It is H's job to make me feel safe. Right now a look or a sigh let's him know when I don't feel safe. That's quite an improvement from 2 years ago when even deep sobs from our child and myself did not move him away from the A.

Hope this helps.
L.

Jaz, how are you doing?

L.

Jazzy: I feel you. Sometimes it just doesn't work. Sometimes we need time to try to heal without the daily trigger (WS) around. And let's face it they are the trigger. We imagine the worst and that coupled with our anger and other emotions is just too damned hard sometimes. You gotta breath. There is no timetable for this. And WS should not even attempt to put you on one. WS should be trying their best to give u what you need. They had their selfish time, now give it up!!! You are being honest, something that is foreign to WS and what u r saying is that u need time. Take it!!!
I have never been a Plan A type of gal. Some here can attest to that. I went straight to Plan B. And you know what it seems that no matter what Plan, WS does what they want and it still hurts. I felt like a doormat too. Getting WS out of the house was the only way for me to feel better about myself. Then I started thinking that this idiot has to live daily with what he did, he is suffering some deep stuff. Lost something so good and rare and it will never be the same. I keep that thought tucked away. It helps to ground me sometimes, other times I just need WS out of my face!!!. Take care. wu

Jazzy, this isn't a "win-lose" situation...you didn't "win" anything by being "chosen" except a really hard road ahead of you. So don't negate your right to be angry by thinking you're supposed to feel lucky. You aren't...you're supposed to feel exactly what you are feeling. Hurt and angry.

Things can and will get better...whether you remain together or not. Your hubby needs to quit feeling sorry for himself and show you some real compassion...show you he can be a husband and father and help you get through this. If you need time apart...then he needs to grant you that and not give you a hard time about it. You've gotten enough of that.

Take some deep breaths, try to get some sleep, and don't think you have to make any major decisions any time soon. You don't...you can let the pain subside before doing that.

So sorry for what you're going through <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Hang in there.

Hey: It's an unimaginable pain. I know for sure my WS has no idea the pain he inflicted on me. The thought that my life will forever be changed in this way. I hate it. My WS told me I should move on. Little did I know he had not. He was living the double life thing pretty good. I sometimes could not take my own mind with all I knew and thought I knew so I would just get up and leave. At times I thought I had lost my mind and wondered how I could go on with this person who would so willingly hurt me in this way and then say, "I love you." I can not see any love in that. That is confusing. You want to trust and love and have hopes and dreams again with that person but sometimes the cut is too deep. Not only was I stabbed and kicked and punched and spat upon but he allowed this OW to twist the knife, then to shoot me and laugh. He gave her the bullits. Jazzy, believe me I know where u are now. I am there. wu

Exactly: I found out a week after my mom died. The only reason I was able to be strong during her funeral is because I was under the belief that I had this wonderful man and my two beautiful daughters. I was lucky even in my dispair. Foolish me. A week later I got hit by his train moving and it just hasn't stopped. I have no respect for him. I feel he must have lost his mind somehow. Why would a sane person do this to someone they Love? God, what does that even mean in this context? Does that word (Love)really have a meaning when your spouse is stabbing you? I really had to examine my sanity. I mean maybe I am not built for this marriagebuilders stuff. Has it helped at all that you WS posts here too? wu

At least u say you want to love your FWS. I cannot say that for sure. The only thing I know for sure is that I need to move on and away from this for my own sanity. I am not sure if that will include my WS or not. This is like the 10th false recovery we have had and I am just numb. I don't believe at this point that he will ever truly appreciate me or if he even knows how to love me. His actions have not been loving but hateful. I told him today that I believe he hates me. That is a cold realization to have about someone you were devoted to. But coming here and reading helps me to see hope. I do not see it in my household but there have been miracles to witness here. I think we just need to heal ourselves with whatever means necessary and worry about the relationship second. We need to be healthy first to be in a healthy relationship. wu

R u my twin? I found out through their emails!!! He never told me anything. He was very loving and protective of her. He flew to Sweden had unprotected sex and she became pregnant so she said. He discussed marriage and even called her by his last name. Yuck. At one point he tried to have her imagine raising one of our girls as their own. Yeah right!!! She would tell me about everything. Rub my face in their dirt. And yet he protected her. Over me. I even bugged the phone and heard conversations, read emails the whole nine yards. The elaborate ways they clung together to try to deceive me. He was in bed with the devil. Oh and she aborted the "twins" she said. And by the way we live in Chicago. wu

What!!! OW tried to become my "Friend" but I had her number. She just wanted me to help her with her relationship with my husband. They are all the same. They believe they are somehow entitled to the relationship. Sometimes, and I feel this strongly-I wish WS had just left. Then I could have moved on with my life. It is much more painful to try to work it out than to just move on. And sometimes I look at him and try to figure out what it is I am working it out for. And mostly the answer is for my daughters. But don't they need a happy mom. What about that?!!! I saw what you wrote to Red. Red is by the book. Sometimes I can't deal with that. wu

Goodnight Jazzy. I'm going to bed. I will keep an eye on you. Take care. wu

Jazzy,

Your comments and feelings are very similar to many here. The 5 stages of grieving show that when there is a sudden major change in our lives (marital discord, divorce, separation, death, loss of job, etc.), each family member can go through these stages. The BS is particularly hit with this. When the recovery starts, often the BS hits that anger phase real hard. Sometimes it causes a separation. That happened to us. WS came back mid April 16, 2001, then he went to jail July 2001. Had a 2 week mandatory separation. It did me good. Of course at the end of that, there was a man on the phone crying to come home with the OW in the background yelling for me to take him back. Imagine that! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Point here is that each of you have some major issues to work out individually and others together. IMHO, you need to work on the individual ones first. Do you have a good MC or can you work with Steve or Jennifer?

Jaz, it is sooo important you do this now. Right now. Let's see if we can get Lor in here. She is great at helping many. She also lived through 6 false recoveries. I have also.

I will tell you that the anger you feel will eventually subside but right now you may not want to know that. You may want to keep that anger in you for fear that once you let him back into your heart, he will do the same again. If so then the trust is lacking and that may be one of you major points to work on.

I recommend you both take the EN questionnaire again. Based on where you are in your R right now. I know you are angry at him. Take a look at the d/d site and look up 'notpeachhinga'. She is a young mother whose WS not only left his family, he kicked her and their 4 year old son out of their new home then moved OW2 into that same home. There's more, he took their son and OW1 on a trip to Disneyworld and the BS found out when her son spilled the beans. Now her WS has been stalking her with visits, calls and e-mails. Does he want her back? Well he is showing her attention but not the right kind. She may be considering a restraining order against him. He has also sent an e-mail of himself and OW2. Talk about being brash!

See Jaz, I don't think you have to deal with that kind of sitch. The fact that the OW is psyco and the fact that your H is trying to show his remorse, maybe helpful. But you have to be at a place in your emotional recovery to appreciate those points.

Now there are stories even worse than Peach's. Won't go there, yet. Just wanted to let you know that I understand what you are going through and also what else is happening out there.

You know when I 1st came to MB there was a thread about getting past our triggers and having a sort of closure ceremony. I went to the ocean and yelled it out. Looked silly but it felt good. Try it.....

Good to see Wuccus checking up on you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

take care,
L.

<small>[ March 31, 2003, 02:25 AM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>