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TM- Our posts must have crossed in the mail! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Do I want to walk away now from what could possibly be the best thing in my life (and protect myself from maybe getting hurt), or do I want to stick out the pain a little longer and be able to walk away later (if necessary) saying that I have done everything I could possibly do? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No. I don't want to walk away. I've been here for 9 months and sincerely want the chance to try to build the best life I could ever have. The dilemma I have is: "What more can I do?" I'm running out of ideas. The only thing I come to is that I have to be me -happy, friendly, and at peace when I live my life. I have to be attractive by being his friend and be flirtatiuos, but at the same time hide my pain. I can only be this by detaching so I don't feel the pain. Quite a dilemma since detaching is what prevents you from feeling loving towards your partener... The scary thought that I came to though is that effectively what I am doing is trying to "tempt" him into having an "A" with me. So I'm troubled because the last thing I want is to be an OW. That is the only way to get him to come out of the fog though... I ask myself what I would do if he asked me to sleep with him or kiss him now. Would my participation in that reinforce in his mind that I will always be a cheater and lie and sneak around. He would be doing this as long as she lived there...I loke to think that I would kiss him passionatley once...to plant seeds. Then I would tell him that I want to work on it, but it couldn't go further unless we had a POJA about her moving out, and a plan in place to work toards recovery... Just random thoughts...
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Hi Kily,
It's hard to believe something will someday happen, but not know how to make it work.
If you continue to get his attention, she will know. She won't stay long term if he continues be interested in you. Can you outlast her?
These are just my thoughts. I don't know everything either. You do have a good coach in cerri, and I would listen to her.
TM had some good words for you, and I think you are following your heart.
That can get us into trouble- many of the WS's on MB followed their hearts into a trap. I don't think it is wrong to want to be with the father of your child, and even though he is interested in someone else, he has not married her. I sometimes think he announced he wanted to marry her just to spite you, but that may be a DJ because I don't know.
You should really think about what you will do if he makes advances in your direction. He need a lot of work, and to be honest, I don't think he is anywhere near ready to be with the Kily that we see here lately. I think it would drive her crazy. I do think that he could grow just as you have grown if he wanted to do so, and if he let you help him.
You need to make that decision now, because it will be to difficult to have a clear head in the middle of it. Think it through, I don't think you are foolish, and I believe you will be careful.
I can't say I know what the outcome will be for you, but I do believe giving it all you have is the right way to go about finding out.
It is interesting to see our children grow, often the lessons they are learning apply to us as well. Your son is afraid of things that he need not be afraid of. He just doesn't realize it yet.
SS
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Kily,
I don't know what you can do for your X. But just take care of yourself and make sure you are making the right choices for YOU. And, listen to SS. He has an unbelievable way of seeing things and placing his thoughts on the screen. You are lucky to have him as a friend!
Good Luck and God Bless
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SS, TM, and all others - SS has asked some very pointed questions and raised points that stab at the heart of my deepest thoughts. Gosh, how do you know me so well? Is it THAT much of a script? If so, I'd love the book that has it recorded. Life would be so much easier - and I suppose a lot less interesting. SS wrote: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If you continue to get his attention, she will know. She won't stay long term if he continues be interested in you. Can you outlast her? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This has been on my mind. What I'm chewing on is that in mind I think she already "knows" that he still holds that connection to me. I know that I would have a hard time living in a house that still had the previous lady's clothes hanging in the closets. I think that deep down in her subconscious, she's already dealing with this. I guess I'm in a place where I don't want to put him in a tug of war. I know how it felt when I was confused and not sure what to believe in. I just want for him to choose me because he "knows" that it's right for him. Not because he's feeling pressured to make a choice. In my mind, I think I've clearly and consistently demonstrated the person that I truly am - Cerri explained it that I grew into the person that I was. It's a completely correct statement. There's nothing more that I could do or say to illustrate that. then SS wrote: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> That can get us into trouble- many of the WS's on MB followed their hearts into a trap. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This has touched something that I started to poke at last week. A few months prior to allowing the EA to start, I knew in my heart that we were stuck. I begged and pleaded and eventually realized that I was clinically depressed and that we were in trouble. God was talking to me then. I heard the message and was afraid. He told me that it was time to go - instead of doing it alone, I leaned on someone to provide emotional support so I could become strong enough to leave. Well, we all know where that led. The end result was exactly what God wanted though. Just with much more pain and complication than was necessary. Now, God is talking to me again. (S)he's <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> telling me that X is now being worked on and that if I wait, we will be together. Am I supposed to be insane enough to believe that this has been a test for both of us? Am i supposed to trust some silly little voice inside that keeps screaming at me that there were lessons that we both needed to learn before we could truly be together? These are the thoughts that I get when I allow myself to listen to the voices. SO, is the voice leading to trouble, to a trap? Or is turning away from it leading to trouble? THAT is where I'm stuck. I feel crazy talking about this. Sometimes I wish I could just turn off the voices. They are a part of me though, and without them I believe that I would not be here today. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You should really think about what you will do if he makes advances in your direction. He need a lot of work, and to be honest, I don't think he is anywhere near ready to be with the Kily that we see here lately. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I agree with all of this. I've been giving it thought lately. I guess I've been thinking about it because I sense that it will happen at some point. I already know what I will do if it does. I will sit with him and be as honest as I can be about my feelings, hopes, and desires. I will tell him that I can't go that route untill we are serious about trying again. If that can't happen, then I will explain why I choose to walk away... I would be willing to help him get there. He needs to be open enough to want me to be there though. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You need to make that decision now, because it will be to difficult to have a clear head in the middle of it. Think it through, I don't think you are foolish, and I believe you will be careful. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My decision is 5 weeks of Plan-A and then a strict Plan-b As Cerri advised. This is really my last efforts. If it doesn't happen, I'm ready to let it all go because I know that I've done everythign I can - Hey haven't I heard that somewhere? It's funny, but I truly mean it and it feels different reading it now, than it did when reading it on someone else's thread. Duh! </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I can't say I know what the outcome will be for you, but I do believe giving it all you have is the right way to go about finding out. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The outcome for me is that I will finally be able to get to closure. with no jealousy, no desire to be in his life, and a real pleasure at living my own life with no doubts or regrets... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It is interesting to see our children grow, often the lessons they are learning apply to us as well. Your son is afraid of things that he need not be afraid of. He just doesn't realize it yet. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, DS has been the biggest blessing and the toughest job that anyone could ever have given me. I am thankful to God for the gifts (S)he's given me through my kids. I am alos thankful for the gifts (S)he's given me with X. I have grown so much from this that it's scary to think that people are still living the way I used to. Thanks. and TM- I am grateful for all of my friends here. Without them, I'd be wandering in the darkness, looking for a light.
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">God was talking to me then. I heard the message and was afraid. He told me that it was time to go - instead of doing it alone, I leaned on someone to provide emotional support so I could become strong enough to leave. Well, we all know where that led. The end result was exactly what God wanted though. Just with much more pain and complication than was necessary.
Am I supposed to be insane enough to believe that this has been a test for both of us? Am i supposed to trust some silly little voice inside that keeps screaming at me that there were lessons that we both needed to learn before we could truly be together? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">WOW! Are you sure your not my wife?!?!?! That is almost word for word what she said just a couple of days ago. Now for my opinion: Your faith is the only thing that will tell you if you are supposed to be insane enough to listen to that little voice inside your head.
I know for my wife and me it has been a long hard road (yes, I know we're not even close to being done yet) but it's worth it. We both had several wake up calls along the way, either one or both of us ignored them. So, in the end he quit giving us wake up calls and dumped a 5 gallon bucket of ice water on our heads.
I see SS's point about following your heart, it has gotten many in trouble and steered them down the wrong path. So, maybe you shouldn't follow your heart; I would say definately don't follow your head (you never know where that's going to take you), instead try following your faith and that inner voice (I refer to it as the "gut").
Last item: Oz once told me to come up with a time line, what would happen when, how long I would stay in Plan A, what would push me to Plan B, etc. I rejected it because I wasn't sure that I understood it. I will say this, have a goal and a plan to get to that goal, but TIME is not always the best way to measure the success or failure of the goal, or the plan. Make sense? I couldn't commit to a specific "timeline", but in my heart I knew when it was "time".
I wish you the best, Good Luck and God Bless.
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TM wrote: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">WOW! Are you sure your not my wife?!?!?! That is almost word for word what she said just a couple of days ago </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess that means that it's the alien living inside us talking by telepathy, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> or we are both sincerely trying to understand something we never will.. Why we lost ourselves completely in order to find ourselves. Why we ignored everything to just feel good about ourselves. Maybe I'm not insane after all. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I just want to committ to something for a deeper purpose because I believe that we deserve a natural family - not one filled with steps and valleys. I want the real thing. I'm tired of playing house. As far as a timeline goes...I'm at the end of my rope...and it's okay. I just fear that once I finally do let go - psychologically speaking, he'll come around and it will be too late... Sadly - He spoke these words to me almost a years ago...and it turned out to be true. I turned around at the same time he let go....and here I am still trying to hang on for the sake of a broken family.
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Kily,
Your the only one who knows when enough is enough. As for him coming around too late, you never know. As I said before, I had given up on my wife, mentally divorced her I guess you could say. That's when she came around. I didn't think I could go back, but here I am. It's funny how things work some times. Just don't hang on so long that you can't get yourself out.
Good Luck and God Bless
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Hi Kily,
I have been away and when I get back I have so much catching up at work and at home that I can't post as much as I would like. I hope it doesn't seem like I don't care.
Gosh, how do you know me so well? Is it THAT much of a script? If so, I'd love the book that has it recorded.
Sometimes I don't feel I can add much, other times the words come to me, and I say them. I do look in on you even when I don't comment.
I guess I'm in a place where I don't want to put him in a tug of war. I know how it felt when I was confused and not sure what to believe in. I just want for him to choose me because he "knows" that it's right for him. Not because he's feeling pressured to make a choice.
If he is in a tug of war, it is by choice. He can let go of the rope any time he wants to. Don't be afraid of trying, he is the father of your son, and he is not married.
Am I supposed to trust some silly little voice inside that keeps screaming at me that there were lessons that we both needed to learn before we could truly be together?
These are the thoughts that I get when I allow myself to listen to the voices. SO, is the voice leading to trouble, to a trap? Or is turning away from it leading to trouble? THAT is where I'm stuck.
I feel crazy talking about this. Sometimes I wish I could just turn off the voices. They are a part of me though, and without them I believe that I would not be here today.
I believe in God, I believe he can communicate with us. I have had so many personal experiences but it's not usually something we would talk about here, because of the personal nature of these types of things. I don't mean to say that you are heading into a trap. I was trying to say we need to use both feeling and logic to get our direction. ( sometimes I don't have enough time to explain as well as I would like to.) If you want to see what will happen, it will either work, or it will not. I believe you are far enough ahead now that you can get through this in good shape. Especially if you plan out how you are going to react. I believe you need to know in advance what your boundaries will be, and you need to keep them. That's what will keep you out of trouble and keep you from getting hurt. Best case, you will marry him, worst case you will know you did your best and you will move on. I don't think you are foolish enough to give yourself away emotionally again without him being willing on his end also, and there is much that he would have to do. So much in fact, that JL seems to be worried about you getting close to him again. I can see from your comments that you intend to be careful. I think you should check this part with cerri as you go along.
I just fear that once I finally do let go - psychologically speaking, he'll come around and it will be too late...
Sadly - He spoke these words to me almost a years ago...and it turned out to be true. I turned around at the same time he let go....and here I am still trying to hang on for the sake of a broken family.
I think you are wise enough to carefully follow your heart. I think God intended us to use both our heads, and our hearts. Life without emotion would not be nearly as rich. Without logic it would be to difficult.
You can enjoy this part you are in now. It doesn't matter what he does, your plan is the same. You can watch human nature, you can enjoy the interaction for what it is, not what you may get from it someday. You can be glad he is not so angry. Don't make a simple thing into more than it is. You are smart enough to know when he is blowing smoke and you need to walk away, and also know when you need to chase opportunity. You can afford some small errors, and they will come - don't worry about them.
Relax, take it easy, have some fun with it. This last little bit was not because you need to be told what to do, it is to reassure you that you are going the right directions and help you trust yourself to continue.
I hope this works, I still pray for you.
( you too TM)
SS
BTW, you are lucky to have TM around, he is a pretty steady hand.
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Kily, Sorry I havent been on in awhile...work has been terrible! I just have one comment right now, because you are getting great advice! </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The dilemma I have is: "What more can I do?" I'm running out of ideas. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Read this sentence aloud several times. Done? What about this question strikes you? You are a Christian...what does this sentence say about your faith? This question has been asked by all of us here. Even today, I catch myself asking myself the same question. Want to know the answer? Okay...here goes... YOU CANNOT DO ANYMORE! You are powerless here to do anything to move your ex in any direction, except away from you. Only God has the power to do this. This is a faith test for you, Kily. No matter how this turns out with your ex, this test is about YOU. How big is your God? How big are your problems? You are out of ideas, because you are trusting in your strength...and that strength is failing. My wife is reading a book now entitled "Winning Your Husband Back Before it is Too Late," by Gary Smalley. There is a great passage in the beginning of Chapter 2. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wait, not until you are first satisfied, fulfilled, and content with being loved by Me can I bring you true love. You see, first you must give yourself totally and unreservedly to Me, discovering that only in Me is your satisfaction to be found. Only then, will you be capable of the perfect human relationship that I have for you. You will never be fully united with another until you are united with Me. Exclusive to anyone or anything else, I want you to stop planning, stop wishing and allow Me to bring it to you. You must keep watching and experiencing the satisfaction that I am, expecting Me to do the greatest of things. Most importantly keep listening and learning the things I show you. Just wait...that's all!! Don't be anxious, and don't worry. Don't look at the things others have received, or that I have given them. You just keep looking at Me, or you will miss what I am teaching you. Then, when you are ready, I will give you love far more wonderful than any you will ever dream about. Most of all, I want you to see in his flesh, a picture of your relationship with Me and enjoy the everlasting union of beauty, perfection, and love that I offer. "Believe it and be satisfied." My daughter, until you are ready---I am working even this moment to have you both ready at the same time. Until you are both satisfied and content with Me and the life I have prepared for you; you won't be able to experience the love that exemplifies your relationship with Me, thus, perfect love.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am fighting this same battle...as are we all. THIS IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE "WHY" OF ALL OF THIS. Kily, please listen. Turn to Him. He will supply ALL of your needs. And when you are ready, He will supply the person that will best fit with you, and provide the rrelationship that will mirror His own love for us. In His arms. <small>[ June 26, 2003, 10:49 PM: Message edited by: Mortarman ]</small>
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SS, TM, Mortarman, and anyone else that cares to join.... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">And, listen to SS. He has an unbelievable way of seeing things and placing his thoughts on the screen. You are lucky to have him as a friend! BTW, you are lucky to have TM around, he is a pretty steady hand </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Come on guys! It's time for a group hug.. {{{{HUG}}}} <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I feel the love... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Sometimes I don't feel I can add much, other times the words come to me, and I say them. I do look in on you even when I don't comment. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, I'll say that when you get them...they are truly inspirational. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If he is in a tug of war, it is by choice. He can let go of the rope any time he wants to. Don't be afraid of trying, he is the father of your son, and he is not married. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm not afraid of trying. I think I'm a little afraid of succeeding now... I wonder at times if he's really interested. Sometimes I believe so, other times I don't. If I were ever to return though, I would need to see him sincerely wanting to grow, He would have to open his mind and heart and I doubt that this will happen. Only He and God will have that answer. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I believe in God, I believe he can communicate with us. I have had so many personal experiences but it's not usually something we would talk about here, because of the personal nature of these types of things. I don't mean to say that you are heading into a trap. I was trying to say we need to use both feeling and logic to get our direction. ( sometimes I don't have enough time to explain as well as I would like to.) If you want to see what will happen, it will either work, or it will not. I believe you are far enough ahead now that you can get through this in good shape. Especially if you plan out how you are going to react. I believe you need to know in advance what your boundaries will be, and you need to keep them. That's what will keep you out of trouble and keep you from getting hurt. Best case, you will marry him, worst case you will know you did your best and you will move on. I don't think you are foolish enough to give yourself away emotionally again without him being willing on his end also, and there is much that he would have to do. So much in fact, that JL seems to be worried about you getting close to him again. I can see from your comments that you intend to be careful. I think you should check this part with cerri as you go along. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">See that is the thing. I was never SURE if it was God, or some split personality inside me. No one talks about it so it's hard to understand. This time, I'm listening to the voices, but I am using my logic instead of just acting. That's why it's so painful. Wouldn't it be easier to just say - Well this didn't work, find someone else to fill the holes.... I am in the middle of formulating that plan right now. I have a pretty good idea of what is going to happen, but I know in my heart what I can and can't accept. My questioning phase has changed a bit and now instead of working through guilt and shame, I'm working on my morales, goals, and boundaries. I already know that I did my best. I realize that it is in X's hands. At this point, I'm really okay either way. He would never have said that he loved me if this weren't the case. JL doesn't have to worry . I will never let myself fall into THAT trap again. Young grasshopper has learned well. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think you are wise enough to carefully follow your heart. I think God intended us to use both our heads, and our hearts. Life without emotion would not be nearly as rich. Without logic it would be to difficult. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think this is one of the biggest lessons I have learned so far. Emotions used to rule everything I did. The hardest thing for me to do was to learn how to step back and feel what I feel, then once I've gotten through that, to think about what I felt and try to understand the WHY behind it. Most of the time, I am able to get clarity and 80% of the time I see that my initial reaction was the wrong approach. No it doesn't matter what he does anymore. I have love for him that will always be in my heart. I'm not living day to day wondering when he'll be back. I'm pretty happy being me. I don't need him to have an identity. I want him there as my friend. If he doesn't want that - it really is his loss. Thanks for checking on me. Mortarman is next-
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Hey K, Just wanting to let you know I'm following your thread and thinking of you. This could be me, too, when you said, </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Emotions used to rule everything I did. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">How true my dear one. We have learned so much, haven't we? Take care, H_P
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H_P!!!
I'm sitting here at my desk at work drinking strawberry margarita's and thinking...Wow, we've come so far! Here's to you...
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Margaritas today, is it???
Sheesh, I need to come work for YOUR company!
ALS
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Yes they have one of those icee machines that you find at the local convinience stores. We have two kinds!!! Lime and Strawberry Guess which is my favorite! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
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My god, I'd be drunk all the time.
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Drinking on the job? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> or are you studying to become a barfly? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
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Oh No! It;s the Coffee Guy- Everybody HIDE~~ We dont' need to be sobered up right now sir...thanks anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I work for a start up company. They do allow you to drink at your desk. THey basically traet you as an adult. You can drink, but if you're caught drunk- you're fired...yes, they even supplied the alcohol. Believe it or not, the fridge is stocked with all kinds of beers, and even some tequilla, vodka, and various mixed beverages too.... Not too shabby. The personnell director was out there with us for a while. My lips are numb. Time to go get some more..
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,261
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,261 |
ALS- You're only 6 hours away. If you leave now, you could get here by 8....no one else will be here, but there's planty left! I'll be sure to leave it for you! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,950
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,950 |
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by kily: I work for a start up company. They do allow you to drink at your desk. THey basically traet you as an adult. You can drink, but if you're caught drunk- you're fired...yes, they even supplied the alcohol. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Better not give the name of the company because it sounds like a liability attorney's wet dream. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,261
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,261 |
No- I wouldn't do that... It's a pretty cool perk (Spelled that wrong at first came out as prek). I'm not one to drink - but it is nice to have one once in a while. This got out of hand though. They lifted the loading dock door and brought a truck over for music. We had the grill going with burgers and dogs. Lasted about 1 1/2 hours. I think they do it to boost morale or something. Lord knows in this economy they have to do something. It's actually not bad though. Rarely do we get anyone that takes advantage of it. I know that it's nice when you're working a lot of overtime when a boss comes over and hands you a beverage with a comment like: "Here you worked hard, have one on me..." and about wet dreams....I'm tipsy so I won't go there.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <small>[ June 27, 2003, 01:08 PM: Message edited by: kily ]</small>
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