Then the pure emotional reaction I read here is so unlike you. Except... where have I seen this all-or-nothing-thinking before.

Myrta, I've tried to help you see that this isn't an all-or-nothing situation. You seem to ignore that this man is going to out you, ESPECIALLY if you ignore him. You see your husband as the bad guy. Gee. Where have I seen this before? Oh yeah. I remember a very very long thread where your husband wasn't warming to your ending the affair with instant forgetfulness....

Myrta, you still have growing required of you. And people who tell you the straight and painful truth aren't your enemies, don't want your family harmed, and don't want you humiliated.

But you can't see that. And you can't see who your true enemy is.

I hope that someday, when the fire burns itself out, that you can see Stanley was right and that it was ok for you to be wrong. That you could have trusted him AND your parents to love you for everything you are, imperfections, disappointments and strengths and all. Your children can only admire that you have done the right thing after making mistakes. A tremendous strength for them down the road.

As long as you remember that you love them more than you feel pain and want to avoid more at this juncture right now.

Doing the right thing isn't the worst thing you can do. Doing the right thing the wrong way could be.

This has been said before, but it seems to me to be good advice:

Myrta's parents are the only ones who can stop the OM from visiting them. They can do so simply by telling him he's not welcome. Of course, they aren't likely to do that until they know about the affair.

I liken this situation to blackmail. It's only effective as long as there is a secret that the person being blackmailed does not want to be uncovered. Once the secret is revealed...the blackmailer loses all of his power.

The answer to defusing this situation is exposure. It won't be easy or pleasant of course. But..it seems to me that it's the only way to really put an end to this situation.

Hmm----- my wife and I don't want exposure. I think OM knows this quite well as my wife discussed this with him during and affair. Myrta keeps telling me that OM is simply reacting like CC did. Myrta believes OM has no plans to reveal the affair to anyone-------------- She is 100% certain of this. I hope she is correct and that perhaps OM simply wants to maintain some sort of connection by using her family back home. But, even then I cannot understand this behavior in any man who wishes to call himself a man. This type of behavior is irrational at best and perhaps OM is very foggy. In fact the plans OM had for Myrta once she left the marriage were true fantasy---- Disneyland material. In this regard I am sure my wife agrees. Perhaps OM is very foggy and in deep withdrawal.

I must also repeat that Myrta has been a trooper and has given 100% of herself to the marriage despite early withdrawal, fog, and so on. She is truly doing the best she can and I do not doubt her motives.

ANDREW---There is no way in hell that I could tell my parents of my affair. They think I am the only "different" one of the family. I will kill literrary my mom if I would reveal my affair.
She has heart condition, diabetes, high blood pressure,etc,etc. I am not going to kill her before her time.
I am 100% sure that the OM will not expose me to them. He is just in a pitiful state right now. He is feeling sorry for himself, and he is trying to keep some contact with "waht it was"!!!

Myrta

Myrta,

I understand the bind that you are in.

Maybe there is a way to accomplish this without exposing the affair.

Can you simply tell your mom that you'd prefer that she had no more contact with this guy? If she asks why...just tell her that for personal reasons you are uncofomfortable.

Again, I know that you don't want to expose. But unless your parents take the iniative to let this guy know that he is unwelcome, he's probably not going to stop.

I think someone else here theorized this, and I agree. The OM seems like he is baiting you. Because, ultimately he would like to happen is for you YOU to contact him and tell him to back off. That would re-open a door for him to talk to you and try to bring you back to the dark side.

I know that you want to see his motives in a positive light. I think that is admirable. But...try to put on the hat of the skeptic. Assume the worst in this case. Assume that he IS up to something.

Obviously, I don't your OM. But...I do know a couple of people who WERE OMs...and I know my wife's OM pretty well. There is a good chance that this is a trap, Myrta - that the aim is to get YOU to break NC, even if only to tell him to stop.

My wife and I had this issue. The OM seemed to be baiting her with some of the things he was telling his wife about their relationship - knowing that those things would get back to me.

She got pretty pissed at him and considered calling him to chew him out. But, she thought better of it, becuase she didn't want to open any doors for possible contact.

Okay....um....why not the family about the money?

Tell them that the OM borrowed money he now knows he can not pay back, and he's trying to be "creepy nice-nice" to make up for it??

That would explain the increased contact, and also sort of explain M&S's discomfort with the contact.

People can be really, really funny about money issues, sometimes even more so than emotional issues.

I dunno...just offering a possibilty here.

ANDREW A---Yes, you might be right, the OM could be baiting me, but I am not falling for it. My husband in the other hand did!! I think that if you completely ignored his efforts, he will see that he has no power over us. But by making big waves of his actions "so far" from us, we give him power.

CAT LOVER- Your suggestion is a really good one indeed. I could tell that to my parents, and they probably see him under a different light.
I will give it some thought, thank you.

Thank you both!!!

Myrta

I haven't read all the responses on this thread, but I think you're missing a tremendous opportunity, Myrta.

Your older kids probably already know what took place. Maybe not the details, but enough.

You can come clean with them and your folks and at the same time profess your regret and humbleness and dedicate yourself to your family.

Their love for you is unconditional. In time, they will admire you for your integrity.

Admitting a mistake, learning its lessons, taking responsibility, and demonstrating growth. That's integrity.

WORTHATRY--No, you are wrong, my kids dont have a clue of anything wrong with their dad and I. My husband is always giving a "show" in front of them, of "love" of "desire" of everything!!! My kids think that we have always had a perfect marriage. They have no clue!!

But like I said in my earlier post, I will expose myself to them and that will be it. I am sure they are not going to admire me ,but I will do it.
I am trying to spare my husband more than myself with them. But if that the right and honorable thing, I should do it. But I will not tell my parents, no way!!

Myrta

Stanley and Myrta:

First, congrats on all the progress the 2 of you have made. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Next, Please Understand:
By NOT reveling to the parents you ARE giving the OM all the POWER he could ever need or Want (concerning YOU, your family and your situation).

By continuing to "play" the secrecy "game" with this OM......you are by default giving him Power over your lives. (Including your parents, who have NO IDEA that they are even in this powerstruggle).

Unfortunately, These "Other men" are just better at this type of behavior then your Normal Person.

They relish in these type of games.....they THRIVE in this type of environment.

I TOO at first tried to "out secret" the OM........but I failed (because HE was just soooooo much better at it then I will ever be).

By playing HIS "game", alI I got was the police called on me ....He had my wife's employer ready to Fire her and on and on.

My keeping the "secret" was the BEST Thing I could Do for him.
I was doing him a great favor.....Doing Exactly what he wanted from me.....keeping HIS secrets.

As a result, He just created stories and explanations that worked for him and Against US!

The ONLY weapon I had that He had NO Defense for..... was the "Truth".

Once I finally used it (to OM/ WW employer) this man went out NOT with a bang....but a Huge whimper.

Take the advise:
Reveal this secret and TAKE Back your Power from this OM.

UNTIL you Do So........he will Stay in control of (at least part) or your lives.

Exposing him is the ONE certain way to REMOVE him from your lives... Completely.

If He won't leave you alone voluntarily....then you OWE it to your Spouse, your M and your Family to Remove him yourself.

The great news is this:
All you have to do is to Tell the Truth, to accomplish this goal.
As you have made a commitment to be "more honest" then this should only help you continue down this path.
Remember that "lies" by omission...are Still Lies!

Don't let the OM be the one to tell your parents.
(Hey it could happen in his last ditch attempt to "hurt" you one last time in a scorched earth policy).
Yes, maybe not today....but certainly in time.

Also, why have this threat hanging around your neck (until the OM) decides to drop the news??
NO, take his choices away from him.

In addition, this OM being involved with your family will ONLY hinder any and all progress that you and your spouse will be attempting to make.
Don't let something as simple as pride let this OM continue to destroy or impeade your M recovery!

Let the secrets OUT ....so that you can get back to Living and being happy and healthy!

I wish you success in getting up the courage and resolve to take this (although uncomfortable), highly Necessary Step.
Take care <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ December 29, 2004, 09:40 AM: Message edited by: top rope ]</small>

A little background. My FWW and my entire family were stalked by OM. In our case the cops wouldn't take it seriously, his nicy nicy act turned to threats which eventually by shear manipulation and persistence wore my FWW down, she ran off with him where he promtly beat her.

Extreme case yes but a stalker is not a nice guy. You don't know what he is capable of and he probably doesn't either. Through our ordeal research revealed to me that ALL stalking is dangerous, some more than others.

By it's very nature stalking is dangerous because of CONTACT. If a stalker simply watched from afar it wouldn't be that big of a deal but that isn't where it stops. Contact is made to elicit some response. They do not care if it is negative or positive they just want a response.

My inclination, like the guy on here with the size 9 boot, was to take my size twelves over to OM's house and that just got a 9MM pulled on me.

I also tried to appeal to his good nature. When I told him he was terrifying my little girl and tearing our family apart he laughed.

I got a lawyer. Your options are limited and only as good as the law enforcement agency that handles whatever piece of paper you have. For us we had a no contact order, a personal protective order, and a restraining order in place and it didn't even slow him down.

I'm telling you many of the things you've said are things FWW's OM did. He contacted her parents, be careful here because pretty soon he'll be making Stan-ly out to be the bad guy to them.

He contacted my children. At first he gave them gifts or attempted to, then he started following them and trying to get them in his jeep. Things can turn in a hurry. Don't take my word for it. Do some research, what you will find is that STALKING IS DANGEROUS!!!! PERIOD!!

I don't know how much you need to expose about the A itself although I am a huge proponent of honesty, but I think you need to make everyone involved aware that this is not a nice guy and they need to distance themselves from him. He craves that contact and as I said no one knows what he will do to maintain it. Stan-ly this means you too. As tempting as it is you are feeding his craving when you contact him. You can not reason with him stalkers are not men of reason and beating him will only put you in jail which leaves your entire family vulerable.

To the FWW, our OM ended up outing my FWW to her family but told them it was because I was being abusive to her and he was her knight in shining armour. Neither of which was remotly acurate. I know you are probably thinking yeah this could never happen to us but we thought the same thing. Right up until OM beat the crap out of FWW she defended him saying he would never actually do anyone any harm. She seldom comes on here but if you have any questions she goes by Mrs. E.

Best of luck to you both.

<small>[ December 29, 2004, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: Mr. E ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Myrta:

But like I said in my earlier post, I will expose myself to them and that will be it. I am sure they are not going to admire me ,but I will do it.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Initially they may not, but if you've been a good ,loving mother to them there's more than a good chance that they will not only forgive you but will respect you for trying to make amends to their father for your extremely bad choice.

As far as your parents are concerned, I do not know if they were good, loving and understanding parents to you and your siblings but if they were, then you may be underestimating the power of their love and forgiveness for you. So please, give this some very serious thought.

You are NOT defined by your affair but by the vast history you've shared with your H and children. The time of your affair is NOTHING compared with the time you have been a good W and mother. Never forget this.

TMCM

<small>[ December 29, 2004, 10:04 AM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

Well for all the advice from us all, in the end this is a classic POJA decision for Myrta & Stanley no one else.

I do really think the OM is trying to suck Myrta into contacting him, I have no doubt about it.

Myrta please take this in the spirit it is given, the OM is NOT being harmless he's trying to blackmail you so you will contact him.
Like a snake getting into the backyard, he's trying to get into your backyard - the family so he can have some control over you.

No matter what dont contact him.

Stanley you have just wasted your time writing to this guy. He does not care about YOU, about YOUR family, he ONLY cares about himself and HIS desires.

NO ONE ELSE MATTERS.

Even so it still is your decision guys and you need to consider what it means to you either way.
My only solid advice is that neither of you allow the OM to set the sgenda for you two.

Well, I guess i made a mistake. I sent OM a very nice email with no insulting remarks and I tried to appeal to his sense of integrity and honesty. I even let him know that the affair had cause tremendous pain and that my world had ended on D-day. I felt that perhaps he had one good bone in his body and back down.

Time will tell if I was right or not. If he contacts again then I will have my answer.
In any event OM has caused a bad argument between me and my wife. Too bad---- I hate that. If he wanted a response he certainly got one. I still hope this guy has a sense of honor in him. Myrta thinks he does. We will see.

However, there is no doubt he is showing stalker like behavior. My daughters think it is creepy that OM IMs and then says nothing. They have started to ask my wife about this activity.

Forgot to mention this:

OM asked mother in law about my wife. My mother in law said we were a VERY HAPPY couple and that I bought Myrta a new car for Xmas. I am not sure how OM received the news. Perhaps he was hoping for something else.

Is there a chance that the information "that we are doing great as a couple" may cause OM to back away?

Stanley,

I feel sorry for you and Myrta, having to go through this hurdle. If your OM is like me, then I believe he's just trying to reach out for some communication. He's still a lost soul, who's in depression. Sad! I never wanted to "out" my ex to her H or to her family, even though I threatened it a few times. I'd never do that. What she did though, makes sense to me now. It was her fear that I'd out her, and she was protecting her family and her parents, so I'm SURE that she told them what she had to (maybe that I was crazy or a "stalker"??) and instructed them not to answer any calls and refuse my mail. Simple as that. So, I can't communicate with them. I *did* try, but it was just to check on her, not to out her.

So, can't you and Myrta do the same? Just cut off communication?

CC

Stanley-

I didn't see your last post until now. As a FOW to my ex, I'd say that no matter what I heard about her status with her H, it would hurt. If I heard that they weren't doing well, I'd figure she'd want to contact me, and if she didn't, I'd be sad. If I heard that she and her H were doing well, I'd be sad too (and in disbelief!). So, there's no good outcome here...

CC

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Stan-ley:
<strong>Is there a chance that the information "that we are doing great as a couple" may cause OM to back away? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Maybe.

But it's also a chance that he'll conclude that Myrta is still pulling the wool over everybody's eyes and she'll come running any minute. Do not underestimate the creativity of a delusional mind.

Short term fixes mean long term problems. Kill the beast > the truth will set everyone free.

WAT

WORTHATRY= Why would his conlussion be that I am putting the wool over everyones eyes?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />
Why should that be his conclussion???

Are you sure you are not a bit delusional yourself???

Myrta

Buttercup:

It seems you identify with this OM quite a bit.


Did it bother you to know that your OW and H were doing OK? Why would that be the case?

Did you pressure her to leave the marriage? OM pressured Myrta big time into leaving the marriage.

Did you want the marriage of your OW to end?

When did you finally get the message that it was time to stay away? The letter from the lawyer?

What does OM GET by stalking my daughters on the internet?

What specific gratification OMs gets from talking to my in-laws and by having lunch with Myrta's brother?

Do you honestly believe OM is hurting that much after seven moths (d-day)?

Do you realize that his plan for Myrta if she left the marriage was to have her work as a cook in a restaurant that he was going to open named after her? Neither of them have any experience in the restaurant business!

Do you think OM may be delusional? Did you know he pretended my children were his children? He also pretended Myrta was his wife when calling from the airplane every-time he landed in our city. He would them tell those around him he was notifying the wife he was back in town.

Did you know he never thought he was having an affair?

Did you know he claims to be the CEO of a big private business and yet has to work part-time as a ticket maid with the police department to make ends meet? He is a single man and his kids are grown! Had to borrow money from my wife!

I would certainly appreciate your insight!