Dr Harley's original Plan B letter in the book places the emphasis on the continued affair being too painful for the BS to endure, and that this is why contact must cease. There is a tone of great sorrow that it has come to this.

It does not convey the impression that the BS is saying that they will wait for the WS - and certainly not for as long as it takes. It does not give the WS permission to go off and have fun while the BS waits. It's much more a case of "if you ever think that you can put me first again, maybe we can talk".

I hope you didn't alter the letter to the extent that its tone was changed.

I'd rather not post it but 98% of it is still just like the sample, just some names added and a couple tweaks to wording to fit the situation.

I guess to me and others it kind of reads like she will know she's still getting to me and has some kind of control. Hopefully not...but what's done is done and I'm staying dark.

I don't see how it can read like that. How will she know she is getting to you (indeed, the way you write it, she can actually "get to you") or have any kind of control if you are dark?

Telling her I still love her and other wording, family says it just looks like it would make her think she's still got me on a hook and could reel me in at any time. I can see what they're saying...

It doesn't really matter whether she (or others) think that is the case. All that matters is that you have been clear that if there is to be any hope of reconciliation, her affair must end, and until that happens you will not be having any contact with her.

Should the affair end, and should she seek to discuss the continuation of your marriage, you will decide afresh at that point whether you can entertain the idea of recovery or not. If not, it will be much easier for you to end the marriage since you won't have had contact with her for some time. Whether she thinks she has you on a hook right now is irrelevant; all that matters is that you won't be in contact with her while the affair continues.

I suppose that makes sense enough, it has been far easier to have had no contact for a good month now...sanity preserved.

I so agree with SugarCane. If you’re in a dark Plan B and have absolutely no contact with her then she has no idea what you’re doing. If you break NC then she will of course think you are trying to have contact and this showing her you “are still on the hook”. That’s why it is so important for you to stay completely dark.

Yeah I'm staying dark...it's hard though, one day at a time.

Is it normal for a WS to get super cruel and vindictive during an A when they've never been like that before?

Same with acting like they're doing you a favor letting you go and telling just that and for you to move on?

Yes very much so and they will rewrite marital history to fit their narrative.

That’s why they say that it’s like an alien takes over the WS and is very different acting.

I can't believe she had the nerve after over a month to ask our son to talk to me on the phone today about something to do with my daughter and school.

I'd made it clear I wouldn't and my kids have told her they won't play messenger for her.
Wonder if she got my Plan B letter...should have yesterday or today in the mail.

The thought alone gave me anxiety and I just kept telling my son "No no no!"...uggh

If she wanted to talk to you about the 11 year-old, she might have had something legitimate to say. That is why Dr Harley recommends that you use an intermediary. Your wife would be told (in the Plan B letter) that she is only to try and reach you via the intermediary, and only for urgent, important issues. Your intermediary must be told what she wants to say and will only pass on messages that fit your "urgent" criterion - they filter out spam and nonsense. If she tries to ask what time the school concert begins, that message is not passed on. A message saying that your wife is ill and cannot get to school to do the pick-up would be passed on.

Indeed, your children should not play messenger for her, but without an intermediary, what happens when she has a legitimate reason for contacting you?

So will you be getting an IM now?

I may have to consider it, but she's moved a considerable distance away(hour drive) and barely sees them as it is, couple hours at a time a couple times now.

The requested talk was about the 17 year old, for something I'm already well aware of and handling(she was sick 2 days and school didn't handle the absence correctly).
I need to go in and change contact details with the school, I work 2 minutes down the road from school and they have no reason to contact her over me anymore, she was the primary contact and I secondary while together simply because she was always far more accessible. I've since changed my shift at work and am just as accessible now.

Not sure what legitimate reason she'd have given the situation, and I haven't bothered with an IM as a result, but if contact continues for things that are irrelevant or she should know full well she can't handle anyway I guess I may have to, thought the month without any at all would stay that way and I guess I was wrong.

I found myself an IM that has informed her that any contact goes through them now and is to only be about relevant things involving the kids such as when she plans to visit with them, and that she is not to communicate through the kids.

So she refuses to use IM and just tells the kids what her plans are, which she's cancelled anyway again recently.

She told a 3rd party though that she "doesn't love me anymore and wants a divorce ASAP by any means necessary".
She's well aware the only way to get that here before a year separated is by filing on grounds of adultery, which she flipped out about last time.

Good news though is I finally have an appointment in a week with my lawyer to get the ball rolling on custody and support.

Do your kids want to give you her messages or does it annoy them?

Glad you will see your lawyer.

They'll only tell me when she plans on coming to see them at this point, if there's been anything else they don't tell me anymore.

I think the no contact for months now has given me quite a bit of clarity, in that I'm done...I cannot put my kids through this again if she did come crawling back. The lies, the gaslighting, the bogus charges which btw were finally dropped thanks to the evidence I provided that I was told was the main consideration showing nothing but vindictive behaviour.

My love blinded me to everything she had been doing that caused our kids harm, and I foolishly even gave her a second chance and rug swept too much for it to even work.

While I was away for a week to try and defuse things back in June, she had tried alienating them from me by telling them I was abandoning them, that I was leaving because I wanted other women. Telling me to stay gone and to never speak to HER kids again. They didn't fall for any of it, I'd sat them all down and told them I was coming back and just trying to defuse things and cool things off.

Yelled and screamed at our oldest two when they left the home while I was gone, due to her behaviour after I'd left where the kids told me she just flipped out. Telling our oldest daughter that she was a whore because she had a boy pick her up with my permission to get her out of the situation, screaming at our son that he was "Leaving us just like your [censored] father" when he packed his bags to go stay with a friend.
The neglect while I was at work, not making any dinner for weeks on end and doing basically nothing with them or for them, while carrying on with her little boyfriend on her phone constantly or going out.

Taunting me in the home while our youngest was present about the OM where she could hear it, carrying on the phone in the home with OM where the kids could hear while I was at work, accusing ME of going out to see other women when I would go out to hang out with friends to preserve my sanity.

No, I'm done...the love is gone and the kids don't need shown that allowing yourself to be walked all over is ok. I'm leaving the divorce to her to file and pay for, I never wanted my marriage or family to implode so why should I file?
However on Wednesday I have my appointment with my lawyer, and a laundry list of horrible things she's done and said to or around the children during all of this, and will be pushing for sole custody.

Glad that the false charges were dropped. Is anything going to happen to her for filing false charges?

I understand the clarity you are having and that is one thing that Dr. Harley says, NC protects the BS from the continue abuse and pain the WS does.

Are you going to ask your lawyer if you should file or not? I understand that sometimes the first to file has some benefits to filing?

Do your kids want you to file for full custody?

I don't think anything will come of it against her for the charges but that wouldn't be up to me or even necessarily disclosed to me.

Can't file until a year separated unless for infidelity, and I can't be bothered fighting that or going through the hassle. There are no benefits, the only asset we share at this point is the house and I'll be putting that up for sale next year anyway and she can have her half.

The kids are aware I'm going for sole custody and understand why and agree, my intent is only to remove any avenue she has of being further vindictive in co-parenting.