Dhorne,<P>Let me clarify, the information I was referring to, I can't remember the exact place I got it, I want to say it was Private Lies by Dr Pittman. It has a lot of statistics. He took a sample of 500 people I think and goes through and gives the stats on what happened with all. The stats helped me because I want answers. I am positive I didn't see it at this site. I will try and find it. Then again, realize all situations have different elements to them. We all feel the same fears, despair and anguish as the betrayed, and it sounds like most betrayers all feel the guilt. But each relationship has different aspects that makes us all a little different, and our outcomes as well. Please don't lose your hope in what I said, I would feel bad about that. Read that book though, it is good.<P>Firestorm - Thank you for your honest reply. I really appreciate it, I bet its hard to come forward and say some of that, as you must relive a little of it just in retelling the story. You sound like you and your wife, have a wonderful chance at a great marriage together, and I wish you both the best.<P>TimHill - I guess thats the one place where you and I are different, with the best friend, that is awful. Other than that, I too have 3 kids. And my H is threatening me and holding money just to take the kids. If you read any of my other posts from this past week, you can see the horror I am living. <P>Let me tell you this, the OW in my case, lives in a townhouse, two bedroom. She works all week and pawns her son off on her mom cause "she's tired". Guess what, my three kids are gonna give her a run for their money and on top of it, they get kids shoved in their face all day with my daycare so this little boy has his work cut out for him. Also, should he be mean to my kids dad, I am sure that will create tension too. <P>I have been talking to some family and they all say the same thing. WHen the kids get involved in the mix, and the bills pile on, the day to day grind becomes the OW/OM reality, the affair loses all spice REAL QUICK!!! I hate the fact that my kids may be the breaking point eventually, but if so, GOD BLESS THEM. They are wonderful kids. But my H's mom, had them with H for 2 weekends, she cooked, cleaned, bathed, slaved, cleaned poop and vomit and she was beat. After 2 weekends, she said NO MORE. She also said that this OW will not last because she is real selfish. My kids own grandma couldn't handle it (no young grandma, 45) and she wanted to know what about my life I liked so much. I have since learned that my mother in law is a lot like OW. But MIL did say the relationship won't last 3 months with all the kids involved. <P>I do not agree that the kids see OW/OM so soon (see one of my posts) in your case, even worse, they must surely know the other friend, correct?<P>And I wish I could find an H who cooks, cleans and does all that!! <P>The only thing that bothers me, is the stats for affair lengths. Some are very brief, yet there is one woman on here that has been in this for 4 years. That scares me because shouldn't the fantasy wear off before then? <P>Today I am so confused and overwhelmed.<P>Yesterday I went to bed thinking, I am going to be ok, i don't even miss him . I had dreams of HIM AND HER all night and woke up crying. This morning I was in a lot of pain. I heard his voice today and felt disgust and now I am confused about everything. This rollercoaster is just too much for me.<P>Thanks to all who have replied, you guys have really helped me get through the day today!! What will I do when I can't sign on all day long!

lonelymom,<P>Don't count on the kids necessarily having a negative impact on their relationship. My kids' lack of perfection is apparently bothering my H's OW, and the result is that he is seeing less of the kids. He told the kids that if any of them didn't behave, he would bring them all home, and he told me that he would do whatever was necessary to preserve the atmosphere (presumably of relative tranquility) that the OW is used to. I think it is a mistake to assume that the betrayer will ever put his relationship with the kids before his relationship with the OW - after all if that were the case, he would never have left.<P>One has to remember that for the betrayer, the only thing that matters is hanging onto the relationship with the OW/OM. Kids, other relatives, matter not one bit.

I just wanted you to know that I read your posting and feel somewhat foolish about my own little predicament when you have been through so much. My heartfelt sympathy to you and your children. You are so strong and obviously very giving of yourself despite your pain. Thank you for your supportive messages to me and good luck to you.<P>G

Just wanted you to know I read your posting and feel rather foolish about my own problems - but you are clearly a very giving despite your pain. I want you to know I wish you well.<P>G

Tim Hill:<P>You should start a new thread with your story You will get more replies. It's kinda of buried here in lonelymoms thread.<P>Sorry for your situation

Hi lonelymom,<BR>I just got thru reading your post, and the replies, and am answering your call for the betrayers to come forward. I don't know how much help I can be though; in my case, I wanted the stupid affair to end almost from the day it started... It lasted about 3 months and was pretty irregular, and there was never ANY thought of leaving my W for the OW.<BR>Make sure you check with your lawyer about the interim custody thing before you act on it. But as far as having young'uns going off to visit OW- I can understand why you would want to oppose that. You don't know this woman and based on the amount of time your H has known her, she is for all intents and purposes, a stranger. Furthermore, depending on the age of the kids, this may be setting a very bad example. It's one thing for a marriage to break up and two people to move on with their lives but to give the impression that it's ok to hop from one relationship to another, in my opinion is bad. I really don't know though... I try to be impartial and give good advice, but this is a sticky one for me. If they do last (ugh... sorry ) the children do have a right to a relationship with their Dad, and that may (hope not) include another woman. Well, so much for clear advice... sorry - perhaps I'm not the best to tackle this issue...<BR>On to your questions... I had major guilt and it turned me into a liar and a [censored]. I was definatly acting out of character... throughout the EMA and especially the first few days after disclosure. My priorities completely bescrewed (can I say that word here?) I have read about and can understand how guilt can wreak havoc on a persons behaviour and think that could probably be applied in your case.<BR>I agree with what has been posted before, that your H is living in a fantasy land, and that eventually the mirage will come crashing down; probably fairly soon too, if this thing did really start in December.<BR>If you do decide to let H take the young'uns for the weekend, you definately have the right to know exactly where they will be staying (check with your lawyer) and have a phone number in case you need to get in touch with them (or H).<BR>Take things one day at a time... keep your cool. But, as others have posted, don't allow yourself to be a doormat. There's a lot to be said for plan A, but I think that self respect is immensely important.<BR>I hope that this disjointed post helped, at least a little... if you have more questions, ask away. I will follow the thread and help in any way that I can.<BR>Deut

Deut<P>Thank you for your reply. Yes as far as I know and believe in my heart (as we were inseperable) in started mid December, he claims he met her 3 days before xmas, I still don't believe it.<P>I found out today HE has been brainwashing the kids all along, and accusing me of it. He told them the ONLY way he could see them is at his house with Laura. Poor kids, so every phone call for 2 weeks is "when am i gonna see you". Well my oldest finally gave in. When I asked her why, after I fought because she said NO, she said, daddy said that was the only way. I was ready to scream. HOw dare he brainwash and play mind games on our innocent kids, three daughters no less. I am disgusted. He agreed to give me the address to get his visitation, but I know the lawyer told him the law yesterday. To avoid a LB I kept quiet. I can see myself saying to hell with Plan A, and giving up quite soon. <P>I wish I had one of those H's that would have never left the house, or had real intentions to leave his W. Instead I get the one who ups , leaves, and steals, cheats, and tricks to get his way.<P>I can't wait til the money comes out of his check, and the IRS is after him so he can have his world crash like mine is. <P>I hope you have guessed right and that this is almost over. He sent an email to my best friend today asking if she was still talking to him. She let him HAVE it. I and she know he is looking for info. She is going to be very vague and see what the heck he wants. He basically is on to me, about last Saturday night (thanks to neighbors, who call him the second I get in , my phone is ringing.) so I am sure he heard there was a car here last weekend . Oh well, I still don't feel guilt yet. I probably lost my mind and thats why.<P>Thanks to all for replies, you all gave me some peace today.

you wrote:<P>I wish I had one of those H's that would have never left the house, or had real intentions to leave his W. Instead I get the one who ups , leaves, and steals, cheats, and tricks to get his way.<P>Well, I know this is the Marriage BUILDERS site, and I'll probably get a lot of slack for what I'm about to say, but when there's kids involved I get a little fanatical! <P>In anycase, my advice is not to worry so much about the LBs, the kids welfare is of utmost priority. It is wrong of him to poison them against you or feed them a load of crap. Infact it is called 'alienation' and can be brought up in a court of law. (check with your lawyer, as always)<P>Please keep us (well, me) up to date on this thread. I've got alienation probs with my ex and our son so, this topic is of particular interest for me.<P>In anycase, advice aside, I'm rootin' for ya!!!<P>(Dern it, where are the 'rootin' for ya' smilies when you need them?!?!)<P>Deut

I know we all have different problems yet we are all in so much pain. I didn't mean to offend by wishing my H was one of those guys who at least stick around the house. Don't get me wrong, I see the pain for all the W's on the forum in that state too. I just feel like OW has the best of MY LIFE and I don't like it.<P>I have not heard what you are talking about, can't even remember the word, so beat right now, but I WILL be looking into it, thanks!<BR>